Just some Gospel Truth! (for the 7th Day Sabbath)

[Elijah674]

I would like to ask those who support literal observance of OT LAW regarding Sabbath if they think that this should include more than just gathering on Saturday.

Surely anyone can understand

Perhaps if I was as familiar with the subject as others here, yes. Well, maybe. Sometimes even the easiest thing takes a decade or so to penetrate into the soil of my understanding. That's not for lack of trying, I like to think it's because care is needed for these very important discussions. I like very firm ground and appreciate that you are showing me yours. It takes awhile for it to become my firm ground and during that time, I look to others for clear and patient explanation.

Posting and Answering post in Apologetics & Theology
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I think you're telling me why, when you mention the Scripture that shows a distinction between the Law of Moses (located beside) and the location of the Covenant and symbols of the Covenant, the branch that budded, mana, etc. (inside). The question that I've asked is more centered on "what", specifically asking for a more full understanding of what is meant by "Sabbath" and I don't think it means, "Go to church on Saturday".

OK: See if this helps?

Gal. 1
[6] I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:
[7] Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.
[8] But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
[9] As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

Ask your self if this was Moses law that Paul is talking about or the Eternal Covenant of God? And we had found that [ALL THE PROPHETS] are ‘subject to the prophets’. 1 Cor. 14:32
+ Johns testimony in 1John 2:3-7

OK: Next is Gal. 3:19 How do you see this ‘added law’? Surely the Lords Eternal Covenant is not this law!

Next is Eph. 2:13-15 even using the WORD of ORDINANCE!
No Eternal Covenant seen there!

Then comes Col. 2:14-16 Again called ORDINANCES! (and new moons + sabbath days ..that all feast days are called)

There is a VAST difference in what is PLACED INSIDE OF THE LORDS ARK IN HEAVEN and what Moses added!

--Elijah

 

[Sparkey]

Would it be a fair assessment on my part to think that "what was placed in the covenant in heaven" is a representation of the Spirit of the Whole Law, or do we have a better glimpse of what is there than what I am seeing?

There is a VAST difference in what is PLACED INSIDE OF THE LORDS ARK IN HEAVEN and what Moses added!

 

[Elijah674]

That is the Eternal Covenant by a standard that we are to be judged by. Eccl. 12:13-14 [mans Final END]

And this is not having anything to do with Moses law that was FINISHED when Christ was executed.

--Elijah

PS: What is the forth Commandment.

 

[Sparkey]

"Fear God and keep His commandments, For this is man’s all."

I still don't have the rubric that I can use for the determination regarding what parts of the Sabbath are "FINISHED" and what parts are active? Saying that the command, "Fear God and keep His commandments," is the part written in heaven does little to clarify the question about the commandments.

I would agree with what Jesus said about the 1st great law. But when we consider the law of the sabbath how do we treat such things as the direction regarding annual or "High Sabbaths" or Seventh Year Sabbaticals, during Shmita, where the land is left to lie fallow. It seems to me that what you are saying is that these are 'Ordinances' and can not be found in heaven, but there are some parts of the commandments that may? I still fail to clearly see the fulcrum upon which this doctrine is held.

To me? The Sabbath is about rest. The right that we, as Christians, have to quiet and peaceful habitation of the Promise given by God. It's a large picture thing. I don't know how to assert that I am resting (keeping the Sabbath) when there is anything but worship and love (which may include quiet reflection) flowing outward from me toward God, even as it is expressed toward others. This is indeed a high calling. I think that Jesus observed the Sabbath every day, and kept it in every way. Following Him is what my thought goes to when I try to understand the message and distinction regarding ordinance and the Spirit of the Law.

 

[Sparkey]

PS: What is the forth Commandment.

What you call the 4th Commandment may be found in Deuteronomy 5, and Exodus 20.

Deut 5:12–15 “‘Observe the Sabbath day, to keep it holy, as the LORD your God commanded you. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the LORD your God. On it you shall not do any work, you or your son or your daughter or your male servant or your female servant, or your ox or your donkey or any of your livestock, or the sojourner who is within your gates, that your male servant and your female servant may rest as well as you. You shall remember that you were a slave in the land of Egypt, and the LORD your God brought you out from there with a mighty hand and an outstretched arm. Therefore the LORD your God commanded you to keep the Sabbath day.

Exodus 20:8–11 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days you shall labor, and do all your work, but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the LORD your God. On it you shall not do any work, you, or your son, or your daughter, your male servant, or your female servant, or your livestock, or the sojourner who is within your gates. For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested on the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

Part of what I read here is that I am to remember what happened to me while I was in Egypt. Not trying to put too big of a point on it, but I haven't been to Egypt.

 

[Elijah674]

We are talking about the Eternal Law of God, what does the forth commandment say?? Then apply Isa. New Heavens & Earth + six days we work & then on his Eternal Sabbath the NEW... we will worship Him. (resting?) I doubt that. ;)

Isa. 65
[17] For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

[18] But be ye glad and rejoice for ever in that which I create: for, behold, I create Jerusalem a rejoicing, and her people a joy.
[19] And I will rejoice in Jerusalem, and joy in my people: and the voice of weeping shall be no more heard in her, nor the voice of crying.
[20] There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed.
[21] And they shall build houses, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and eat the fruit of them.
[22] They shall not build, and another inhabit; they shall not plant, and another eat: for as the days of a tree are the days of my people, and mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands.
[23] They shall not labour in vain, nor bring forth for trouble; for they are the seed of the blessed of the LORD, and their offspring with them.

