Is it even possible to desolate a future Temple

[John the Baptist]

The Sanctuary on earth was of importance only as a teaching tool about the above Everlasting Gospel & Everlasting Covenant. And MOST IMPORTANT, was that it was where God was to meet with His people[. See Psalms 77:13

Now, if God was gone from the temple, (Sanctuary) it was now good for only one purpose, that of, or for, understanding Truth. And it still is! See Exodus 25:8 Note: Exodus 25:9

But to make the Temple, Vineyard, Sanctuary, or Church DESOLATE, does not mean the destruction of it per/say. What makes it Desolate is for the God of the PLACE to be put out or removed!

That had been done in Matthew 23:38, as one can see that it was able to be done in prophecy, also! See Revelation 2:5. And Laodicea's end in Revelation 3:9 (spewed out) Revelation 3:16-17. Thes ones are not the Revelation 17:5 or the DESOLATE HOUSE ones of Matthew 243:38!!

There is the point to be made of the land itself which cannot sin the unpardonable sin to be used of satan for his last false 'temple'. It has been reported that Rome has purchased a larger number of acreage there in the past few years. But that is not my point or real concern.

The Matthew 24:15 verse goes with Daniel 9:27 & Mark 13:24. Yet, It surely does not take a rocket scientist to see that Matthew & Mark are talking about different ABOMINATIONS! Matthew says simply.. "When ye therefore shall see the Abomination of Desolation spoken by Daniel the prophet, [stand in the Holy Place],..." No army, no force, just standing there! (compare Revelation 3:9) [invited as a guest! "We have no king but Caesar" Check out the K.J. of Genesis 4:7, Cain too gained a new leader by a mature rejection of Christ. Then too there are the ones of Revelation 3:9 & the same ones of Revelation 3:16-17 who are again SPEWED out. Again, the Eccl. verses.

Matthew 25:6 has a [midnight] Cry! verse 1 & verse 6 has two separate departures. The first Abomination that made & makes DESOLATE (the rejection of Christ! see Isaiah 5:3 and Isaiah 5:7 for who the Sanctuary or VINEYARD is) & then the 2nd total desolation that makes desolate the building (s). Remember why the structure came down was because of its evil defilement! What could be worse than a professed Christian fold (temple) that is Christ/less????? Again Revelation 3:9 with church needing Caesar's power to execute.

In Daniel 9:27 we see the two combined because it was a period of quite some time from the 'midst of the week (crucifixion) until 70 AD's actual destruction of Jerusalem! Some 70 years or as some figure from Paul's ministry start of 34 AD's 39 yrs. approx.

Anyway for Ecclesiastes 1:9-10 & Ecclesiastes 3:15 to give us the correct read on this we see Daniel's Wording being regrouped the second time around to include Christ & Paul's DOCUMENTED fact that this time around God will 'CUT IT SHORT IN RIGHTEOUSNESS'. The Abomination is seen in Laodicea, (First 1 Peter 4:17) and the Ezekiel 9 slaughter will include the whole of the 666 rejects of the Revelation 17:5 ones, plus Laodicea.

 

[John the Baptist]

Hi, John here: See if this post from another site helps? Also, I believe like the thread states started by Jay, that there are only two folds of any real importance! Adventism & Rome. Where we differ is explained in this below post.
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Pastor N.B, (John) if I understand you correctly, you believe currently God is calling out a people from all denominations of mainstream Christianity as well as from the unbelieving, and these ones who come out will form this one true denomination, and only they will be saved.

*******
P/N/B/ here:
Let me just add that all of these ones will gladley follow the Bible requirements of Everlasting Gospel order. Rom. 8:14. Christ will have no loose cannon's in heaven again with no Gospel order! That is where it all started in the first place! Otherwise the character would not be mature. Also 1 Peter 4:17 finds Adventism 'shaken' first. (judged) And in Christ's day it was the Denomination [as a whole] that were shaken out from the Truth in Christ. See 2 Thess. 2:1-3. And 'the man of sin'? Who replaces a desolate denomination? Again, Gen. 4:7 & Rev. 3:9.

