Jesus said "no one has seen God," but Moses, Aaron, Jacob and Abraham, among others, saw God

[jmt356]

Jesus said:
John 1:18 “No one has seen God at any time.”

However, there are many stories in the Old Testament of people seeing God. For example, Moses, Aaron, Nadab, Abihu and seventy elders of Israel saw God:
Exo 24:9 Then Moses went up, also Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel,
Exo 24:10 and they saw the God of Israel.

God said in Exodus that no man shall see God and live. He said:
Exo 33:20 "You cannot see My face; for no man shall see Me, and live."

However, there are accounts where individuals saw God’s face and lived. Jacob reported not only that he saw God, but that he saw God “face to face,” yet lived (Gen 32:30) after wrestling with a “Man” (Gen 32:24) who Jacob surmised was God:

Gen 32:24 Then Jacob was left alone; and a Man wrestled with him until the breaking of day.
Gen 32:25 Now when He saw that He did not prevail against him, He touched the socket of his hip; and the socket of Jacob's hip was out of joint as He wrestled with him.
Gen 32:26 And He said, "Let Me go, for the day breaks." But he said, "I will not let You go unless You bless me!"
Gen 32:27 So He said to him, "What is your name?" He said, "Jacob."
Gen 32:28 And He said, "Your name shall no longer be called Jacob, but Israel; for you have struggled with God and with men, and have prevailed."
Gen 32:29 Then Jacob asked, saying, "Tell me Your name, I pray." And He said, "Why is it that you ask about My name?" And He blessed him there.
Gen 32:30 So Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: "For I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved."

There are other accounts where God manifested himself in various forms in the Old Testament and was seen by men and women who subsequently lived. For example, the “Lord” appeared to Abraham and promised he would have a son:

Gen 18:1 Then the Lord appeared to him by the terebinth trees of Mamre, as he was sitting in the tent door in the heat of the day.

The “Son of God” appeared in the furnace with Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-Nego and was seen by King Nebuchadnezzar:

Dan 3:25 "Look!" he answered, "I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire; and they are not hurt, and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God."

How can we reconcile all of these accounts of men seeing God and living with Jesus’ statement that “no one has seen God” and God’s statement that “no man shall see Me, and live”?

 

[TibiasDad]

Jesus said:
John 1:18 “No one has seen God at any time.”

However, there are many stories in the Old Testament of people seeing God. For example, Moses, Aaron, Nadab, Abihu and seventy elders of Israel saw God:
Exo 24:9 Then Moses went up, also Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel,
Exo 24:10 and they saw the God of Israel.

God said in Exodus that no man shall see God and live. He said:
Exo 33:20 "You cannot see My face; for no man shall see Me, and live."

However, there are accounts where individuals saw God’s face and lived. Jacob reported not only that he saw God, but that he saw God “face to face,” yet lived (Gen 32:30) after wrestling with a “Man” (Gen 32:24) who Jacob surmised was God:

Gen 32:24 Then Jacob was left alone; and a Man wrestled with him until the breaking of day.
Gen 32:25 Now when He saw that He did not prevail against him, He touched the socket of his hip; and the socket of Jacob's hip was out of joint as He wrestled with him.
Gen 32:26 And He said, "Let Me go, for the day breaks." But he said, "I will not let You go unless You bless me!"
Gen 32:27 So He said to him, "What is your name?" He said, "Jacob."
Gen 32:28 And He said, "Your name shall no longer be called Jacob, but Israel; for you have struggled with God and with men, and have prevailed."
Gen 32:29 Then Jacob asked, saying, "Tell me Your name, I pray." And He said, "Why is it that you ask about My name?" And He blessed him there.
Gen 32:30 So Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: "For I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved."

There are other accounts where God manifested himself in various forms in the Old Testament and was seen by men and women who subsequently lived. For example, the “Lord” appeared to Abraham and promised he would have a son:

Gen 18:1 Then the Lord appeared to him by the terebinth trees of Mamre, as he was sitting in the tent door in the heat of the day.

The “Son of God” appeared in the furnace with Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-Nego and was seen by King Nebuchadnezzar:

Dan 3:25 "Look!" he answered, "I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire; and they are not hurt, and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God."

