IS FREE WILL AN ATTRIBUTE GOD GIFTED TO MAN?

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Iconoclast said:
No it does not mean that at all. The Christian world is not limited by your flawed narrow understanding. Man has "self will" that is bound by His nature. Man is responsible for his own choices and sin.

No he does not have free will , which does not exist. The bible says men are self willed....it is not free.
10 But chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness, and despise government. Presumptuous are they, selfwilled, they are not afraid to speak evil of dignities.

No it does not. This has been explained to you several times. You keep repeating this like a stunad.

No...you just refuse to look.

let the reformed say what they believe as you do not know.

That is a false accusation, but you are welcome to post it if it makes you feel better
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Came across this in my studies.

OBJECTION 1: THE DECREE OF GOD IS CONTRARY TO THE FREE MORAL AGENCY OF MAN

Response: Agents may properly be said to be free so long as their acts are uncoerced. People are free to act within the confines of their nature. Since all men are fallen in Adam, their nature is corrupted by sin, and they are therefore not free to choose righteousness. Nevertheless, they still freely make their moral choices according to their thinking and desires. Those choices arise from a fallen human nature, which is fundamentally opposed to obeying God. So people act freely in their sin and are not coerced by God to act against their nature. God’s decree extends to the uncoerced choices of agents free to act within the bounds of their nature (cf., e.g., Gen. 50:19–20; Acts 2:23; 4:27–28).[1]
Biblical Doctrine: A Systematic Summary of Bible Truth (Wheaton, IL: Crossway, 2017), 211.
 
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electedbyhim said:
Response: Agents may properly be said to be free so long as their acts are uncoerced. People are free to act within the confines of their nature. Since all men are fallen in Adam, their nature is corrupted by sin, and they are therefore not free to choose righteousness. Nevertheless, they still freely make their moral choices according to their thinking and desires. Those choices arise from a fallen human nature, which is fundamentally opposed to obeying God. So people act freely in their sin and are not coerced by God to act against their nature. God’s decree extends to the uncoerced choices of agents free to act within the bounds of their nature (cf., e.g., Gen. 50:19–20; Acts 2:23; 4:27–28).[1]
Biblical Doctrine: A Systematic Summary of Bible Truth (Wheaton, IL: Crossway, 2017), 211.
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Agreed.
Simply put ... we are free to do whatever our will desires most but our will (desires) are determined by God.
Romans 11:32 For God has consigned everyone to disobedience so that He may have mercy on everyone.
 
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electedbyhim said:
Came across this in my studies.

OBJECTION 1: THE DECREE OF GOD IS CONTRARY TO THE FREE MORAL AGENCY OF MAN
Click to expand...

Interesting. The writer uses Calvin's method of proposing an objection and then stating reasons why it's acceptable or theologically wrong.

electedbyhim said:
Response: Agents may properly be said to be free so long as their acts are uncoerced.
Click to expand...

Do you believe God decrees everything that happens?
If you do, then how are your actions not coerced?
I'd say there can be nothing more coerced than a command/decree from God.
If God commands something, it will happen.
If He decrees everything that takes place, then you are not a free moral agent and MUST necessarily decide for what God has decreed for you to decide.

electedbyhim said:
People are free to act within the confines of their nature. Since all men are fallen in Adam, their nature is corrupted by sin, and they are therefore not free to choose righteousness.
Click to expand...

We don't choose righteousness...we are gifted righteousness through the atoning work of Jesus.
I think you mean that they are not free to choose the good.

Well, this is just not true.
Many lost persons choose to do a lot of good.

According to what you seem to believe, it would mean that everyone that is not saved and pursuing their natural nature would do nothing but evil.

Depraved totally means that a person is depraved in every way.
OK. I accept this. So this means that their soul is also depraved.
So what makes these unsaved persons do good??


electedbyhim said:
Nevertheless, they still freely make their moral choices according to their thinking and desires. Those choices arise from a fallen human nature, which is fundamentally opposed to obeying God. So people act freely in their sin and are not coerced by God to act against their nature. God’s decree extends to the uncoerced choices of agents free to act within the bounds of their nature (cf., e.g., Gen. 50:19–20; Acts 2:23; 4:27–28).[1]
Biblical Doctrine: A Systematic Summary of Bible Truth (Wheaton, IL: Crossway, 2017), 211.
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How does a person freely make a choice IF God has decreed their every move?

God working to make a person DESIRE what HE DESIRES is NOT a model of free will, but of a coerced will.
 