******
Their doctrine will be the same as that of 7th Day Adventism, and these people in this one true denomination will obey the commandments of God perfectly and have perfected character. Because of their perfected character and pure 7th Day Adventist doctrine, God will allow them and only them into eternal life.
******

P/N/B/ here:
I think that you see this correct? But for others sake let me say this, all saved will be saved only one way! Acts 4:12. And in total submission! Acts 5:32 .The rightousness of Christ is the only way to be saved. Rom. 8:1. The power is there, yet it requires a working covenant relationship! Phil. 4:13 & 2 Cor. 12:9. And yes, the only ones saved will be the ones who have been 'proven' safe to save. Na. 1:9 (but this has always been true! A person living in accordance to the light that they had been given)

******
You appear to consider 7th Day Adventism to have departed from the Lord as Israel in the old testament did, so that though you believe their doctrine to be correct, they are not the called out, the remnant, the elect, whatever you wish to call them.
******

Me again:
There are numerous verses of prophecy to tell us this Truth. The Eccl. 1:9-10 & Eccl. 3:15 verses are the most simple to understand in documented 'inspiration' perhaps? And in Isa. 5 it tell's the exact history past & that which is again to be in the future. (even as to the reason of why, in verse 3) Then, along with the two/fold Eze. 9 slaughter of 70AD, & the Rev. 3's Naked/ness of Christ's Rightousness ones, we see that these too, will be [spewed out] as sickening. What Born Again person who [loves Christ] could stay in any yoked membership as a Rev. 18:4 Partaker of openly documented known sin??

Let me clarify! Rev. 18:4 is speaking of Babylon. (and her harlot daughters. see Rev. 17:5) And the verse is not talking of Virgin Israel as Babylon! Yet, if you take note about known sin & being Partakers, the WARNING still is Truth! And notice what your take would be as seen in Israel of old, in the Matt. 10:15'th verse?
Christ states:
"Verily I say unto you, it shall be more tolerable for the land of [Sodom and Gomorrha] in the day of judgement, than for that city." (see verses 5-6 of this chapter for whom Christ was talking about!)

So, yes, surely Babylon was no worse that Sodom and Gomorrah!! But the most guilty are not either of these two! *See Luke 12:47-48.

******
Am I understanding this right?
******
My conclusion:
When one thinks of the Midnight Cry in Matt. 25 & the Shaking of 2 Thess. 2, another good verse (of many) is seen in Micah 2:13.
The descriptive Word is that of 'The Breaker is come up before them: they have broken up, and have passed through the gate, and are gone out by it, and their King shall pass before them, and the Lord on the head of them." (check Zeph. 3:15!) Again, Matt. 23:38 & Matt. 25.

And yes, maybe we see an understanding of what is being said? Let me just add another verse seeing that you seem to be quick to understand a persons posting. In Amos 7:7-8 Amos sees a 'Plumbline' for Virgin Israel. Judgement! And in chapter 5:1-*2 ibid.. we see.. "Hear ye the Word which I take up against you, even a lamantation, O house of Israel. [THE VIRGIN OF ISRAEL IS FALLEN.]" Still yet, 1 Peter 4:17 finds this again in the repeat, but do not get the Midnight Cry of Matt. 25 confused with the LOUD CRY of Rev. 14:9. These that give this cry are the ones whom you describe. And this loud Cry is to the professed Christian World. It is 70 AD's counter/part! 666.

 

[ddubsolo85]

Cameron:

So, you would accept Matthew 5:17 at face value?

No doubt about it.

Cameron:

And in your mind, we are grafted into them? Romans 11?

Yes, grafted into the Old Covenant. Think about it; how can you be grafted into something new? Grafted into something already in existence is the only thing that makes sense.

God Bless!

 

[John the Baptist]

Cameron:

So, you would accept Matthew 5:17 at face value?

No doubt about it.

Cameron:
[quote:ef6bd]And in your mind, we are grafted into them? Romans 11?

Yes, grafted into the Old Covenant. Think about it; how can you be grafted into something new? Grafted into something already in existence is the only thing that makes sense.

God Bless![/quote:ef6bd]

****
God is right, Nothing New, huh? You too, are right on! Hebrews 13:20 is of the Revelation 14:6's Everlasting Gospel COMBINED! Only a person can & must become a NEW Born Again creature. But that is the Everlasting Gospel Message! Christ stated that YE MUST BE BORN AGAIN. :fadein:

 

[ddubsolo85]

J the B:

God is right, Nothing New, huh? You too, are right on! Hebrews 13:20 is of the Revelation 14:6's Everlasting Gospel COMBINED! Only a person can & must become a NEW Born Again creature. But that is the Everlasting Gospel Message! Christ stated that YE MUST BE BORN AGAIN.