How can we reconcile all of these accounts of men seeing God and living with Jesus’ statement that “no one has seen God” and God’s statement that “no man shall see Me, and live”?

I believe that the logical understanding of Exo 33:20, "You cannot see My face; for no man shall see Me, and live", is in his fullness of glory and power. All the other theophanies of recorded Scripture are mitigated or veiled appearances of God. Technically speaking, those who saw Jesus face to face also saw God's face and lived, but this is not the meaning of Exodus 33:20.


Doug

 

[JLB]

Jesus said:
John 1:18 “No one has seen God at any time.”

However, there are many stories in the Old Testament of people seeing God. For example, Moses, Aaron, Nadab, Abihu and seventy elders of Israel saw God:
Exo 24:9 Then Moses went up, also Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel,
Exo 24:10 and they saw the God of Israel.

God said in Exodus that no man shall see God and live. He said:
Exo 33:20 "You cannot see My face; for no man shall see Me, and live."

However, there are accounts where individuals saw God’s face and lived. Jacob reported not only that he saw God, but that he saw God “face to face,” yet lived (Gen 32:30) after wrestling with a “Man” (Gen 32:24) who Jacob surmised was God:

Gen 32:24 Then Jacob was left alone; and a Man wrestled with him until the breaking of day.
Gen 32:25 Now when He saw that He did not prevail against him, He touched the socket of his hip; and the socket of Jacob's hip was out of joint as He wrestled with him.
Gen 32:26 And He said, "Let Me go, for the day breaks." But he said, "I will not let You go unless You bless me!"
Gen 32:27 So He said to him, "What is your name?" He said, "Jacob."
Gen 32:28 And He said, "Your name shall no longer be called Jacob, but Israel; for you have struggled with God and with men, and have prevailed."
Gen 32:29 Then Jacob asked, saying, "Tell me Your name, I pray." And He said, "Why is it that you ask about My name?" And He blessed him there.
Gen 32:30 So Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: "For I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved."

There are other accounts where God manifested himself in various forms in the Old Testament and was seen by men and women who subsequently lived. For example, the “Lord” appeared to Abraham and promised he would have a son:

Gen 18:1 Then the Lord appeared to him by the terebinth trees of Mamre, as he was sitting in the tent door in the heat of the day.

The “Son of God” appeared in the furnace with Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-Nego and was seen by King Nebuchadnezzar:

Dan 3:25 "Look!" he answered, "I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire; and they are not hurt, and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God."

How can we reconcile all of these accounts of men seeing God and living with Jesus’ statement that “no one has seen God” and God’s statement that “no man shall see Me, and live”?

The context refers to God the Father.

No one has seen God the Father.

They saw the Son of God, Jesus Christ, before He became flesh.


No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him.
John 1:18



This is the revelation of the New Testament; Jesus Christ is Lord; YHWH



JLB

 

[TibiasDad]

The context refers to God the Father.

No one has seen God the Father.

They saw the Son of God, Jesus Christ.


No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him.
John 1:18



This is the revelation of the New Testament; Jesus Christ is Lord; YHWH



JLB

True enough, but if the theophany in Gen 18 was inclusive of the Father, which YHVH would indicate in the OT, then it means the Father in the fullness of his natural state.

Doug

 

[TibiasDad]

Jesus said:
John 1:18 “No one has seen God at any time

Jesus didn't say this, John did about Jesus.

Doug

 

[JLB]

True enough, but if the theophany in Gen 18 was inclusive of the Father, which YHVH would indicate in the OT, then it means the Father in the fullness of his natural state.

Doug

The Lord Jesus appeared to Abraham in Genesis 18 along with the two angels.


The Lord Jesus also appeared to Abraham in Genesis 17.


Again He appeared to Moses in Exodus 3 as the Angel of the Lord.



JLB

 

[tdidymas]

Jesus said:
John 1:18 “No one has seen God at any time.”

However, there are many stories in the Old Testament of people seeing God. For example, Moses, Aaron, Nadab, Abihu and seventy elders of Israel saw God:
Exo 24:9 Then Moses went up, also Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel,
Exo 24:10 and they saw the God of Israel.

God said in Exodus that no man shall see God and live. He said:
Exo 33:20 "You cannot see My face; for no man shall see Me, and live."