And Isa. 66 says...
[22] For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
[23] And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.

And this is the Heavenly place of our dwelling. And we will work & then come together for worship on the Sabbath day.

--Elijah

 

[Sparkey]

We are talking about the Eternal Law of God

Sorry, did I stray too far from your topic? I can accept that you don't have answers to the larger question that I've asked.

To whom he said, This is the rest with which you may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear.

Matthew 11:28 "Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest."
Matthew 11:29 "Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls."
Isaiah 11:10 "In that day the Root of Jesse will stand as a banner for the peoples; the nations will rally to him, and his resting place will be glorious."
Isaiah 30:15 "This is what the Sovereign LORD, the Holy One of Israel, says: "In repentance and rest is your salvation, in quietness and trust is your strength, but you would have none of it."
Isaiah 32:17 "The fruit of that righteousness will be peace; its effect will be quietness and confidence forever."
Isaiah 32:18 "My people will live in peaceful dwelling places, in secure homes, in undisturbed places of rest."
Jeremiah 6:16 "This is what the LORD says: "Stand at the crossroads and look; ask for the ancient paths, ask where the good way is, and walk in it, and you will find rest for your souls. But you said, 'We will not walk in it.'"
Psalm 81:11-13 "But my people would not listen to my voice; and Israel would none of me…"
Zechariah 7:11,14 "But they refused to listen, and pulled away the shoulder, and stopped …"

Exodus 23:12 Six days thou shalt do thy work, and on the seventh day thou shalt rest: that thine ox and thine ass may rest, and the son of thy handmaid, and the stranger, may be refreshed.
Exodus 34:21 Six days thou shalt work, but on the seventh day thou shalt rest: in earing time and in harvest thou shalt rest.

Rest, as recommended by Jesus: "And he said unto them, Come ye yourselves apart into a desert place, and rest a while: for there were many coming and going, and they had no leisure so much as to eat. And they departed into a desert place by ship privately (Mark 6:31-32)."

2 Thessalonians 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,

And as a final note:

Hebrews 4:1-11 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it. For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it. For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works. And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest. ...

 

[TRUTH over TRADITION]

Just some Gospel Truth! (for the 7th Day Sabbath) Rev. 1 [10] I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day,

E, I know I might regret this but I just gonna inform the informer that the 'Lord's Day' spoken of in Revelation does not reference any particular day of the week. So for you to use this verse to promote the 7th Day Sabbath is ignorant at best or dishonest at worst.

 

[Elijah674]

Sorry, did I stray too far from your topic? I can accept that you don't have answers to the larger question that I've asked.



Matthew 11:28 "Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest."
Matthew 11:29 "Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls."
Isaiah 11:10 "In that day the Root of Jesse will stand as a banner for the peoples; the nations will rally to him, and his resting place will be glorious."
Isaiah 30:15 "This is what the Sovereign LORD, the Holy One of Israel, says: "In repentance and rest is your salvation, in quietness and trust is your strength, but you would have none of it."
Isaiah 32:17 "The fruit of that righteousness will be peace; its effect will be quietness and confidence forever."
Isaiah 32:18 "My people will live in peaceful dwelling places, in secure homes, in undisturbed places of rest."
Jeremiah 6:16 "This is what the LORD says: "Stand at the crossroads and look; ask for the ancient paths, ask where the good way is, and walk in it, and you will find rest for your souls. But you said, 'We will not walk in it.'"
Psalm 81:11-13 "But my people would not listen to my voice; and Israel would none of me…"
Zechariah 7:11,14 "But they refused to listen, and pulled away the shoulder, and stopped …"



Rest, as recommended by Jesus: "And he said unto them, Come ye yourselves apart into a desert place, and rest a while: for there were many coming and going, and they had no leisure so much as to eat. And they departed into a desert place by ship privately (Mark 6:31-32)."

2 Thessalonians 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,

And as a final note:

Hebrews 4:1-11 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it. For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it. For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works. And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest. ...

Well post 46 says it all for me! And your 'Rest' verses do not make any sense to me?? (floating around on a cloud doing nothing)
No, we will work six actual days & then go to New Jerusalem for Worship of our Loving Maker! (at least that is what I will be doing)

And what about all the prophets agreeing?? 1 Cor. 14:32 [ALL]

Then came along Paul with the Truth as stated by Peter in 2 Peter 3:16 about 'some' being troubled!
[16] As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

But 1 John 2:2-7 clears it all up!

[4] He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
[5] But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.

[6] He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.
[7] Brethren, I write no new commandment unto you, but an old commandment which ye had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning.

And 'RESTING' in Jesus as in taking a 24 hr. nap? No way to sell that to me!

