Jesus Is God: Part 1

[eddif]

John 20:21 kjv
21. Then said Jesus to them again, Peace be unto you: as my Father hath sent me, even so send I you.
22. And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:

Jesus sent them to wait till they received power from on high.

Acts 2:2 kjv
2. And suddenly a sound like a violent rushing wind came out of heaven, and it filled the whole house where they were sitting.
3. And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
4. And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

The breathing of Jesus brought the Hily Spirit on the day of Pentecost.

So that is what was why Jesus breathed on them as a prophecy of what was to come.

eddif

 

[Cooper]

Here's something to think about. The translation spirit is a figure of speech used for the words ruach, neshamah, pneuma, and noe. All four of these words mean wind or breath. They are translated spirit when used as a figure of speech. So, when someone says man is a spirit, the are essentially saying man is a wind or a breath. So, if one makes that claim the onus is on them to explain how man is a wind or breath since it's figurative language. So, guys, how is man a wind or breath? In what sense?

These words do not have as their meaning a disembodied living being. That is an English definition of spirit. It has no bearing on those Greek and Hebrew words. They are used figuratively of angels and demons because angels and demons have qualities that are similar to the wind. Jesus explains this in John 3. He said the wind blows where it wills and you don't know where it comes from or where it goes. It's the same with Angels and demons. They're all around, they come and go and we are none the wiser. Just like the wind. We can't see the wind but we can see the effect of the wind. Likewise, we can't see angels ordemons but we can see their effects. Since they have qualities like the wind they are figuratively called winds

Spirit
pneuma (G4151) primarily denotes "the wind" (akin to pneo, "to breathe, blow"); also "breath"; then, especially "the spirit," which, like the wind, is invisible, immaterial and powerful. The NT uses of the word may be analyzed approximately as follows:
"(a) the wind, Joh_3:8 (where marg. is, perhaps, to be preferred); Heb_1:7; cf. Amo_4:13, Sept.; (b) the breath, 2Th_2:8; Rev_11:11; Rev_13:15; cf. Job_12:10, Sept.; (c) the immaterial, invisible part of man, Luk_8:55; Act_7:59; 1Co_5:5; Jas_2:26; cf. Ecc_12:7, Sept.; (d) the disembodied (or 'unclothed,' or 'naked,' 2Co_5:3, 2Co_5:4) man, Luk_24:37, Luk_24:39; Heb_12:23; 1Pe_4:6; (e) the resurrection body, 1Co_15:45; 1Ti_3:16; 1Pe_3:18; (f) the sentient element in man, that by which he perceives, reflects, feels, desires, Mat_5:3; Mat_26:41; Mar_2:8; Luk_1:47, Luk_1:80; Act_17:16; Act_20:22; 1Co_2:11; 1Co_5:3, 1Co_5:4; 1Co_14:4, 1Co_14:15; 2Co_7:1; cf. Gen_26:35; Isa_26:9; Eze_13:3; Dan_7:15; (g) purpose, aim, 2Co_12:18; Php_1:27; Eph_4:23; Rev_19:10; cf. Ezr_1:5; Psa_78:8; Dan_5:12; (h) the equivalent of the personal pronoun, used for emphasis and effect: 1st person, 1Co_16:18; cf. Gen_6:3; 2nd person, 2Ti_4:22; Phm_1:25; cf. Psa_139:7; 3rd person, 2Co_7:13; cf. Isa_40:13; (i) character, Luk_1:17; Rom_1:4; cf. Num_14:24; (j) moral qualities and activities: bad, as of bondage, as of a slave, Rom_8:15; cf. Isa_61:3; stupor, Rom_11:8; cf. Isa_29:10; timidity, 2Ti_1:7; cf. Jos_5:1; good, as of adoption, i.e., liberty as of a son, Rom_8:15; cf. Psa_51:12; meekness, 1Co_4:21; cf. Pro_16:19; faith, 2Co_4:13; quietness, 1Pe_3:4; cf. Pro_14:29; (k) the Holy Spirit, e.g., Mat_4:1 (see below); Luk_4:18; (l) 'the inward man' (an expression used only of the believer, Rom_7:22; 2Co_4:16; Eph_3:16); the new life, Rom_8:4-6, Rom_8:10, Rom_8:16; Heb_12:9; cf. Psa_51:10; (m) unclean spirits, demons, Mat_8:16; Luk_4:33; 1Pe_3:19; cf. 1Sa_18:10; (n) angels, Heb_1:14; cf. Act_12:15; (o) divine gift for service, 1Co_14:12, 1Co_14:32; (p) by metonymy, those who claim to be depositories of these gifts, 2Th_2:2; 1Jn_4:1-3; (q) the significance, as contrasted with the form, of words, or of a rite, Joh_6:63; Rom_2:29; Rom_7:6; 2Co_3:6; (r) a vision, Rev_1:10; Rev_4:2; Rev_17:3; Rev_21:10."*
* From Notes on Thessalonians, by Hogg and Vine, pp. 204, 205.
Notes: (1) For phantasma, rendered "spirit," Mat_14:26; Mar_6:49, KJV, see APPARITION. (2) For the distinction between "spirit" and "soul," see under SOUL, last three paragraphs.

