[_ Old Earth _] Is evolutionism compatible with the Bible?

[Cygnus]

Like much of Genesis, the metaphor was not meant to be taken literally.

Ever wonder why the metaphor of Genesis has never been explained?

 

[Barbarian]

Try here:

https://www.amazon.com/Literal-Mean...r=8-5&keywords=the+literal+meaning+of+genesis

 

[Cygnus]

Try here:

https://www.amazon.com/Literal-Mean...r=8-5&keywords=the+literal+meaning+of+genesis

That was no help...just a picture and a price tag.

 

[Barbarian]

Lots of people own books, and they do no good.

You have to read them.

 

[Cygnus]

Why don't you tell us a little?

 

[Edward]

Ever wonder why the metaphor of Genesis has never been explained?

Because it's literal? That's how I figure it. When I started reading Genesis with a literal eye, so many things clicked into place and made sense to me then. Those things later in scripture.

People keep telling me that it's a metaphor but they can't explain it when I ask what it is. I think the reason they refuse to read Genesis literally is that it creates cognitive dissonance. It just blows their world belief system out of the water and that's too much to handle for them.

If you want to understand the NT, then you have to understand Genesis.

 

[Cygnus]

Because it's literal? That's how I figure it. When I started reading Genesis with a literal eye, so many things clicked into place and made sense to me then. Those things later in scripture.

People keep telling me that it's a metaphor but they can't explain it when I ask what it is. I think the reason they refuse to read Genesis literally is that it creates cognitive dissonance. It just blows their world belief system out of the water and that's too much to handle for them.

If you want to understand the NT, then you have to understand Genesis.

I have to agree...it blows their world belief system out of the waters. Genesis is relaced with old earth evolutionism...at the expense of understood theology.

 

[Jim Parker]

People keep telling me that it's a metaphor

It's not a metaphor.
Gen 1:1-2:3 is the genealogy of the heavens and the earth.
It is the introduction to God's self-revelation beginning with forming man from the dust (elements) of the earth at Gen 2:4. It is the beginning of the revelation of the works of the LORD by which He has provided for eternal life, united with God in Christ.

 

[Zackuth]

I don't believe that evolution is compatible with Scriptures.

When we read about the six day creation, the Hebrew word "yom" is used for day, and yom is a single 24 hour period. Reading the creation story we have six yoms or six consecutive 24 hour days. You can't squeeze 10.8 billon years into 144 hours.

When God created everything, the grass, trees, sea and avian life, the beasts of the field were created according to their kind. Grass's kind is grass, it will never be anything other than grass. An amoeba's kind is an amoeba, it will never be anything other than an amoeba. A cow's kind is a cow, it will never be anything other than a cow. Animals cannot evolve to another kind.

When God created man and woman, we are told God formed the man from the dust of the ground. When a helpmate was not found for the man, God put him to sleep and formed the woman from one of his ribs. Humans cannot have evolved since we have been told otherwise.

A point to consider is that evolution is a theory based upon improvements and changes in a kind due to death. It is the death of animals with "undesirable" genes that allow the animals with "desirable" genes to create offspring free of the "undesirable" gene. Death did not come to God's creation until the Fall (we know this because God's creation was made perfect and death is a product of sin), so evolution was not even possible until Adam and Eve disobeyed God. So there is still no way to squeeze 10.8 billion years into 144 hours.

 

[Cygnus]

I don't believe that evolution is compatible with Scriptures.

When we read about the six day creation, the Hebrew word "yom" is used for day, and yom is a single 24 hour period. Reading the creation story we have six yoms or six consecutive 24 hour days. You can't squeeze 10.8 billon years into 144 hours.

When Go created everything, the grass, trees, sea and avian life, the beasts of the field were created according to their kind. Grass's kind is grass, it will never be anything other than grass. An amoeba's kind is an amoeba, it will never be anything other than an amoeba. A cow's kind is a cow, it will never be anything other than a cow. Animals cannot evolve to another kind.

When God created man and woman, we are told God formed the man from the dust of the ground. When a helpmate was not found for the man, God put him to sleep and formed the woman from one of his ribs. Humans cannot have evolved since we have been told otherwise.

A point to consider is that evolution is a theory based upon improvements and changes in a kind due to death. It is the death of animals with "undesirable" genes that allow the animals with "desirable" genes to create offspring free of the "undesirable" gene. Death did not come to God's creation until the Fall (we know this because God's creation was made perfect and death is a product of sin), so evolution was not even possible until Adam and Eve disobeyed God. So there is still no way to squeeze 10.8 billion years into 144 hours.

Good post. I agree.
The next question to ask the Theo-Evo sect is where did original sin come from if we evolved.

Just for the record, the 10 commandments also present a six 24 hour day creation period with a day of rest.

 

[Edward]

It's not a metaphor.
Gen 1:1-2:3 is the genealogy of the heavens and the earth.
It is the introduction to God's self-revelation beginning with forming man from the dust (elements) of the earth at Gen 2:4. It is the beginning of the revelation of the works of the LORD by which He has provided for eternal life, united with God in Christ.