--Elijah

 

[Sparkey]

No way to sell that to me!

I wasn't the one selling something here, my friend. I do notice when you fail to understand my meaning you poke fun talking about sitting around on the clouds and doing nothing. I was quoting the Word of God and would appreciate the respect that you expect for yourself, sir, even when you are misunderstood.

That being said, and with nothing to sell, I'll withdraw, noting only that my question about the larger picture remains unanswered.

Blessings, Elihah674, I know you mean well.

 

[JLB]

Just some Gospel Truth! (for the 7th Day Sabbath) Rev. 1 [10] I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day,

E, I know I might regret this but I just gonna inform the informer that the 'Lord's Day' spoken of in Revelation does not reference any particular day of the week. So for you to use this verse to promote the 7th Day Sabbath is ignorant at best or dishonest at worst.

Actually the Lord's day is a reference to Sunday, the day He rose from the dead.

Resurrection Day!


JLB

 

[JLB]

And 'RESTING' in Jesus as in taking a 24 hr. nap? No way to sell that to me!

The rest of us have gave up on having a meaningful conversation with you, except Sparrowhawke.

He has been extremely meek and kind to you, showing great patients and brotherly understanding.

Why would you disrespect him like that?

Makes no sense. Nor does anything you write.


JLB

 

[Elijah674]

No way to sell that to me!

I wasn't the one selling something here, my friend. I do notice when you fail to understand my meaning you poke fun talking about sitting around on the clouds and doing nothing. I was quoting the Word of God and would appreciate the respect that you expect for yourself, sir, even when you are misunderstood.

That being said, and with nothing to sell, I'll withdraw, noting only that my question about the larger picture remains unanswered.

Blessings, Elihah674, I know you mean well.

Well who has a chip on their shoulder?? (me or you??) And judging what was meant even? (an attempt at mind reading?) You are the one posting which says that the LORDS is for RESTING! (not me, & with a number of verses of 'rest' for proof?)

But even so, what does that mean.. resting?

And what does that do with the Lords ETERNAL COVENANT! Heb. 13:20
I suspect that that is answered in Dan. 7:25 by a Beast/Church united power that came on the scene.

And what do you do.. put your tail between your legs & run on home to mama?? ((and see all of the question marks!)) Sincerely young man, 'i' think that you need to MATURE! (and that is a judgment call?? yet with a question mark)

Jude.1
[1] Jude, the servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James, to them that are sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ, and called:
[2] Mercy unto you, and peace, and love, be multiplied.

[3] Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.

And what about the pre/flood ones who were given 120 years of the Holy Spirits STRIVING? Gen. 6:3

And you must think that being a 7th. Day Sabbath believer is a picnic????? Look at the replies sent in!
And for all the others 7 day Sabbath keepers we hold to the 7th day Sabbath is all! See Matt. 23:3

And 7 Day Adventist are being shaken to the core as we speak, but who know about that? 2 Thess. 2:1-3

But what ever? Just do your 'LED' by the spirit thing??

--Elijah

 

[Sparkey]

Sorry, Elijah674, you've misunderstood me. Put the emphasis on the last words that I said and understand that I would not ask blessings for you, unless I knew in my heart that you are and continue to be a friend of God. I've only unsubscribed from this thread because there is no longer any expectation within me that our conversation can arrive at mutual understanding. You're putting words into my mouth and I would object, but really? I don't mind. My heart is known well enough. And, my friend, yours is too.

Take it from me, there is absolutely no ill will here. I know that the Lord has powerfully blessed you and join my "amen" to any who pray for you in love.

~Sparrow

 

[westtexas]

As always Sparrowhawke, a well said and thoughtful reply!

 

[Elijah674]

OK: Back to the posted material. These have been given 'many' a thought!

Matt. 5

[17] Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

Matt. 5

[18] For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
[19] Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Mark 2

[27] And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:

Luke 23:54-56

[54] And that day was the preparation, and the sabbath drew on.
[55] And the women also, which came with him from Galilee, followed after, and beheld the sepulchre, and how his body was laid.
[56] And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment.

And surely the Lord would have told his Mother that it was laid aside if it were so!

--Elijah

 

[Pizzaguy]

OK: Back to the posted material.

Not so fast.

I am getting sick and tired of this "Christian" board. (It's not just YOU, Elijah...) The way you talked to Sparrow was disappointing to say the least.
He was gracious and understanding - not trying to offend at all - and read how you responded to him.

Are we brothers in the Lord or not? Is what I read on this board an example of how we will speak to one another in the Lord's presence? I think NOT.

We all will account for our words one day. I believe that we had better remember that today.

 

[Pizzaguy]

Today is the day to mind our own words.

 

[Brother Mike]

Today is the day to mind our own words.

I have hired Reba and SparrowHawk to help with my words. I also wonder why Reba does not come up as being a misspelled word in my spell checker. Very suspicious if you ask me.

 

[Elijah674]

Today is the day to mind our own words.

You also are joining the crowd??;) Surely that is putting man ahead of Christ huh??? And ones FIRST DUTY??

But lets just get to post 56? Or do you have more nice 'judge mental' words for me??

--Elijah