The Holy Spirit
The "Holy Spirit" is spoken of under various titles in the NT ("Spirit" and "Ghost" are renderings of the same word, pneuma; the advantage of the rendering "Spirit" is that it can always be used, whereas "Ghost" always requires the word "Holy" prefixed.) In the following list the omission of the definite article marks its omission in the original (concerning this see below): "Spirit, Mat_22:43; Eternal Spirit, Heb_9:14; the Spirit, Mat_4:1; Holy Spirit, Mat_1:18; the Holy Spirit, Mat_28:19; the Spirit, the Holy, Mat_12:32; the Spirit of promise, the Holy, Eph_1:13; Spirit of God, Rom_8:9; Spirit of (the) living God, 2Co_3:3; the Spirit of God, 1Co_2:11; the Spirit of our God, 1Co_6:11; the Spirit of God, the Holy, Eph_4:30; the Spirit of glory and of God, 1Pe_4:14; the Spirit of Him that raised up Jesus from the dead (i.e., God), Rom_8:11; the Spirit of your Father, Mat_10:20; the Spirit of His Son, Gal_4:6; Spirit of (the) Lord, Act_8:39; the Spirit of (the) Lord, Act_5:9; (the) Lord, (the) Spirit, 2Co_3:18; the Spirit of Jesus, Act_16:7; Spirit of Christ, Rom_8:9; the Spirit of Jesus Christ, Php_1:19; Spirit of adoption, Rom_8:15; the Spirit of truth, Joh_14:17; the Spirit of life, Rom_8:2; the Spirit of grace, Heb_10:29."+

+ From Notes on Galatians, by Hogg and Vine, p. 193.
The use or absence of the article in the original where the "Holy Spirit" is spoken of cannot always be decided by grammatical rules, nor can the presence or absence of the article alone determine whether the reference is to the "Holy Spirit." Examples where the Person is meant when the article is absent are Mat_22:43 (the article is used in Mar_12:36); Act_4:25, RV (absent in some texts); Act_19:2, Act_19:6; Rom_14:17; 1Co_2:4; Gal_5:25 (twice); 1Pe_1:2. Sometimes the absence is to be accounted for by the fact that Pneuma (like Theos) is substantially a proper name, e.g., in Joh_7:39. As a general rule the article is present where the subject of the teaching is the Personality of the Holy Spirit, e.g., Joh_14:26, where He is spoken of in distinction from the Father and the Son. See also Joh_15:26 and cf. Luk_3:22.

In Gal_3:3, in the phrase "having begun in the Spirit," it is difficult to say whether the reference is to the "Holy Spirit" or to the quickened spirit of the believer; that it possibly refers to the latter is not to be determined by the absence of the article, but by the contrast with "the flesh"; on the other hand, the contrast may be between the "Holy Spirit" who in the believer sets His seal on the perfect work of Christ, and the flesh which seeks to better itself by works of its own. There is no preposition before either noun, and if the reference is to the quickened spirit it cannot be dissociated from the operation of the "Holy Spirit." In Gal_4:29 the phrase "after the Spirit" signifies "by supernatural power," in contrast to "after the flesh," i.e., "by natural power," and the reference must be to the "Holy Spirit"; so in Gal_5:17.

The full title with the article before both pneuma and hagios (the "resumptive" use of the article), lit., "the Spirit the Holy," stresses the character of the Person, e.g., Mat_12:32; Mar_3:29; Mar_12:36; Mar_13:11; Luk_2:26; Luk_10:21 (RV); Joh_14:26; Act_1:16; Act_5:3; Act_7:51; Act_10:44, Act_10:47; Act_13:2; Act_15:28; Act_19:6; Act_20:23, Act_20:28; Act_21:11; Act_28:25; Eph_4:30; Heb_3:7; Heb_9:8; Heb_10:15.

The Personality of the Spirit is emphasized at the expense of strict grammatical procedure in Joh_14:26; Joh_15:26; Joh_16:8, Joh_16:13, Joh_16:14, where the emphatic pronoun ekeinos, "He," is used of Him in the masculine, whereas the noun pneuma is neuter in Greek, while the corresponding word in Aramaic, the language in which our Lord probably spoke, is feminine (rucha, cf. Heb. ruach). The rendering "itself" in Rom_8:16, Rom_8:26, due to the Greek gender, is corrected to "Himself" in the RV.