However, there are accounts where individuals saw God’s face and lived. Jacob reported not only that he saw God, but that he saw God “face to face,” yet lived (Gen 32:30) after wrestling with a “Man” (Gen 32:24) who Jacob surmised was God:

Gen 32:24 Then Jacob was left alone; and a Man wrestled with him until the breaking of day.
Gen 32:25 Now when He saw that He did not prevail against him, He touched the socket of his hip; and the socket of Jacob's hip was out of joint as He wrestled with him.
Gen 32:26 And He said, "Let Me go, for the day breaks." But he said, "I will not let You go unless You bless me!"
Gen 32:27 So He said to him, "What is your name?" He said, "Jacob."
Gen 32:28 And He said, "Your name shall no longer be called Jacob, but Israel; for you have struggled with God and with men, and have prevailed."
Gen 32:29 Then Jacob asked, saying, "Tell me Your name, I pray." And He said, "Why is it that you ask about My name?" And He blessed him there.
Gen 32:30 So Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: "For I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved."

There are other accounts where God manifested himself in various forms in the Old Testament and was seen by men and women who subsequently lived. For example, the “Lord” appeared to Abraham and promised he would have a son:

Gen 18:1 Then the Lord appeared to him by the terebinth trees of Mamre, as he was sitting in the tent door in the heat of the day.

The “Son of God” appeared in the furnace with Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-Nego and was seen by King Nebuchadnezzar:

Dan 3:25 "Look!" he answered, "I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire; and they are not hurt, and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God."

How can we reconcile all of these accounts of men seeing God and living with Jesus’ statement that “no one has seen God” and God’s statement that “no man shall see Me, and live”?

When Jesus refers to "God," He is referring to God the Father. He said "God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and in truth." John also wrote (in 1 Jn. 5) "The Spirit is the truth," and "God is love." It doesn't mean that's all God is, or that's all the Spirit is.

So in the sense that God is spirit, then we could say "no man has seen God at any time." So in the OT passages where they "saw God," they were seeing a manifestation of God's presence in angelic form. We could also say that those were Christophanies, where the preincarnate Christ was appearing to those people. It is also interesting that God spoke to Moses in various forms, and the writer of Hebrews said that it was "angels" who delivered the message (of the law of Moses - Heb. 2:2).

Therefore we can say in one sense that people saw God in angelic form or some other form (like fire, smoke, wind, etc.), and in the face of Jesus, but in another sense no one has seen God ever, or will ever, since Paul said that He "dwells in unapproachable light."
TD

 

[TibiasDad]

The Lord Jesus appeared to Abraham in Genesis 18 along with the two angels.


The Lord Jesus also appeared to Abraham in Genesis 17.


Again He appeared to Moses in Exodus 3 as the Angel of the Lord.



JLB

Fair enough. I think it could go either way as far as the Genesis passages. From a purely OT perspective, Yahweh and Elohim are always the Father, but given the NT influence it could refer to either.

Doug

 

[JLB]

From a purely OT perspective, Yahweh and Elohim are always the Father,

The New Testament reveals what the Old Testament has always established.

ELOHIM is referring to the Godhead, and is plural, of which the Father, the Word, and the Spirit are one.

The Godhead has chosen the Jesus, the name above all names, to represent it. All the fullness of the Godhead dwelt within Him, bodily.

Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness;... Genesis 1:26

Jesus is the Word, YHWH the Lord God who became flesh.


Behold, the day of the LORD is coming,
And your spoil will be divided in your midst.
For I will gather all the nations to battle against Jerusalem;
The city shall be taken,
The houses rifled,
And the women ravished.
Half of the city shall go into captivity,
But the remnant of the people shall not be cut off from the city.
Then the LORD will go forth
And fight against those nations,
As He fights in the day of battle.
And in that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives,
Which faces Jerusalem on the east.
And the Mount of Olives shall be split in two,
From east to west,
Making a very large valley;
Half of the mountain shall move toward the north
And half of it toward the south.
Then you shall flee through My mountain valley,
For the mountain valley shall reach to Azal.
Yes, you shall flee
As you fled from the earthquake
In the days of Uzziah king of Judah.
Thus the LORD my God will come,
And all the saints with You.
Zechariah 14:1-5

• Thus the LORD my God will come, and all the saints with You.