I wholeheartedly agree that a person must become a new, born again creature. Once you enter into the promise of God, once you enter into Christ, you are a NEW creature. And we, like Isaac, are children of that promise made to Abraham (Gal 4:28), which is the Old Covenant.

Thank you for your response.

God Bless!

 

[John the Baptist]

J the B:

God is right, Nothing New, huh? You too, are right on! Hebrews 13:20 is of the Revelation 14:6's Everlasting Gospel COMBINED! Only a person can & must become a NEW Born Again creature. But that is the Everlasting Gospel Message! Christ stated that YE MUST BE BORN AGAIN.

I wholeheartedly agree that a person must become a new, born again creature. Once you enter into the promise of God, once you enter into Christ, you are a NEW creature. And we, like Isaac, are children of that promise made to Abraham (Gal 4:28), which is the Old Covenant.

Thank you for your response.
God Bless!

*******
John here: You are welcome! :wink:

Are you ready??? :fadein: On another thread you say:

According to the Bible, in order to come under the New Covenant, one must be a descendant of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. This would exclude all Gentiles. We can be spiritual Gentiles, but we can’t be Jews (spiritual or otherwise). The Bible never says that Gentiles become Jews. Abraham's seed? Yes. Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob's seed? No.

OK: The Word of God says that "He is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcism is that of the heart, ... not of the letter."

"For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcism, which is outward [in the flesh].." Romans 2:28-29.

Now: That is not what you are saying!

--John

 

[ddubsolo85]

On another thread you say:

According to the Bible, in order to come under the New Covenant, one must be a descendant of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. This would exclude all Gentiles. We can be spiritual Gentiles, but we can’t be Jews (spiritual or otherwise). The Bible never says that Gentiles become Jews. Abraham's seed? Yes. Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob's seed? No.

J the B:
[quote:9ba5e]OK: The Word of God says that "He is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcism is that of the heart, ... not of the letter."

"For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcism, which is outward [in the flesh].." Romans 2:28-29.

Now: That is not what you are saying!

[/quote:9ba5e]

On the contrary! That's exactly what I'm saying. But what you're leaving out is Rom 2:17-21;
17Now you, if you call yourself a Jew;... 21you, then, who teach others, do you not teach yourself?

You have to understand that Paul is addressing Jews. What he's saying to them is that they're not really Jews if they're only Jews outwardly. They must be Jews inwardly. He's not addressing Gentiles.

God Bless!

 

[John the Baptist]

On another thread you say:

According to the Bible, in order to come under the New Covenant, one must be a descendant of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. This would exclude all Gentiles. We can be spiritual Gentiles, but we can’t be Jews (spiritual or otherwise). The Bible never says that Gentiles become Jews. Abraham's seed? Yes. Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob's seed? No.

J the B:
[quote:7d271]OK: The Word of God says that "He is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcism is that of the heart, ... not of the letter."

"For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcism, which is outward [in the flesh].." Romans 2:28-29.

Now: That is not what you are saying!

On the contrary! That's exactly what I'm saying. But what you're leaving out is Rom 2:17-21;
17Now you, if you call yourself a Jew;... 21you, then, who teach others, do you not teach yourself?

You have to understand that Paul is addressing Jews. What he's saying to them is that they're not really Jews if they're only Jews outwardly. They must be Jews inwardly. He's not addressing Gentiles.

God Bless!

[/quote:7d271]

**********
OK: Then we are agreeing that the Saved Jew of all time are the Born Again in faith ones. (not nationalities or male or female) Even the ones who are DEAD in the faith. They are Jews. And yes, we are not DEAD yet! :fadein: Is that a agreed upon assumption??
---John

 

[ddubsolo85]

John:

OK: Then we are agreeing that the Saved Jew of all time are the Born Again in faith ones. (not nationalities or male or female) Even the ones who are DEAD in the faith. They are Jews. And yes, we are not DEAD yet! Is that a agreed upon assumption??

If you mean the saved Jew and the saved Gentile, then we're in agreement. If you mean that everyone who is saved is a saved Jew, I would have to disagree.

God Bless!

 

[John the Baptist]

John:

OK: Then we are agreeing that the Saved Jew of all time are the Born Again in faith ones. (not nationalities or male or female) Even the ones who are DEAD in the faith. They are Jews. And yes, we are not DEAD yet! Is that a agreed upon assumption??