The subject of the "Holy Spirit" in the NT may be considered as to His divine attributes; His distinct Personality in the Godhead; His operation in connection with the Lord Jesus in His birth, His life, His baptism, His death; His operations in the world; in the church; His having been sent at Pentecost by the Father and by Christ; His operations in the individual believer; in local churches; His operations in the production of Holy Scripture; His work in the world, etc.

(Source Vine NT dictionary)

 

[Edward]

What questions didn't I answer? I just spent about 2 hours writing a post to address your questions

A bunch of them. You addressed a lot of stuff but not the questions, Oh I can see where you sort of kind of did in a vague roundabout way but nothing that made me sit up and say, wow maybe I'm wrong. So I dunno, perhaps we just ned to agree to disagree.

Neither one of us is is at a place in our walk where we are able to come into agreement about what the other says...so it's up to the Holy Spirit to bring one of to the light still, lol.

Don't get me wrong though, I don't disagree with everything you say, just portions of it. I know that you've said a couple times now that God revealed these things to you and I inferred directly and you also said something about...unless God has revealed it to them. And I sense a small wrongness in that because it would amount to saying, thus sayeth the Lord...- And I wont do that. I wont call you liar, how could I? I wasn't there. I very much hesitate to toss some testimonies to you in a misguided effort to lend credibility to my words. Oh I've had supernatural experiences so that means I'm right? Lol! It don't work like that. Our God is a very personal God and confirms Himself to us in a private manner, so that...you still have to choose and have faith, I still have to choose. So that He does not interefere with our faith. It is up to us to receive and believe.

I have no doubt that I am not right about everything! I still makes mistakes. I have no doubt that you do also. I also think there's no way that either of us are lying. But the Lord did say to us, I have many things I would like to tell you but you can not bear them at this time...
And that's all of us, Brother.

And I don't know if you've really noticed ot not, but a very curious thing is going on in this thread. It's, in the face of disagreement, there is a degree of unity in spirit. This thread has not deteriorated into bickering or negative energy. And that's a pretty impressive thing if you think about it, lol! It also gives glory to God because there seems to be evidence of unity of Spirit. And why not? We serve the same God!

:wink

 

[Edward]

I will make a comment. Edward, you and others may not agree with. We are not here to argue.

Jesus as the co creator
of the world or at least man, he took on the form of man.

Might as well be open about this. It is my opinion that Adam and Eve were not really super spiritual people. If they had been they would have resisted Satan. Edward has said they were really spiritual. I believe they were living souls. They had minds will emotions and a body. The only way they could live forever was to continually eat of the tree of life. Not eternal spirits like angels. At the resurrection we become completely finished. I wish I could totally explain the lambs book of life. At judgement the book of life is opened and checked to see if our name is there. At the new birth ( which happens when we confess Jesus as Lord ) it seems our name is written there.

Jesus had the Holy Spirit descend on him and remain. Is this like us ? When we are baptized in the Holy Spirit filled seems more correct.

We see through a glass darkly. He was touched with our infirmities yet without sin.

Hebrews 4:15 kjv
15. For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin. Through his death he provided eternal life for us. It was not an easy thing he did. The sweat being as drops of blood speaks of his agony.

Jesus understood us.
Workin through doctrine is tough. Fire purifies.

Anyway this is no attack, but trying to work through what is truth.

eddif

Sure! I understand, Brother. And, you bet those are speculations of mine about Adam & Eve being so spiritual. Because they were in an un-fallen state, and created in the image and likess of God. I tink they had to be, since the Kingdom of God is so spiritual. But realistically, having only recently been created, I think it's reasonable to assume that Adam & Eve were dumb as a rock about many things. (!!) They had only just begun to evolve spiritually. ...all those walks and talks with God in the cool of the evening it's a safe bet bet that Adam was asking a lot of questions! But then, the woman was the first time that a woman was ever gullible, and it was also the first time that a man fell for a pretty girl. After they ate from the tree of Knowledge, then Adam was able to see this woman naked, and it was too much for him and he was too inexperienced to understand yet the consequences so he he was unable to have good judgement.

Good Judgement comes from experience.
Experience comes from bad judgement.
So we live and learn and evolve. It was the first time a man fell for a woman, but it sure wasn't the last time, lol.

Explaining the quickening spirit of Christ in us may be a little diffrient. This is complicated.

It sure is, and He has let me learn quite a few things the hard way, on my own. And nobody is doing sermons on the subject! So what's a guy to do? Listen to accidental blurbs that other Christian folks come out with at times that are related in some way. So we add another teeny piece to the big picture.