The Lord God is YHWH Elohim. We know it is Jesus the Son who comes with the saints at the end of the age when He returns to gather His people at the resurrection and rapture.

Now Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men also, saying, “Behold, the Lord comes with ten thousands of His saints, Jude 14


Again, the Lord, YHWH speaking through Zechariah the prophet says -


The burden of the word of the LORD against Israel. Thus says the LORD, who stretches out the heavens, lays the foundation of the earth, and forms the spirit of man within him:...“And I will pour on the house of David and on the inhabitants of Jerusalem the Spirit of grace and supplication; then they will look on Me whom they pierced. Yes, they will mourn for Him as one mourns for his only son, and grieve for Him as one grieves for a firstborn. Zechariah 12:1,10

Jesus is the Lord who returns at the end of the age, in which every eye will see Him.


Peter teaches us that it was Christ, the Spirit of Christ, speaking through the OT prophets.



Of this salvation the prophets have inquired and searched carefully, who prophesied of the grace that would come to you, searching what, or what manner of time, the Spirit of Christ who was in them was indicating when He testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ and the glories that would follow. 1 Peter 1:10


There is so much more.





JLB

 

[jmt356]

TibiasDad: Where does it state that Moses and Aaron saw a mitigated or veiled appearance of God? It simply states:

Exo 24:10 and they saw the God of Israel.

 

[for_his_glory]

No one can see God for He is Spirit, not flesh and bone as He comes to us in spirit and truth. What we see is God's sovereignty as His glory passes by us and speaks to us.

Exodus 24:9, 10 They saw God's sovereignty which means His power and authority.

Exodus 33:20-23 Moses could not directly look at the brilliance of God that passed by Him. It would have been like looking directly into the sun.

Genesis 32:22-32 this man was an angel sent by God that wrestled with Jacob as God spoke through the angel who was the messenger of God.

God can and has appeared in many forms for others to hear His voice in the OT and also in the NT as God's Holy Spirit speaks to us in many ways.

 

[JLB]

TibiasDad: Where does it state that Moses and Aaron saw a mitigated or veiled appearance of God? It simply states:

Exo 24:10 and they saw the God of Israel.

Who do you believe is the God of Israel?

IOW, Who do you believe they saw?



JLB

 

[jmt356]

for_his_glory:

Exo 24:9-10 does not state that Moses, Aaron, Nadab, Abihu and seventy elders of Israel saw God’s “sovereignty”; it states that they saw God. The later verses make clear that Israel saw God’s “glory”:

Exo 24:16 Now the glory of the Lord rested on Mount Sinai, and the cloud covered it six days. And on the seventh day He called to Moses out of the midst of the cloud.

Exo 24:17 The sight of the glory of the Lord was like a consuming fire on the top of the mountain in the eyes of the children of Israel.

JLB:

Exo 24:10 states that Moses, Aaron, Nadab, Abihu and seventy elders of Israel saw the “God of Israel,” which I interpret to mean the “Godhead” (i.e., the Trinity).

 

[JLB]

JLB:

Exo 24:10 states that Moses, Aaron, Nadab, Abihu and seventy elders of Israel saw the “God of Israel,” which I interpret to mean the “Godhead” (i.e., the Trinity).

Thanks for your answer.

I believe they saw the Son, who is YHWH, the Lord God.


JLB

 

[for_his_glory]

for_his_glory:

Exo 24:9-10 does not state that Moses, Aaron, Nadab, Abihu and seventy elders of Israel saw God’s “sovereignty”; it states that they saw God. The later verses make clear that Israel saw God’s “glory”:

Exo 24:16 Now the glory of the Lord rested on Mount Sinai, and the cloud covered it six days. And on the seventh day He called to Moses out of the midst of the cloud.

Exo 24:17 The sight of the glory of the Lord was like a consuming fire on the top of the mountain in the eyes of the children of Israel.

JLB:

Exo 24:10 states that Moses, Aaron, Nadab, Abihu and seventy elders of Israel saw the “God of Israel,” which I interpret to mean the “Godhead” (i.e., the Trinity).