Agreed. I think it is literal too...that said, what about the rest of Genesis, literal or metaphor?

Like for instance, Genesis 6 and all that nephilim hybrid stuff? We've all talked about this before, and...I lean towards literal (and was pounced on for it) and many others said it can't be literal blah blah blah, but no one could or would decipher the metaphor. The interesting thing about it is, if it's literal, then it would explain very well why God did the flood in the first place, and why He would tell the Israelite's to go commit genocide on entire races of peoples, like the Canaanites.

 

[calvin]

So there is still no way to squeeze 10.8 billion years into 144 hours.

Hello calvin here,
There is if one simply listens to deceiving spirits.

 

[calvin]

Good post. I agree.
The next question to ask the Theo-Evo sect is where did original sin come from if we evolved.

Just for the record, the 10 commandments also present a six 24 hour day creation period with a day of rest.

Hello calvin here,
You raise a very good point IMO.
The fifth commandment is a rather lengthy one......Why?
It contains a restatement of the creation, giving those first chapters of Genesis a very special place in the importance of God's self revelation.
Indeed the literal revelation of God's creative acts is forever enshrined in the Law...(the ten commandments)..........
Exo 20:8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Exo 20:9 Six days you shall labor, and do all your work,
Exo 20:10 but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the LORD your God. On it you shall not do any work, you, or your son, or your daughter, your male servant, or your female servant, or your livestock, or the sojourner who is within your gates.
Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested on the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy. Esv.
If the Creation is metaphor, then so are the ten commandments and so is, and so is...
Ahh, the deceiver must be rolling in fits of laughter.

 

[calvin]

Agreed. I think it is literal too...that said, what about the rest of Genesis, literal or metaphor?

Like for instance, Genesis 6 and all that nephilim hybrid stuff? We've all talked about this before, and...I lean towards literal (and was pounced on for it) and many others said it can't be literal blah blah blah, but no one could or would decipher the metaphor. The interesting thing about it is, if it's literal, then it would explain very well why God did the flood in the first place, and why He would tell the Israelite's to go commit genocide on entire races of peoples, like the Canaanites.

Hello Edward, calvin here...
I have to say that a literal understanding of Scripture, simply excludes all possibility of hybrids.

 

[Zackuth]

Yeah, the Sabbath day was made Holy because God rested on the seventh day of creation.

 

[Zackuth]

The Hebrew word for Nephilim means fallen ones. The ones who turned their backs on God and wallowed in the ways of the world, fallen from grace. They might have been big men of great size and strength, but they were not Godly people.

 

[Edward]

Hello Edward, calvin here...
I have to say that a literal understanding of Scripture, simply excludes all possibility of hybrids.

You sound very confident in this. Good. So what in the world is Genesis 6:4 talking about then, if not a hybrid?

4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.../

I don't want to derail the thread too much, but this has been bugging me for quite awhile. I study it, word study out the words in the original language...and that's what it seems to say to me...

 

[Cygnus]

You sound very confident in this. Good. So what in the world is Genesis 6:4 talking about then, if not a hybrid?

4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.../

I don't want to derail the thread too much, but this has been bugging me for quite awhile. I study it, word study out the words in the original language...and that's what it seems to say to me...

There is a second interpretation many hold to.
This is from CARM:
Another view held by Christians is that the Nephilim are the descendants of Seth, the son of Adam.1 The term "sons of God" would designate great power and authority the same way a king would be addressed with the term "your Majesty." In this view, the men who were supposed to be godly took wives who were unbelievers and their offspring are said to have been fallen ones.

I find it hard to be dogmatic on this issue.

 

[OzSpen]

Remember "evolutionism" is something you guys invented. But why would a parable be incompatible with science?

Barbarian,

That's your attempt to explain the creation of Adam and Eve - it's a parable.

That's nothing more than your assertion through using a question. You have not demonstrated to us that the early chapters of Genesis are parables.

Is parabolic Genesis and scientific evolution compatibility your theory that needs to be tested?

Oz

 

[OzSpen]

Already showed you. Nothing in Genesis denies anything in evolutionary theory. If you can find something, show us, and we'll talk about it.

Barbarian,

The Smithsonian claims:

Human evolution
Human evolution is the lengthy process of change by which people originated from apelike ancestors. Scientific evidence shows that the physical and behavioral traits shared by all people originated from apelike ancestors and evolved over a period of approximately six million years.

One of the earliest defining human traits, bipedalism -- the ability to walk on two legs -- evolved over 4 million years ago. Other important human characteristics -- such as a large and complex brain, the ability to make and use tools, and the capacity for language -- developed more recently. Many advanced traits -- including complex symbolic expression, art, and elaborate cultural diversity -- emerged mainly during the past 100,000 years.​

The Bible states that:

(1) The Lord God formed man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and man became a living being (Gen 2:7) - no process of change from apelike ancestors here.
(2) The Lord God took one of the ribs from the man when he was in a deep sleep and made a woman who was brought to Adam (Gen 2:21-22) - no process of change from apelike ancestors here.

There is a massive gap between the evolutionary explanation of the origin of human beings and that by Scripture in Genesis 2.

Oz