And what I have understood about the quickening of the spirit was given to me in tis way. When the Lord began to quicken me in my spirit here and there, I didn't know what it was. I had no clue. But it was highly noticable to me when it happens. It's weird, I don't want to say it was something that I felt like an emotion but it certainly rippled through my flesh also. I'll be watching a Pastor or Teacher talk about our Lord, and prolly wondering if what he's saying makes sense or is exactly true...and, Boom Brother. I perceived a definite (quickening of my spirit) and it does affect my flesh. But it was easy to tell that this was something that happened in my spirit. You might say I felt it in my spirit. And I perceived that the Lord was telling me that, yes this is true what you hear and think on. He was confirming the truth as I listened. And I had no clue what to call it, so I began saying that, the Lord pinged me in my spirit. That was about as close and decriptive that I could comprehend at the time. But then somebody said exactly the right thing or I read the exact point which caused the realization of, oh wow, so that is what that is!

It may or may not be the same or different to others, who knows? But that's how it was for me.

 

[Edward]

Man this thread is tough to keep up with! Go to sleep early one day and get buried, lol.

It's a good thread though. I think that subject about quickening of the spirit would make a good thread on it's own too. Noone seems to be giving sermons or teachings on it still! Kind of mysterious subject.

 

[Cooper]

If I look at people:
Flesh- A man in a coma with no cognitive activity just a tiny bit of brain stem activity.

Soul- A paralyzed man with full mental capibilities.

Spirit filled- insert 10 descriptions from Pentecost.

Be of one mind.

eddif

Trying to illustrate the oneness of God when separated by time and distance is difficult, but have a read of this and see if it helps. I wrote it a long time ago in an effort to show how misleading names can be.

“Harry Roger Webb is Cliff Richard of Indian origin. Although he has a different name, and lives in a different place from where he was born, and although he appears to be two people, he is nonetheless one person.

Likewise, Mr Obama paid his taxes and Mr President spent them. They have different names and different titles, but are in constant communication, the same as Yahweh and Jesus, for both are one.

So it is with Jesus, who before he came to earth was the WORD, and like many others his beginning was in another place, long before he came to Israel, but nonetheless, regardless of his attributes, he is One God.”

Blessings.

 

[Randy]

I have given you many scriptures. If you believe man is not a spirit created in the image of God then so be it.


There was a certain rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and fared sumptuously every day. But there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, full of sores, who was laid at his gate, desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man’s table. Moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham’s bosom. The rich man also died and was buried. And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
Then he cried and said, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.’ But Abraham said, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented. And besides all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed, so that those who want to pass from here to you cannot, nor can those from there pass to us.’
“Then he said, ‘I beg you therefore, father, that you would send him to my father’s house, for I have five brothers, that he may testify to them, lest they also come to this place of torment.’ Luke 16:19-28



The rich man also died and was buried —

• And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
• Then he cried and said, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.’

The rich man’s body was buried, yet he was in hell conversing with Abraham and could see Lazarus.





JLB

I thought about giving Rev 4 but then I realized he won't accept anything given for some reason.

After this I looked, and there before me was a door standing open in heaven. And the voice I had first heard speaking to me like a trumpet said, “Come up here, and I will show you what must take place after this.” 2At once I was in the Spirit, and there before me was a throne in heaven with someone sitting on it.

 

[Butch5]

Spirit
pneuma (G4151) primarily denotes "the wind" (akin to pneo, "to breathe, blow"); also "breath"; then, especially "the spirit," which, like the wind, is invisible, immaterial and powerful. The NT uses of the word may be analyzed approximately as follows:
"(a) the wind, Joh_3:8 (where marg. is, perhaps, to be preferred); Heb_1:7; cf. Amo_4:13, Sept.; (b) the breath, 2Th_2:8; Rev_11:11; Rev_13:15; cf. Job_12:10, Sept.; (c) the immaterial, invisible part of man, Luk_8:55; Act_7:59; 1Co_5:5; Jas_2:26; cf. Ecc_12:7, Sept.; (d) the disembodied (or 'unclothed,' or 'naked,' 2Co_5:3, 2Co_5:4) man, Luk_24:37, Luk_24:39; Heb_12:23; 1Pe_4:6; (e) the resurrection body, 1Co_15:45; 1Ti_3:16; 1Pe_3:18; (f) the sentient element in man, that by which he perceives, reflects, feels, desires, Mat_5:3; Mat_26:41; Mar_2:8; Luk_1:47, Luk_1:80; Act_17:16; Act_20:22; 1Co_2:11; 1Co_5:3, 1Co_5:4; 1Co_14:4, 1Co_14:15; 2Co_7:1; cf. Gen_26:35; Isa_26:9; Eze_13:3; Dan_7:15; (g) purpose, aim, 2Co_12:18; Php_1:27; Eph_4:23; Rev_19:10; cf. Ezr_1:5; Psa_78:8; Dan_5:12; (h) the equivalent of the personal pronoun, used for emphasis and effect: 1st person, 1Co_16:18; cf. Gen_6:3; 2nd person, 2Ti_4:22; Phm_1:25; cf. Psa_139:7; 3rd person, 2Co_7:13; cf. Isa_40:13; (i) character, Luk_1:17; Rom_1:4; cf. Num_14:24; (j) moral qualities and activities: bad, as of bondage, as of a slave, Rom_8:15; cf. Isa_61:3; stupor, Rom_11:8; cf. Isa_29:10; timidity, 2Ti_1:7; cf. Jos_5:1; good, as of adoption, i.e., liberty as of a son, Rom_8:15; cf. Psa_51:12; meekness, 1Co_4:21; cf. Pro_16:19; faith, 2Co_4:13; quietness, 1Pe_3:4; cf. Pro_14:29; (k) the Holy Spirit, e.g., Mat_4:1 (see below); Luk_4:18; (l) 'the inward man' (an expression used only of the believer, Rom_7:22; 2Co_4:16; Eph_3:16); the new life, Rom_8:4-6, Rom_8:10, Rom_8:16; Heb_12:9; cf. Psa_51:10; (m) unclean spirits, demons, Mat_8:16; Luk_4:33; 1Pe_3:19; cf. 1Sa_18:10; (n) angels, Heb_1:14; cf. Act_12:15; (o) divine gift for service, 1Co_14:12, 1Co_14:32; (p) by metonymy, those who claim to be depositories of these gifts, 2Th_2:2; 1Jn_4:1-3; (q) the significance, as contrasted with the form, of words, or of a rite, Joh_6:63; Rom_2:29; Rom_7:6; 2Co_3:6; (r) a vision, Rev_1:10; Rev_4:2; Rev_17:3; Rev_21:10."*
* From Notes on Thessalonians, by Hogg and Vine, pp. 204, 205.
Notes: (1) For phantasma, rendered "spirit," Mat_14:26; Mar_6:49, KJV, see APPARITION. (2) For the distinction between "spirit" and "soul," see under SOUL, last three paragraphs.