The sight of the glory of the Lord is was a consuming fire is an analogy of the brightness of God in all His fullness that no man in this fleshly body could ever see Him and live. This is why God told Moses in Exodus 33:18-23 to stand on a rock and God would put him in the clift of the rock and cover him with His hand as He passed by.

It is only when we receive our new glorified bodies that we will then see the face of God in the New Jerusalem as there will be no need of the sun as God gives them light there. Rev 22:3-5.

I see God face to face everyday day as I am surrounded by Him in all of His creation as creation is the face of God. God is spirit, but man wants to give Him a physical body that they can see. To actually look at God would be like looking directly into the sun in all its brilliance, you just can not do it with the naked eye.

 

[K2CHRIST]

First let's get the verses complete so we are not like a news reporter looking to spin the story for entertainment:
Jn 1:15:18
John *testified about Him and cried out, saying, “This was He of whom I said, ‘He who comes after me has a higher rank than I, for He existed before me.’”
For of His fullness we have all received, and grace upon grace.
For the Law was given through Moses; grace and truth were realized through Jesus Christ.
No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him.

In Christianity we have the God the Father, God the Son, and God the Spirit as One God. Three persons, One God. In the context above we see that the "only begotten God" has "explained Him". So it should be clear enough that in context it is God the Father who nobody has seen!!!

That is obvious to anyone who really is looking for the answer instead of controversy.

The fact is that we, men/women, deal with the Son and in the Son we see the Father because Jesus Christ is the perfect image of the invisible God. We read that, right?

What gets me is the we should also know that He sends the Holy Spirit, who does not speak on His own understanding, but as the Holy Spirit hears He speaks, and there fore He takes the words of God which belong to the
Son and gives them to our spirit. (check out Jn 16) The Spirit then acts kind of like a living telephone line to Jesus Christ, the only begotten God.

Now people then, when the above event occurred were seeing the Son, the only begotten God, but John the Baptist was giving a testimony that while they saw the only begotten God He was not the Father but the One who explains Him, the Father!!

Now here is what amazes me - That we are supposed to be Christians, which are supposed to be those who hear His voice, meaning the Holy Spirit is talking to us and we should have been listening!!! So how is it we do not not this very basic information? Is it not because we are not listening, but leaning on our own understanding?

Anyway, people have seen the Son and we deal with the Holy Spirit who is sent to us. but as for the Father, He is seen through the Son. So all those examples used where we say people saw God, it was the "only begotten God", the Son!! And often that was via the Holy Spirit! So we don't see the Father except through the Son.

Jn 6:46 Not that anyone has seen the Father, except the One who is from God; He has seen the Father.

Jn 14:9 Jesus *said to him, “Have I been so long with you, and yet you have not come to know Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; how can you say, ‘Show us the Father'?

It seems like we should read the entire Bible and talk to the Lord about it, as opposed to trying to stir up controversy.

Now on a separate but similar issue:

I see God face to face everyday day as I am surrounded by Him in all of His creation as creation is the face of God. God is spirit, but man wants to give Him a physical body that they can see. To actually look at God would be like looking directly into the sun in all its brilliance, you just can not do it with the naked eye.

The above is correct. Of course seeing what someone creates is not the same as actually seeing the Creator. It is written that both the seen and the unseen was created by Him; but Him who? Jesus Christ is the first born of all creation and through Him 'that only begotten Son/God" all things were created.

Of course, if I took you to a house and explained that I made everything in the house you would understand that I did not make myself, right. So the Father brings forth His only begotten Son and gives Him a project to work on - the Creation. That Son does and says only what the Father tells Him, so you can see the Father in the Son. Of course since there is nothing Created before the Son the Son is then eternal. Indeed He is the beginning.

Like the the starting gun in a race, He is before time and indeed the start of time. He is the beginning, and when He is done with the project He will be the end of it. And yes, like mentioned in the above quote, God is spirit. The Son took on flesh but He existed before flesh or anything else.

