Just some Gospel Truth! (for the 7th Day Sabbath)

[Elijah674]

Rom. 13 are all the second table of the Eternal covenant! So as you teach the Caesars of the Land, over rule the Lords word?? How about Acts 5:28-29! & Dan. 2:14-8!

But you do not even READ, or do not read well???

--Elijah

 

[reba]

Can you follow this??

No

 

[Elijah674]

The thing I don't understand is these groups of peopl say well, Go wants us to worship on Saturday but from what I see in the bible we shoul let our life be worship to the Lord.

I agree that the Eternal covenant is according to the KNOWLEDGE that [[WE LIVE UP TOO!]] That is why we see the Rev. 18:4 verse. Rom. 8:1 (if found there?) finds the Rom. 8:14 verse. This is what the Lord requires, to grow & MATURE in the Leading of the Holy Spirit! But the day is quickly ahead for us to know all truth. Rev. 12:17 & Eccl. 12:13-14.

--Elijah

 

[Elijah674]

Can you follow this??

No

When did Christ send back the Holy Spirit to have Christ be omnipresent? It was Christ that ordered the wicked to be executed in the OT personally. (see Acts 7:37-38 + 1 Cor. 10:3-4 )

And do not jump the gun, ;) EVERY ONE WAS GIVEN OPPORTUNITY TO REPENT! (Read Josh. 7:1-25) Even see Cain in Gen. 4:7 and note the WORD.. [IF].

Hope that this helps!

 

[Elijah674]

Lets move on to more 7th Day Sabbath timelines....

Mark.16

[1] And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him.
[2] And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun.
[3] And they said among themselves, Who shall roll us away the stone from the door of the sepulchre?
[4] And when they looked, they saw that the stone was rolled away: for it was very great.
[5] And entering into the sepulchre, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, clothed in a long white garment; and they were affrighted.
[6] And he saith unto them, Be not affrighted: Ye seek Jesus of Nazareth, which was crucified: he is risen; he is not here: behold the place where they laid him.

It sure seems clear that Christ never invisoned a 7 Day Sabbath transfer here! Heb. 13:8-9!

--Elijah

 

[Sparkey]

Greetings

Although I don't usually get involved in these discussions (I don't have a dog in this fight) I would like to ask those who support literal observance of OT LAW regarding Sabbath if they think that this should include more than just gathering on Saturday. The way that I understand the full Sabbath (rest) laws goes beyond what is often discussed and includes such things as the rest that is given to crop burdened lan, for instance when we are told to let the land lay fallow every 7 years.

It could also be said that the Year of Jubilee gives regard to the Sabbath Law (not just custom).

That's where I get confused. Trying to figure out the rubric that guides us along the choices that are necessary for those who desire to please God in this fashion. I don't condemn their effort, not by a long shot, but just don't know how to rightly apply the rules to my life. If I am asked to do something that I am unable, what then? Does it follow that I need only do what I can?

How do we choose? I'm not trying to say that anybody here is paying too much attention to the Word of God but instead wondering if the OT Laws, as given, have any universal application today.

 

[JLB]

Greetings

Although I don't usually get involved in these discussions (I don't have a dog in this fight) I would like to ask those who support literal observance of OT LAW regarding Sabbath if they think that this should include more than just gathering on Saturday. The way that I understand the full Sabbath (rest) laws goes beyond what is often discussed and includes such things as the rest that is given to crop burdened lan, for instance when we are told to let the land lay fallow every 7 years.

It could also be said that the Year of Jubilee gives regard to the Sabbath Law (not just custom).

That's where I get confused. Trying to figure out the rubric that guides us along the choices that are necessary for those who desire to please God in this fashion. I don't condemn their effort, not by a long shot, but just don't know how to rightly apply the rules to my life. If I am asked to do something that I am unable, what then? Does it follow that I need only do what I can?

How do we choose? I'm not trying to say that anybody here is paying too much attention to the Word of God but instead wondering if the OT Laws, as given, have any universal application today.

Excellent question sir.

Not only does the Law of Moses not apply to Gentiles today, who do not live in Israel, they never did apply back then.

5 You may not sacrifice the Passover within any of your gates which the Lord your God gives you; 6 but at the place where the Lord your God chooses to make His name abide, there you shall sacrifice the Passover at twilight, at the going down of the sun, at the time you came out of Egypt.Deuteronomy 16:5-6

This is just one scripture, however the Law of Moses was given to the children of Israel, for the land of Israel, and never was intended for Gentiles who lived outside of Israel.