The Holy Spirit
The "Holy Spirit" is spoken of under various titles in the NT ("Spirit" and "Ghost" are renderings of the same word, pneuma; the advantage of the rendering "Spirit" is that it can always be used, whereas "Ghost" always requires the word "Holy" prefixed.) In the following list the omission of the definite article marks its omission in the original (concerning this see below): "Spirit, Mat_22:43; Eternal Spirit, Heb_9:14; the Spirit, Mat_4:1; Holy Spirit, Mat_1:18; the Holy Spirit, Mat_28:19; the Spirit, the Holy, Mat_12:32; the Spirit of promise, the Holy, Eph_1:13; Spirit of God, Rom_8:9; Spirit of (the) living God, 2Co_3:3; the Spirit of God, 1Co_2:11; the Spirit of our God, 1Co_6:11; the Spirit of God, the Holy, Eph_4:30; the Spirit of glory and of God, 1Pe_4:14; the Spirit of Him that raised up Jesus from the dead (i.e., God), Rom_8:11; the Spirit of your Father, Mat_10:20; the Spirit of His Son, Gal_4:6; Spirit of (the) Lord, Act_8:39; the Spirit of (the) Lord, Act_5:9; (the) Lord, (the) Spirit, 2Co_3:18; the Spirit of Jesus, Act_16:7; Spirit of Christ, Rom_8:9; the Spirit of Jesus Christ, Php_1:19; Spirit of adoption, Rom_8:15; the Spirit of truth, Joh_14:17; the Spirit of life, Rom_8:2; the Spirit of grace, Heb_10:29."+

+ From Notes on Galatians, by Hogg and Vine, p. 193.
The use or absence of the article in the original where the "Holy Spirit" is spoken of cannot always be decided by grammatical rules, nor can the presence or absence of the article alone determine whether the reference is to the "Holy Spirit." Examples where the Person is meant when the article is absent are Mat_22:43 (the article is used in Mar_12:36); Act_4:25, RV (absent in some texts); Act_19:2, Act_19:6; Rom_14:17; 1Co_2:4; Gal_5:25 (twice); 1Pe_1:2. Sometimes the absence is to be accounted for by the fact that Pneuma (like Theos) is substantially a proper name, e.g., in Joh_7:39. As a general rule the article is present where the subject of the teaching is the Personality of the Holy Spirit, e.g., Joh_14:26, where He is spoken of in distinction from the Father and the Son. See also Joh_15:26 and cf. Luk_3:22.

In Gal_3:3, in the phrase "having begun in the Spirit," it is difficult to say whether the reference is to the "Holy Spirit" or to the quickened spirit of the believer; that it possibly refers to the latter is not to be determined by the absence of the article, but by the contrast with "the flesh"; on the other hand, the contrast may be between the "Holy Spirit" who in the believer sets His seal on the perfect work of Christ, and the flesh which seeks to better itself by works of its own. There is no preposition before either noun, and if the reference is to the quickened spirit it cannot be dissociated from the operation of the "Holy Spirit." In Gal_4:29 the phrase "after the Spirit" signifies "by supernatural power," in contrast to "after the flesh," i.e., "by natural power," and the reference must be to the "Holy Spirit"; so in Gal_5:17.