If you mean the saved Jew and the saved Gentile, then we're in agreement. If you mean that everyone who is saved is a saved Jew, I would have to disagree.

God Bless!

******
Hay, I like this. Good and clear. :fadein: (again we agree! 'if' you mean that as I read it! :wink: )

OK: God (Christ) said 'ye must be Born Again'. So because Adam sinned & was to die 'unless' being Born Again, he too must be included into this Gospel statement. Do you agree? Surely the fig-leaf covering was needed because the Righteousness of CHRIST was now removed.

One more. Except for a Born again New Birth physical body, we are brought right back to where Adam was before he sinned.. (hold it! :fadein by accepting the Eternal 'CONDITIONAL' Gospel & Eternal Covenant conditions which include the provisions to live as commanded. Which are Philippians 4:13 & 2 Corinthians 12:9 for starters. And the one thing that was top priority was the Desire & Motive to do so, (True Love!) the NEW BIRTH! Hebrews 10:15-16. Do you agree??

---John

 

[ddubsolo85]

J the B:

OK: God (Christ) said 'ye must be Born Again'. So because Adam sinned & was to die 'unless' being Born Again, he too must be included into this Gospel statement. Do you agree?

Yes. Well stated.

J the B:

Surely the fig-leaf covering was needed because the Righteousness of CHRIST was now removed.

Surely.

J the B:

One more. Except for a Born again New Birth physical body, we are brought right back to where Adam was before he sinned.. (hold it! ) by accepting the Eternal 'CONDITIONAL' Gospel & Eternal Covenant conditions which include the provisions to live as commanded.

Conditional gospel? Conditional covenant?

I believe salvation is unconditional just as God's love is unconditional. We have no part in it other than to leave where we are, and come to God. It's the same commitment that Abraham made. Leave Ur and come to God. That was the condition of the promise. Once he came to God, the promise became unconditional. There were no more conditions.I believe it's the same with us. Once we come to God, we receive His promise to us, and NOTHING can ever take that from us.

If salvation was up to us, NONE o us would have it. It takes perfection to be with God, and NONE of us have that. ALL of us have broken the law, so we're all doomed. The only perfection is Christ. So in Him, we attach ourselves to perfection. Without Him, we attach ourselves to doom.

J the B:

Which are Philippians 4:13 & 2 Corinthians 12:9 for starters. And the one thing that was top priority was the Desire & Motive to do so, (True Love!) the NEW BIRTH! Hebrews 10:15-16. Do you agree??

I'm not sure what you mean here. Do I agree that there is a new birth when accepting Christ? Yes. Is that what you mean?

God Bless!

 

[Jake99]

The world is his temple, and it will run efficiently ever after. But will their be a place to lay his head when he is revealed? If it is given to him he will multiply it and give it back to you. If you decide he is crazy for even suggesting such things than you will never know. Lets hope someone listens to the messiah when he reveals who he is and what he has done.

Cameron

Sorry I missed responding to your question on the above post. What I mean to say is that Jesus is as different as the first one and he performs miracles that he hid. So when he steps forward like the carpenter before him most will never even look at the pieces of the puzzle he presents. Anyone claiming to be the christ must be nuts. But one is not nuts and he proves that with multiplication and walking on water. Are you still listening?

 

[Cameron]

Jake99 wrote:
The world is his temple, and it will run efficiently ever after. But will their be a place to lay his head when he is revealed? If it is given to him he will multiply it and give it back to you. If you decide he is crazy for even suggesting such things than you will never know. Lets hope someone listens to the messiah when he reveals who he is and what he has done.

Cameron
Sorry I missed responding to your question on the above post. What I mean to say is that Jesus is as different as the first one and he performs miracles that he hid. So when he steps forward like the carpenter before him most will never even look at the pieces of the puzzle he presents. Anyone claiming to be the christ must be nuts. But one is not nuts and he proves that with multiplication and walking on water. Are you still listening?

I'm not sure what you are quoting here and responding to except that you are speaking of the 2nd Coming and the temple?

:scrambleup:

You write as if you believe the Jesus has already returned a second time?

Acts 1:6-11 is quite clear about who will return and how they will return and what purpose they will achieve when they return. Anything but what complies with Jesus' last 1st Advent event is not to be considered.