The Father gave His only begotten Son the project to glorify the Son. Not that only, but to teach Him. Jesus learned obedience at the cross. Son does what He see the Father do, and so He teaches us. It is the Son who is the great I AM, right? It was the Son who dealt with Abraham, right? It is the Son who is alive and active, right? It is the Son of who is the Wonderful Counselor, The Might God, The Everlasting Father, and the Prince of Peace, as far as we are concerned, right? We get to know the Son personally, via His Holy Spirit, right? And this was all explained to us, right?

No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him.

 

[Truthfrees]

Jesus said:
John 1:18 “No one has seen God at any time.”

However, there are many stories in the Old Testament of people seeing God. For example, Moses, Aaron, Nadab, Abihu and seventy elders of Israel saw God:
Exo 24:9 Then Moses went up, also Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel,
Exo 24:10 and they saw the God of Israel.

God said in Exodus that no man shall see God and live. He said:
Exo 33:20 "You cannot see My face; for no man shall see Me, and live."

However, there are accounts where individuals saw God’s face and lived. Jacob reported not only that he saw God, but that he saw God “face to face,” yet lived (Gen 32:30) after wrestling with a “Man” (Gen 32:24) who Jacob surmised was God:

Gen 32:24 Then Jacob was left alone; and a Man wrestled with him until the breaking of day.
Gen 32:25 Now when He saw that He did not prevail against him, He touched the socket of his hip; and the socket of Jacob's hip was out of joint as He wrestled with him.
Gen 32:26 And He said, "Let Me go, for the day breaks." But he said, "I will not let You go unless You bless me!"
Gen 32:27 So He said to him, "What is your name?" He said, "Jacob."
Gen 32:28 And He said, "Your name shall no longer be called Jacob, but Israel; for you have struggled with God and with men, and have prevailed."
Gen 32:29 Then Jacob asked, saying, "Tell me Your name, I pray." And He said, "Why is it that you ask about My name?" And He blessed him there.
Gen 32:30 So Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: "For I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved."

There are other accounts where God manifested himself in various forms in the Old Testament and was seen by men and women who subsequently lived. For example, the “Lord” appeared to Abraham and promised he would have a son:

Gen 18:1 Then the Lord appeared to him by the terebinth trees of Mamre, as he was sitting in the tent door in the heat of the day.

The “Son of God” appeared in the furnace with Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-Nego and was seen by King Nebuchadnezzar:

Dan 3:25 "Look!" he answered, "I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire; and they are not hurt, and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God."

How can we reconcile all of these accounts of men seeing God and living with Jesus’ statement that “no one has seen God” and God’s statement that “no man shall see Me, and live”?

check out the chronology of what God said vs what people said - these people claimed they saw God yet later God says not so - imo God is correcting the erroneous claim of the people who insist they saw God - basically imo God is saying to them "you didn't actually see Me" - meaning maybe they saw a vision or angel or something

 

[Edward]

This is a good question and there are answers.
John 14:9
9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?.../

But keep reading in John 14
18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.

20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.

21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.../

So...I will manifest myself to him. But it doesn't say in full glory. And did say, if you have seen me you have seen the father...(also manifest in less than full glory). So there's no contradiction there. Many have seen God in less than His full glory. And none have seen the face of God (in full glory) and lived.

God is kind to us and, turns down the volume so that we do not die when He manifests.
And when He comes in full glory...He will destroy His enemies with the brightness of His coming. I believe they will burst into flames like a strike anywhere match. But us? We will be transformed in the twinkling of an eye into our new spiritual body wherein we will have the capacity to look upon God in His glory...and live!

 

[for_his_glory]

What it all boils down to in simplicity is that God is spirit and has not flesh and bone. God, being the word, came to earth taking on the flesh of man and now after the resurrection of Christ we behold His glory through His Son Christ Jesus in whom none of us have ever seen face to face, but the Holy Spirit bares witness of Him and the Father.

The reason we can not see God as He is in all the fulness of His glory is because we have not yet received our glorified bodies that we can look upon Him as we spend eternal life with Him. Our understanding is yet limited. God will be the light that lights up the New Jerusalem as there will be no need of the sun anymore and then we will see Him in the brilliance of the light He is that no man can look upon and live while here on earth.

 

[K2CHRIST]

What it all boils down to in simplicity is that God is spirit and has not flesh and bone. God, being the word, came to earth taking on the flesh of man and now after the resurrection of Christ we behold His glory through His Son Christ Jesus in whom none of us have ever seen face to face, but the Holy Spirit bares witness of Him and the Father.