The full title with the article before both pneuma and hagios (the "resumptive" use of the article), lit., "the Spirit the Holy," stresses the character of the Person, e.g., Mat_12:32; Mar_3:29; Mar_12:36; Mar_13:11; Luk_2:26; Luk_10:21 (RV); Joh_14:26; Act_1:16; Act_5:3; Act_7:51; Act_10:44, Act_10:47; Act_13:2; Act_15:28; Act_19:6; Act_20:23, Act_20:28; Act_21:11; Act_28:25; Eph_4:30; Heb_3:7; Heb_9:8; Heb_10:15.

The Personality of the Spirit is emphasized at the expense of strict grammatical procedure in Joh_14:26; Joh_15:26; Joh_16:8, Joh_16:13, Joh_16:14, where the emphatic pronoun ekeinos, "He," is used of Him in the masculine, whereas the noun pneuma is neuter in Greek, while the corresponding word in Aramaic, the language in which our Lord probably spoke, is feminine (rucha, cf. Heb. ruach). The rendering "itself" in Rom_8:16, Rom_8:26, due to the Greek gender, is corrected to "Himself" in the RV.

The subject of the "Holy Spirit" in the NT may be considered as to His divine attributes; His distinct Personality in the Godhead; His operation in connection with the Lord Jesus in His birth, His life, His baptism, His death; His operations in the world; in the church; His having been sent at Pentecost by the Father and by Christ; His operations in the individual believer; in local churches; His operations in the production of Holy Scripture; His work in the world, etc.

(Source Vine NT dictionary)

What's your point?

 

[Cooper]

What's your point?

You asked about Spirit and I replied. Now you have lots of material to work from.

 

[stovebolts]

So, if one makes that claim the onus is on them to explain how man is a wind or breath since it's figurative language. So, guys, how is man a wind or breath? In what

Is it figurative?
What is the first thing a baby needs to do to survive moments outside of the womb?
What is the last thing you will do before you die?

 

[stovebolts]

The translation spirit is a figure of speech used for the words ruach, neshamah,

It is much more than that…. They are not synonyms.

 

[Butch5]

I thought about giving Rev 4 but then I realized he won't accept anything given for some reason.

After this I looked, and there before me was a door standing open in heaven. And the voice I had first heard speaking to me like a trumpet said, “Come up here, and I will show you what must take place after this.” 2At once I was in the Spirit, and there before me was a throne in heaven with someone sitting on it.

Look at the word Spirit. It's capitalized. The translators understand that means the Holy Spirit. Surely you wouldn't suggest that man is the Holy Spirit.

It's not that I won't accept things. I don't mean this to be rude, but you guys don't seem to understand English. The word your is in the possessive case. It shows possession. You guys are trying g to claim that it show person. We can look at any legitimate source and see that the word your is a possessive. So, why would I accept the claim when it's clearly wrong? I even used the Greek to show that in the phrase "spirit of man" the word spirit is in the genitive case which shows possession.

There are rules in language. We can't just make it up as we go.

You said I won't accept anything. Let's flip the Script. I've shown passages that state unequivocally that man "IS" flesh. You guys don't accept it. I've asked repeatedly for someone to post Scripture saying man "IS" spirit. Not a single passage has been posted. All I've gotten are passage that show man possesses a spirit. That was never in question. As I pointed out, Gen 2:7 shows us plainly that God breathed the spirit of life into man. So, yes man has a spirit or breath, but that breath is something of God, it's not man. It came out of God. Man was formed from the elements of the earth. He wasn't formed out of the substance of God. However, the breath or spirit of life is something of the essence of God that He has put into man to make man alive.

These things aren't hard to see in Scripture if we do a comprehensive study of the appropriate terms. But, if all we're going to do is proof text a few passages and put our own spin them we'll never see what the terms really mean and what the Bible really says about the issue.

We also have to ask the question, if man is a spirit why didn't the Jews know this. They had God's word for thousands of years and yet neither the Phaisees, who were the Scholars, the Scribes, nor the Saducees believed that man was a spirit. How can that be? How can those who were the Scolars of God's word for several thousand years not know that man was a spirit if in fact he is? After all, they too, had the verse everyone quotes, 'let us make man in our images. Why didn't they understand it the way modern Christians seem to? After all, they knew the Hebrew of their day better than any scholar or commentator ttoday. It was their native language.

 

[Butch5]

It is much more than that…. They are not synonyms.

I'm not sure what you mean here. I'm saying the word spirit is a figure of speech

 

[Butch5]

Is it figurative?
What is the first thing a baby needs to do to survive moments outside of the womb?
What is the last thing you will do before you die?

Breathe. Thats my point. A baby doesn't spirit as soon as it comes out of the womb.

 

[Butch5]

You asked about Spirit and I replied. Now you have lots of material to work from.