Fastfredy0 said:
Agreed.
Simply put ... we are free to do whatever our will desires most but our will (desires) are determined by God.
Romans 11:32 For God has consigned everyone to disobedience so that He may have mercy on everyone.
Click to expand...
Yes.

I believe Psalm 37:4 explains this.

Psalm 37:4 Delight yourself in Yahweh; And He will give you the desires of your heart.

In other words, if we "do" Gods will (Delight yourself In the Lord) He will put the desire in your heart what you should do.
 
electedbyhim said:
Psalm 37:4 Delight yourself in Yahweh; And He will give you the desires of your heart.

In other words, if we "do" Gods will (Delight yourself In the Lord) He will put the desire in your heart what you should do.
Click to expand...
... and we only do "God's will" if He has regenerated/chosen us.
 
Various opinions of the source of Free Will:
  • Good luck (libertarian free will perspective) or
  • fortunate predestination (reformed perspective) or
  • You Earned It (Free Willianism) .... the idea that one can will what he desires (circular logic) ... example: a person can freely decide to love chewing manure according to this theory
 
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GodsGrace said:
:whirl

Could you give your understanding of Romans 11:32?
Thanks.
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Yeah I can
Jung has given us study after study, 50 yrs of research. all men have some complexes, Some more some less, No one escapes the complex, It is IMPOSSIBLE. = God Consigns
Neurosis might fly away w faith, but then again,,,,, might NOT.
Neurosis is a post modern reality, No doubt this post will 100% get deleted by the Moderators after they all get together and decide to not only delete my post as I mentioned carl jung but no doubt will PERMANENTLY BAN me from this site,,, as if Carl Jung is evil.
Waiting on the followers of Yeshua to open their minds, That science is not all evil.
Just say. w/o my readings in Jung I would be at a loss on some understandings.
Now Mods go ahead and delete and ban.
Your
FREE WILL
Or is it??
R U being manipulated into ideas not expressing free will???
This is what the whole 19th C was about,
Open minds ((aka Liberalism) vs christianity.
I know what side won.
and which side lost out
 
YeshuaGlory said:
Yeah I can
Jung has given us study after study, 50 yrs of research. all men have some complexes, Some more some less, No one escapes the complex, It is IMPOSSIBLE. = God Consigns
Neurosis might fly away w faith, but then again,,,,, might NOT.
Neurosis is a post modern reality, No doubt this post will 100% get deleted by the Moderators after they all get together and decide to not only delete my post as I mentioned carl jung but no doubt will PERMANENTLY BAN me from this site,,, as if Carl Jung is evil.
Waiting on the followers of Yeshua to open their minds, That science is not all evil.
Just say. w/o my readings in Jung I would be at a loss on some understandings.
Now Mods go ahead and delete and ban.
Your
FREE WILL
Or is it??
R U being manipulated into ideas not expressing free will???
This is what the whole 19th C was about,
Open minds ((aka Liberalism) vs christianity.
I know what side won.
and which side lost out
Click to expand...
Well YG
Your post will not be deleted nor you banned.
We don't censor on this site.
We ask that members post with civility and respect for others.
Will reply later....in church.
 
GodsGrace said:
Well YG
Your post will not be deleted nor you banned.
We don't censor on this site.
We ask that members post with civility and respect for others.
Will reply later....in church.
Click to expand...
well thats goo, YOu mean I will not be subject to the hertic scrunity??
I am just beginning reading 19th C **Liberalism** vs Christianity.
wow UNREAL. I have about 5_ books now and if you visit your local seminary library (I live near New Orleans Baptist Theological Seminary) and I know you will find shelves of books on this topic. FACTINATING to say the least.
Basically the christians were saying **The Word ONLY and nothing more*** The Liberals were saying,, **so you reject the knowledges/the sciences??**
Of course we all know Darwin was a crack pot.
Still I can take something from the old crack and turn it into knowledge.
anyway,
God has CONSIGNED all men into,,, not sure what the greek word is, if someone wants to post the greek word,, for **sin** I will take a look, No time right now to post the greeek word
This topic is about Free will, vs fate, vs destiny, vs Chosen by God etc etc.
I know, but no time right now to share.
THe key here is Jung's concepts of the shadow, collective unconscious, etc. = The Complexes. No one escapes.
Only Yeshua escaped as He was born from God as His father, Sure we are BORN AGAIN,, yet read Paul, the old complexes of the family tree can be persistent for both the goods and the evils.
This is why we need God's Words. His spirit to overcome. Only The Overcommers will rejoice at the Marriage Feast. THe other christians will have to look on, not sharing the same level of Joy as The Overcommers.
 
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