See, I have set the land before you; go in and possess the land which the Lord swore to your fathers--to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob--to give to them and their descendants after them.' Deuteronomy 1:8


1 "Now this is the commandment, and these are the statutes and judgments which the Lord your God has commanded to teach you, that you may observe them in the land which you are crossing over to possess, 2 that you may fear the Lord your God, to keep all His statutes and His commandments which I command you, you and your son and your grandson, all the days of your life, and that your days may be prolonged. 3 Therefore hear, O Israel, and be careful to observe it, that it may be well with you, and that you may multiply greatly as the Lord God of your fathers has promised you--'a land flowing with milk and honey.' 4 "Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one! 5 You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your strength. 6 "And these words which I command you today shall be in your heart. 7 You shall teach them diligently to your children, and shall talk of them when you sit in your house, when you walk by the way, when you lie down, and when you rise up. 8 You shall bind them as a sign on your hand, and they shall be as front lets between your eyes. 9 You shall write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates. 10 "So it shall be, when the Lord your God brings you into the land of which He swore to your fathers, to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, to give you large and beautiful cities which you did not build, 11 houses full of all good things, which you did not fill, hewn-out wells which you did not dig, vineyards and olive trees which you did not plant--when you have eaten and are full-- 12 then beware, lest you forget the Lord who brought you out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage.

24 And the Lord commanded us to observe all these statutes, to fear the Lord our God, for our good always, that He might preserve us alive, as it is this day. Deuteronomy 6:1-12,24

You don't get to choose where to keep the law, or what part of the Law of Moses is to be kept.


JLB

 

[Elijah674]

Greetings

Although I don't usually get involved in these discussions (I don't have a dog in this fight) I would like to ask those who support literal observance of OT LAW regarding Sabbath if they think that this should include more than just gathering on Saturday. The way that I understand the full Sabbath (rest) laws goes beyond what is often discussed and includes such things as the rest that is given to crop burdened lan, for instance when we are told to let the land lay fallow every 7 years.

It could also be said that the Year of Jubilee gives regard to the Sabbath Law (not just custom).

That's where I get confused. Trying to figure out the rubric that guides us along the choices that are necessary for those who desire to please God in this fashion. I don't condemn their effort, not by a long shot, but just don't know how to rightly apply the rules to my life. If I am asked to do something that I am unable, what then? Does it follow that I need only do what I can?

How do we choose? I'm not trying to say that anybody here is paying too much attention to the Word of God but instead wondering if the OT Laws, as given, have any universal application today.

Hi, I try(?) very hard to keep this 'Eternal Covenant' (Heb. 13:20) separated from Moses laws that he wrote & were placed in the 'side' of the Ark where the Eternal Covenant IS LOCATED! Deut. 31:9 + Deut. 31:24-25. (then see Gal. 3:19 for when they were ALL FINISHED. And the next chapter speaks of these laws of Moses that the confusion is over.

Most people do not know the difference. So actually these ordinance that are even called such, are seen in Col. 2:14-17 + Eph. 2:15.

--Elijah

 

[Sparkey]

10 "So it shall be, when the Lord your God brings you into the land of which He swore to your fathers, to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, to give you large and beautiful cities which you did not build, 11 houses full of all good things, which you did not fill, hewn-out wells which you did not dig, vineyards and olive trees which you did not plant--when you have eaten and are full-- 12 then beware, lest you forget the Lord who brought you out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage.

I love this gentle reminder of how we are to thrive under His blessing. Of course it too has penalty of curse, but that is for our sake also.

I should probably wait before I tip my hand but one thing leads to another and I do believe in transparency, not hiding and not laying traps so; While following the admonitions and commandments and even the guidelines of God regarding the Sabbath, what exactly is the REST that was promised and what is its fulfillment as seen in the light of New Testament Scripture?

Does this go beyond assembly together on Saturday? These questions are meant to provoke thought, considered thought, which may lead to agreement. There may come those who don't want to hear, but for them with an ear to hear? Let them hear.

 

[Sparkey]

Hi, I try(?) very hard to keep this 'Eternal Covenant' (Heb. 13:20) separated from Moses laws that he wrote & were placed in the 'side' of the Ark where the Eternal Covenant IS LOCATED! Deut. 31:9 + Deut. 31:24-25. (then see Gal. 3:19 for when they were ALL FINISHED. And the next chapter speaks of these laws of Moses that the confusion is over.

Most people do not know the difference. So actually these ordinance that are even called such, are seen in Col. 2:14-17 + Eph. 2:15.

--Elijah

Thank you, and please give me some time to open my bible and follow along with your thought here. I understand that you know of a distinction between following the ordinances and the Spirit of the Law (the Covenant). I've heard you say this and things similar before and would thank you for that, it takes me some time to be able to consider your reply though.

Thanks again.

 

[reba]

Can you follow this??