I didnt ask about spirit. I asked how is a man breath or wind? Please explain how man is breath or wind

 

[Randy]

Is it God the Spirit or the Spirit of God?

Does not the Father have His own Spirit?
And wouldn't His own Spirit have His nature? Divine; Eternal; Holy; Truth

The scripture declares Jesus was anointed by the Spirit of the One who sent Him. We know from Jesus it was the Father who sent Him and He came to do the Fathers Will.

The Spirit of the Sovereign LORD is on me, because the LORD has anointed me to proclaim good news to the poor. He has sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim freedom for the captives and release from darkness for the prisoners,

Fathers Promise
“’In the last days, God says, I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophesy, your young men will see visions, your old men will dream dreams.

Jesus-And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever— 17the Spirit of truth.

Acts-The Spirit Jesus sent in HIS name He received from the Father
Exalted to the right hand of God, he has received from the Father the promised Holy Spirit and has poured out what you now see and hear

This prophecy is attributed to Jesus and its clear to me the Father is doing the anointing by the Spirit He calls His own.
Here is my servant, whom I uphold, my chosen one in whom I delight; I will put my Spirit on him, and he will bring justice to the nations.

Paul didn't forget to honor the Spirit because it is the Fathers Spirit
yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live

The host of heaven didn't forget to honor the Spirit for its the Fathers Spirit
Then I heard every creature in heaven and on earth and under the earth and on the sea, and all that is in them, saying: “To him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb be praise and honor and glory and power, for ever and ever!”

Jesus also saw it as His Fathers Spirit and unlike the Father Jesus always spoke of that Spirit as another
Matt 10:20
for it will not be you speaking, but the Spirit of your Father speaking through you

 

[stovebolts]

Breathe. Thats my point. A baby doesn't spirit as soon as it comes out of the womb.

I think your missing the point.
Take your hand and put it next to your mouth or nose while you inhale and exhale. Do you feel the wind?
All of our life we are binging life into us, and life is going out of us. It is our breath that fogs up our glasses, or allows is to utter kind and loving words. Our breath provides oxygen for our muscles to wrap our arms around those we love, or help the elderly with tasks.
Everything we do starts with our breath. The question is, what do we do with that breath?

 

[Randy]

Look at the word Spirit. It's capitalized. The translators understand that means the Holy Spirit. Surely you wouldn't suggest that man is the Holy Spirit.

It's not that I won't accept things. I don't mean this to be rude, but you guys don't seem to understand English. The word your is in the possessive case. It shows possession. You guys are trying g to claim that it show person. We can look at any legitimate source and see that the word your is a possessive. So, why would I accept the claim when it's clearly wrong? I even used the Greek to show that in the phrase "spirit of man" the word spirit is in the genitive case which shows possession.

There are rules in language. We can't just make it up as we go.

You said I won't accept anything. Let's flip the Script. I've shown passages that state unequivocally that man "IS" flesh. You guys don't accept it. I've asked repeatedly for someone to post Scripture saying man "IS" spirit. Not a single passage has been posted. All I've gotten are passage that show man possesses a spirit. That was never in question. As I pointed out, Gen 2:7 shows us plainly that God breathed the spirit of life into man. So, yes man has a spirit or breath, but that breath is something of God, it's not man. It came out of God. Man was formed from the elements of the earth. He wasn't formed out of the substance of God. However, the breath or spirit of life is something of the essence of God that He has put into man to make man alive.

These things aren't hard to see in Scripture if we do a comprehensive study of the appropriate terms. But, if all we're going to do is proof text a few passages and put our own spin them we'll never see what the terms really mean and what the Bible really says about the issue.

We also have to ask the question, if man is a spirit why didn't the Jews know this. They had God's word for thousands of years and yet neither the Phaisees, who were the Scholars, the Scribes, nor the Saducees believed that man was a spirit. How can that be? How can those who were the Scolars of God's word for several thousand years not know that man was a spirit if in fact he is? After all, they too, had the verse everyone quotes, 'let us make man in our images. Why didn't they understand it the way modern Christians seem to? After all, they knew the Hebrew of their day better than any scholar or commentator ttoday. It was their native language.

He was caught up to heaven in the Spirit, not the body, as a witness to what God showed Him for future generations.

Paul
I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago was caught up to the third heaven. Whether it was in the body or out of the body I do not know—God knows.

I don't know why you can't accept the testimony that we are spirit, (from God), in the tent of the body. ( biology sent in motion by God in the beginning)

Its not the body that dwells in that heavenly dwelling.
For we know that if the earthly tent we live in is destroyed, we have a building from God, an eternal house in heaven, not built by human hands

 

[Cooper]

I didnt ask about spirit. I asked how is a man breath or wind? Please explain how man is breath or wind

Gen_2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

Gen_6:17 And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven; and every thing that is in the earth shall die.