The reason we can not see God as He is in all the fulness of His glory is because we have not yet received our glorified bodies that we can look upon Him as we spend eternal life with Him. Our understanding is yet limited. God will be the light that lights up the New Jerusalem as there will be no need of the sun anymore and then we will see Him in the brilliance of the light He is that no man can look upon and live while here on earth.

It is so important to realize that God is spirit!!

To look to God means that we must look with our spiritual eyes and not those eye balls in our head. Yet we have spiritual eyes. So the problem is that we don't use them. Yet what about those people who wrote the Bible?

Is 6:1 In the year of King Uzziah’s death I saw the Lord sitting on a throne, lofty and exalted, with the train of His robe filling the temple.

Isaiah used his spiritual eyes and saw the Lord. So what about us. I remember the first time I saw the Lord sitting on His throne. It was at a Benny Hinn event. I was sitting high up in the auditorium, and suddenly I picked up a ghostly type of image of the throne. It wasn't easy to see, but very faith. I blinked my eyes but I still saw it as it seem to descend downwards to a place above the people on the stadium floor who were hoping for a miracle. It reminded me of the throne Ezekiel saw:

Ezk 1:26 Now above the expanse that was over their heads there was something resembling a throne, like lapis lazuli in appearance; and on that which resembled a throne, high up, was a figure with the appearance of a man.

And I could make out an appearance of a rainbow behind and over the throne.

Ezk 1:28 As the appearance of the rainbow in the clouds on a rainy day, so was the appearance of the surrounding radiance. Such was the appearance of the likeness of the glory of the LORD. And when I saw it, I fell on my face and heard a voice speaking.

In front of the throne there appeared to be a large basin of water. And what I saw kept bringing to mind what I had read in different places.

Exo 35:16 the altar of burnt offering with its bronze grating, its poles, and all its utensils, the basin and its stand;

Though it was big and appeared to represent a sea.

1 Kings 7:23 Now he made the sea of cast metal ten cubits from brim to brim, circular in form, and its height was five cubits, and thirty cubits in circumference.

And there were the wheels that seem to be living with the faces, and they seem to have control over where the throne went.

Ezek 1:16The appearance of the wheels and their workmanship was like sparkling beryl, and all four of them had the same form, their appearance and workmanship being as if one wheel were within another. Whenever they moved, they moved in any of their four directions without turning as they moved.

I told my mom who had come with me what I was seeing and she hushed me. I went to explain again and a lady next to me said something like, 'It's really incredible hear.' Explaining that she comes to a lot of his events. Then Benny Hinn made a statement to the crowd that the Lord was hear, which made me wonder if he was seeing the same thing I was. Yet the event proceeded on. Benny began to announce that people were getting heal at that moment of '...' then asked that those who got healing come forward and over half that section got up and went forward. My guess was that about 500 people claimed to have gotten healing. The testimonies they gave were incredible.

The point is that God is spirit, but to see Him you have to use your spiritual eyes, but we don't use them like we should, do we!

Ezek 12:2 “Son of man, you live in the midst of the rebellious house, who have eyes to see but do not see, ears to hear but do not hear; for they are a rebellious house.

Do we not know that our 'not seeing' and 'not hearing' with our spiritual eyes and ears is a clear indication that we are a rebellious house?

God is spirit! If we are looking to Him we can see Him and hear from Him, but that does not happen with our fleshy eyes and ears!

I confess - I don't see and hear with my spiritual eyes and ears like I should, but I saw the throne come down at the event. Benny Hinn was obviously aware of the Lord coming down, but my mom didn't see it and hushed me. The lady next to me was not surprised by my testimony, but I don't think she actually saw what I saw or was aware until my testimony and Benny's announcement.

Look - the Lord gets on to me a lot about my needing to listen more to Him and to use my spiritual eyes more. and He is right to do it. Even this morning in the shower I ask Him what the plan was for today, and He answer me, "Listen to Me." That was the plan. So I listen and He asked me if I could make another post for Him.

So what is the Lord's plan for you today? Is it not also that you should listen to Him? And perhaps you should look to Him also?