No

When did Christ send back the Holy Spirit to have Christ be omnipresent? It was Christ that ordered the wicked to be executed in the OT personally. (see Acts 7:37-38 + 1 Cor. 10:3-4 )

And do not jump the gun, ;) EVERY ONE WAS GIVEN OPPORTUNITY TO REPENT! (Read Josh. 7:1-25) Even see Cain in Gen. 4:7 and note the WORD.. [IF].

Hope that this helps!

No Elijah i do not understand your posts.

 

[Elijah674]

Can you follow this??

No

When did Christ send back the Holy Spirit to have Christ be omnipresent? It was Christ that ordered the wicked to be executed in the OT personally. (see Acts 7:37-38 + 1 Cor. 10:3-4 )

And do not jump the gun, ;) EVERY ONE WAS GIVEN OPPORTUNITY TO REPENT! (Read Josh. 7:1-25) Even see Cain in Gen. 4:7 and note the WORD.. [IF].

Hope that this helps!

No Elijah i do not understand your posts.

Before Adam & Eve sinned. The Holy Spirit was very active. And it was not so after they sinned. (I see the Holy Spirit God doing the work of the Unified three)
Of the Three of the Godhead, and after sin, Christ as God was to go it alone, they were limited with a reduced Christ by being everywhere present.

When Christ as the second Adam (John 20:17) was resurrected He told Mary that He had not yet ascended to the father. But after He did so He sent the Holy Spirit back to be every where present. (you do remember that Christ said 'Ye must be Born Again? All of mankind were to be reborn)

But NEVER think that Christ was without Gods power in the OT before He became the second Adam, (Psalms 2:7 + Acts 13:33 + Heb. 1:5:5) and when it was time that He became the Son of God, He still was working mighty miracles as the second Adam. And in John 14:16-17 he gave this promise to the ones that accepted Him.

--Elijah

 

[reba]

For the life of me i have no idea of what that has to do with the OP ....

 

[Elijah674]

I think post five here will get back to the TOPIC that was the part of the question asked?

Matt. 22 + the tempting one seen in verse 35??

[36] Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
[37] Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
[38] This is the [first and great commandment.]

And seeing that ‘ones’ doctrine does not understand this or know what that means, of being FIRST PLACE in the Born Again heart?? I will leave it there!

Unless you want to come on back to argue & then there is this ‘once or twice’ from Paul in Titus 3:9-11 (for me)

But surely all of these True prophets (+ others!) LOVED THE LORD enough to OBEY HIM! [BOTTOM LINE!]

--Elijah

 

[Elijah674]

And for Reba, I was attempting to answer the question that I had thought that you were asking? My bad! (forget the subject) Or just delete it!;)

--Elijah

 

[Elijah674]

Ye Old Apologetics & Theology

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Discuss topics related to defending or proving the truth of Christian doctrines and theology.

 

[Elijah674]

Greetings

Although I don't usually get involved in these discussions (I don't have a dog in this fight) I would like to ask those who support literal observance of OT LAW regarding Sabbath if they think that this should include more than just gathering on Saturday. The way that I understand the full Sabbath (rest) laws goes beyond what is often discussed and includes such things as the rest that is given to crop burdened lan, for instance when we are told to let the land lay fallow every 7 years.

It could also be said that the Year of Jubilee gives regard to the Sabbath Law (not just custom).

That's where I get confused. Trying to figure out the rubric that guides us along the choices that are necessary for those who desire to please God in this fashion. I don't condemn their effort, not by a long shot, but just don't know how to rightly apply the rules to my life. If I am asked to do something that I am unable, what then? Does it follow that I need only do what I can?

How do we choose? I'm not trying to say that anybody here is paying too much attention to the Word of God but instead wondering if the OT Laws, as given, have any universal application today.

Hi, I try(?) very hard to keep this 'Eternal Covenant' (Heb. 13:20) separated from Moses laws that he wrote & were placed in the 'side' of the Ark where the Eternal Covenant IS LOCATED! Deut. 31:9 + Deut. 31:24-25. (then see Gal. 3:19 for when they were ALL FINISHED. And the next chapter speaks of these laws of Moses that the confusion is over.

Most people do not know the difference. So actually these ordinance that are even called such, are seen in Col. 2:14-17 + Eph. 2:15.

--Elijah

Let me try to post up a separation seen between the Lords Eternal Covenant & Moses ordinances.

Deut. 31:8-11 and then Deut. 31:24-26

Surely anyone can understand that the book of the law is not the one inside of the Ark where is the Eternal Covenant?
This is where Christ our High is putting the final touches of His work as is needed.

--Elijah

 

[Sparkey]

I would like to ask those who support literal observance of OT LAW regarding Sabbath if they think that this should include more than just gathering on Saturday.