Gen_7:15 And they went in unto Noah into the ark, two and two of all flesh, wherein is the breath of life.

Gen_7:22 All in whose nostrils was the breath of life, of all that was in the dry land, died.

2Sa_22:16 And the channels of the sea appeared, the foundations of the world were discovered, at the rebuking of the LORD, at the blast of the breath of his nostrils.

1Ki_17:17 And it came to pass after these things, that the son of the woman, the mistress of the house, fell sick; and his sickness was so sore, that there was no breath left in him.

Job_4:9 By the blast of God they perish, and by the breath of his nostrils are they consumed.

Job_9:18 He will not suffer me to take my breath, but filleth me with bitterness.

Job_12:10 In whose hand is the soul of every living thing, and the breath of all mankind.

Job_15:30 He shall not depart out of darkness; the flame shall dry up his branches, and by the breath of his mouth shall he go away.

Job_17:1 My breath is corrupt, my days are extinct, the graves are ready for me.

Job_19:17 My breath is strange to my wife, though I intreated for the children's sake of mine own body.

Job_27:3 All the while my breath is in me, and the spirit of God is in my nostrils;

Job_33:4 The Spirit of God hath made me, and the breath of the Almighty hath given me life.

Job_34:14 If he set his heart upon man, if he gather unto himself his spirit and his breath;

Job_37:10 By the breath of God frost is given: and the breadth of the waters is straitened.

Job_41:21 His breath kindleth coals, and a flame goeth out of his mouth.

Psa_18:15 Then the channels of waters were seen, and the foundations of the world were discovered at thy rebuke, O LORD, at the blast of the breath of thy nostrils.

Psa_33:6 By the word of the LORD were the heavens made; and all the host of them by the breath of his mouth.

Psa_104:29 Thou hidest thy face, they are troubled: thou takest away their breath, they die, and return to their dust.

Psa_135:17 They have ears, but they hear not; neither is there any breath in their mouths.

Psa_146:4 His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish.

Psa_150:6 Let every thing that hath breath praise the LORD. Praise ye the LORD.

Ecc_3:19 For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast: for all is vanity.

Isa_2:22 Cease ye from man, whose breath is in his nostrils: for wherein is he to be accounted of?

Isa_11:4 But with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and reprove with equity for the meek of the earth: and he shall smite the earth with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked.

Isa_30:28 And his breath, as an overflowing stream, shall reach to the midst of the neck, to sift the nations with the sieve of vanity: and there shall be a bridle in the jaws of the people, causing them to err.

Isa_30:33 For Tophet is ordained of old; yea, for the king it is prepared; he hath made it deep and large: the pile thereof is fire and much wood; the breath of the LORD, like a stream of brimstone, doth kindle it.

Isa_33:11 Ye shall conceive chaff, ye shall bring forth stubble: your breath, as fire, shall devour you.

Isa_42:5 Thus saith God the LORD, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein:

Jer_10:14 Every man is brutish in his knowledge: every founder is confounded by the graven image: for his molten image is falsehood, and there is no breath in them.

Jer_51:17 Every man is brutish by his knowledge; every founder is confounded by the graven image: for his molten image is falsehood, and there is no breath in them.

Lam_4:20 The breath of our nostrils, the anointed of the LORD, was taken in their pits, of whom we said, Under his shadow we shall live among the heathen.

Eze_37:5 Thus saith the Lord GOD unto these bones; Behold, I will cause breath to enter into you, and ye shall live:

Eze_37:6 And I will lay sinews upon you, and will bring up flesh upon you, and cover you with skin, and put breath in you, and ye shall live; and ye shall know that I am the LORD.

Eze_37:8 And when I beheld, lo, the sinews and the flesh came up upon them, and the skin covered them above: but there was no breath in them.

Eze_37:9 Then said he unto me, Prophesy unto the wind, prophesy, son of man, and say to the wind, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Come from the four winds, O breath, and breathe upon these slain, that they may live.

Eze_37:10 So I prophesied as he commanded me, and the breath came into them, and they lived, and stood up upon their feet, an exceeding great army.

Dan_5:23 But hast lifted up thyself against the Lord of heaven; and they have brought the vessels of his house before thee, and thou, and thy lords, thy wives, and thy concubines, have drunk wine in them; and thou hast praised the gods of silver, and gold, of brass, iron, wood, and stone, which see not, nor hear, nor know: and the God in whose hand thy breath is, and whose are all thy ways, hast thou not glorified:

Dan_10:17 For how can the servant of this my lord talk with this my lord? for as for me, straightway there remained no strength in me, neither is there breath left in me.

Hab_2:19 Woe unto him that saith to the wood, Awake; to the dumb stone, Arise, it shall teach! Behold, it is laid over with gold and silver, and there is no breath at all in the midst of it.

Act_17:25 Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things;

 

[Cooper]