 

[Jake99]

There are many ways to interperate the expected events of the second coming. Some say he litterally must come out of the clouds and others think it is theoretical. Yes I do believe he is here on Earth and he is far more talented and successful than you can imagine. Jesus came forth as a carpenter and no one understood what he had done prior to eluding to being the christ and being executed. His ways are what is preached not what is practiced. In order for the bible to be correct and the sign of the times to be right the messiah must show up out of nowhere as well. This time look at the evidence of miracles before calling him a nut.

 

[kerravon]

There are many ways to interperate the expected events of the second coming. Some say he litterally must come out of the clouds and others think it is theoretical. Yes I do believe he is here on Earth and he is far more talented and successful than you can imagine. Jesus came forth as a carpenter and no one understood what he had done prior to eluding to being the christ and being executed. His ways are what is preached not what is practiced. In order for the bible to be correct and the sign of the times to be right the messiah must show up out of nowhere as well. This time look at the evidence of miracles before calling him a nut.

All that you say has already happened. Which bit of
http://antisubjugator.blogspot.com/2005 ... -rank.html
do you not understand?

 

[Jake99]

Kerravon,

I read your site listed above. No one would say that you do not care about the cruelty towards mankind. It is obvious that you do, but you have demonstrated nothing that comes close to what God does and you have not even been a successful leader. You have to demonstrate the ability to do things that no one else can or has. Not even Jesus was god, but he was used by god. Has god directed you on how to turn chaos into peace and prosperity, and if so where did you walk on this water?

 

[kerravon]

Kerravon,

I read your site listed above. No one would say that you do not care about the cruelty towards mankind. It is obvious that you do, but you have demonstrated nothing that comes close to what God does and you have not even been a successful leader.

What God does is answer people's prayers. And no-one has higher priority than the Iranian girls being raped by their Mullahs. Do you see anyone else besides me trying to answer their prayers?

You have to demonstrate the ability to do things that no one else can or has.

No-one else has sent a letter to the Australian Prime Minister asking for a unilateral declaration of war on Iran. No-one else has isolated the definition of freedom - NOT SUBJUGATED, which needs to be explained to the 3rd world (who have been told by their dictators that freedom = "independence from Britain/France). No-one else isolated the common ideology between an Australian atheist and George Bush, both wanting to end the Iraqi holocaust. No-one else was willing to convert to Islam purely out of "love thy enemy".

The fact that others weren't following exactly in my footsteps is a horrible indictment on mankind. Everyone failed.

Not even Jesus was god, but he was used by god. Has god directed you on how to turn chaos into peace and prosperity, and if so where did you walk on this water?

Actually I figured out how to turn chaos into peace myself, as an atheist. The culmination of my work happened to be in message number 666 dated 9/11 (2004). It was a miracle. It stunned me. Shortly after that I received revelations and I was told that if I thought the bible was not good enough, I should write my own. Which I did (http://www.moatazilla.org).

These are all the duties of a diety, not a man. The fact that only a handful of people can recognize me for who I am is simply an indictment on mankind.

 

[Jake99]

Kerravon

I am sure your heart is in the right place and rape is something that must disappear just like prostitution, gambling, pornography and war. The answer is to use a simple system that prevents such atrocities. Only if you follow the messiah will you convert the world in an instant and find the peace you are promised.

 

[kerravon]

I am sure your heart is in the right place and rape is something that must disappear just like prostitution, gambling, pornography and war.

Rape is nothing remotely like those things you mentioned. In Australia, we have legalized prostitution, gambling and pornography. We are a free nation. No-one is forced to do these things and no-one is prevented from doing them either. Australia is a tolerant country. And there is a time for going to war as well - to prevent things like rape, or for security reasons.

The answer is to use a simple system that prevents such atrocities. Only if you follow the messiah will you convert the world in an instant and find the peace you are promised.

I am the Messiah. The simple system is that the world is divided into subjugators, non-subjugators and anti-subjugators and these groupings transcend race/religion/nationality. And it is time for a war between subjugators such as Saddam and the Mullahs of Iran, and the anti-subjugators (mainly the Anglophones). This will prevent the gross violation of human rights perpetuated by subjugators onto anti-subjugators and non-subjugators.

 

[Jake99]

Australia may be tolerant of selling skin and gambling but I can guarantee you that the messiah is not. Its the sales system that is the problem that causes the wars and the rape. Your tolerant society needs an ass kicking if that is what it thinks is ok.