Surely anyone can understand

Perhaps if I was as familiar with the subject as others here, yes. Well, maybe. Sometimes even the easiest thing takes a decade or so to penetrate into the soil of my understanding. That's not for lack of trying, I like to think it's because care is needed for these very important discussions. I like very firm ground and appreciate that you are showing me yours. It takes awhile for it to become my firm ground and during that time, I look to others for clear and patient explanation.

Posting and Answering post in Apologetics & Theology
This section deals with the study and practice of Theology and Apologetics. When posting or answering post in this section, users are asked to state clearly what the theological subject is, and why it is true or not true. Questions can be asked regarding the theology or the apologetic defense for the theology.

I think you're telling me why, when you mention the Scripture that shows a distinction between the Law of Moses (located beside) and the location of the Covenant and symbols of the Covenant, the branch that budded, mana, etc. (inside). The question that I've asked is more centered on "what", specifically asking for a more full understanding of what is meant by "Sabbath" and I don't think it means, "Go to church on Saturday".

 

[JLB]

I think the point by ALL the Bible text posted (which are of only a few) POINT out that the Seventh Day of the week [is] & [was] the Day that
[God Blessed & Set Aside] for the Lords day.

And personally,(?) it truly is quite understandable how a non/Sabbath keeper does have 'some' problem with the verses?

--Elijah

Just maybe if those who say, they worship the Sabbath , followed the the Sabbath laws as they are written, their message would not fall to the wayside.

I have not met, heard or read a law keeper who does not pick and choose which laws s/he want to exploit.

Exo_20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:


Lev 23:24 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, In the seventh month, in the first day of the month, shall ye have a sabbath, a memorial of blowing of trumpets, an holy convocation.


Lev 23:39 Also in the fifteenth day of the seventh month, when ye have gathered in the fruit of the land, ye shall keep a feast unto the LORD seven days: on the first day shall be a sabbath, and on the eighth day shall be a sabbath

There are more verses .....

You need to understand the two books! Read Isa. 5:1-4 & reread VERSE '3' for what God REQUIRES! And surely, the disciples in the NT started up the extension of New Israel... & all were executed except John by these ex/brethren who stayed put [[IN]] the old house. There was nothing wrong with their DOCTRINES, BUT AS ANOTHER HERE STATES, it was who they loved & put in first FIRST PLACE! And it takes both to be in Christ! Rom. 8:1 )

Isa. 5
[3] And now, O inhabitants of Jerusalem, and men of Judah, [[[judge, I pray you, betwixt me and my vineyard.]]]

These were ALL PROFESSED 7 Day Sabbath keepers, [SO WHAT WENT WRONG???] They were LEGALISTS! See John 12:42-43 for the fulfillment of the extended starting of the church.

Can you follow this??

--Elijah

Isaiah 2 was OT.

Today we believe Christ fulfilled the Law.

If not, the you yourself must keep the Sabbath as specified in the Law of Moses.

14 Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death : for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people. Exodus 31:14

The is just some truth for 7th day Sabath keepers.

If you don't follow the Law as God requires in the Law, then you yourself are guilty of breaking the Law that you say you keep.




JLB

 

[JLB]

Greetings

Although I don't usually get involved in these discussions (I don't have a dog in this fight) I would like to ask those who support literal observance of OT LAW regarding Sabbath if they think that this should include more than just gathering on Saturday. The way that I understand the full Sabbath (rest) laws goes beyond what is often discussed and includes such things as the rest that is given to crop burdened lan, for instance when we are told to let the land lay fallow every 7 years.

It could also be said that the Year of Jubilee gives regard to the Sabbath Law (not just custom).

That's where I get confused. Trying to figure out the rubric that guides us along the choices that are necessary for those who desire to please God in this fashion. I don't condemn their effort, not by a long shot, but just don't know how to rightly apply the rules to my life. If I am asked to do something that I am unable, what then? Does it follow that I need only do what I can?

How do we choose? I'm not trying to say that anybody here is paying too much attention to the Word of God but instead wondering if the OT Laws, as given, have any universal application today.

Hi, I try(?) very hard to keep this 'Eternal Covenant' (Heb. 13:20) separated from Moses laws that he wrote & were placed in the 'side' of the Ark where the Eternal Covenant IS LOCATED! Deut. 31:9 + Deut. 31:24-25. (then see Gal. 3:19 for when they were ALL FINISHED. And the next chapter speaks of these laws of Moses that the confusion is over.

Most people do not know the difference. So actually these ordinance that are even called such, are seen in Col. 2:14-17 + Eph. 2:15.

--Elijah

Let me try to post up a separation seen between the Lords Eternal Covenant & Moses ordinances.

Deut. 31:8-11 and then Deut. 31:24-26

Surely anyone can understand that the book of the law is not the one inside of the Ark where is the Eternal Covenant?
This is where Christ our High is putting the final touches of His work as is needed.

--Elijah

It is finished means no more final touches.