Liberals and Conservatives

[reba]

closed for clean up violations of 2.2

Discussion of Catholic doctrine is limited and will only be allowed in the One on One Debate Forum and End Times forum only. RCC content in the End Times forum should relate to End Times beliefs. Do not start new topics elsewhere or sway existing threads toward a discussion or debate that is may be viewed as ‘Catholic’ in nature.

 

[reba]

This thread is reopened ....

 

[JohnD]

Liberals make the mistake of recognizing no authority.

Conservatives make the mistake of substituting the Bible for the Lord as the source of authority. It is true that God and Jesus are frequently quoted in the Bible, and their words must be obeyed, but it is God and his Son, Jesus, who possess authority, not the Bible.

Psalm 138:2 (KJV)
2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.

1 John 4:1 (KJV)
1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

Acts 17:11 (KJV)
11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

 

[By Grace]

Liberals make the mistake of recognizing no authority.

Conservatives make the mistake of substituting the Bible for the Lord as the source of authority. It is true that God and Jesus are frequently quoted in the Bible, and their words must be obeyed, but it is God and his Son, Jesus, who possess authority, not the Bible.

In the political realm,

Liberals complain that conservatives have no heart.
Conservatives complain that liberals have no brain

THAT should cause some sort of dust up!

 

[Barth Jones]

Liberals make the mistake of recognizing no authority.

Conservatives make the mistake of substituting the Bible for the Lord as the source of authority. It is true that God and Jesus are frequently quoted in the Bible, and their words must be obeyed, but it is God and his Son, Jesus, who possess authority, not the Bible.

 

[Barth Jones]

"Conservative," and "liberal," are both misnomers. Even as generally understood I subscribe to neither.

 

[evenifigoalone]

I left a comment, but then I realized this thread is about conservative and liberal theology, not political theories. But I see the two types used almost interchangeably a lot. To hear some talk, any kind of liberal is the bane of evil or something.
(Actually, classic liberalism is closer to today's political conservatives and libertarians than it is to today's liberals. Word's meanings change over time.)

 

[By Grace]

I left a comment, but then I realized this thread is about conservative and liberal theology, not political theories. But I see the two types used almost interchangeably a lot. To hear some talk, any kind of liberal is the bane of evil or something.
(Actually, classic liberalism is closer to today's political conservatives and libertarians than it is to today's liberals. Word's meanings change over time.)

Could you elaborate on that statement in blue?

 

[evenifigoalone]

Could you elaborate on that statement in blue?

To my understanding, "liberal" back 100, 200 years ago involved a political theory of limited government power. (Which would be almost polar opposite of today's liberals in the US.) Liberty from the government. I'm told in some countries (not the US), that's what it still means.
Now that is economically. I'm not entirely sure what classic liberalism thought about the social aspect.

I hear the republican party used to be very different, too, but I don't know much about that at all.

 

[WIP]

The way I have understood the difference between liberal and conservative is from the definition of these two words.
Someone that is liberal by definition is one who is loose or lax or open-minded or quicker to accept change. A liberal finds it easier to embrace new ideas.
Someone that is conservative is one who is strict, tighter, more resistant to change. A conservative will hold on to his views longer and have to be convinced that change is beneficial.

 

[evenifigoalone]

Yeah, although the political definition is more specific than that. I guess is this is the base definition for the two words, that is why the more specific definitions of them change over time. The liberals of one generation are the conservatives of the next.

 

[WIP]

Please clarify what you mean by your last sentence.

 

[evenifigoalone]

It's a quote I remember reading in a book. (I don't remember if it was a book by C.S. Lewis or a book that was kinda sorta about him. Probably the latter.) And I think it makes sense, to some degree or another. The ideas that those who are liberal, as in willing to accept new ideas, accept, later on become the norm and the views the conservatives of a future generation hold to. I'm not good at explaining things.

 

[Gregg]

Conservatism vs Liberalism is like offering either the blue pill or the red pill. The choice could also be another [a white pill], neither, or both at the same time.

There are strengths and weakness in both Conservatism vs Liberalism. But where justice, truth, and love are present - I could work with either.

What will we call the Theocracy when Jesus returns?

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Jesus was a liberal of his day, but we see him as conservative today.
When I rebel against the false doctrine being taught today in the church, I see myself as being liberal.
But my agreement with the truth of Christ is very conservative.

 

[for_his_glory]

Sometimes people revere the Bible (book) more than God. I demonstrated this once when I use to teach in the prisons here. I held the Bible above my head and then dropped it on the floor and stood on it. Two of the inmates stood up and yelled at me for doing that, but the rest knew exactly what I was trying to bring across to them. We know that scripture is written through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, but also it was man that wrote the words of their accounts of walking with Jesus or hearing Him teach. Some had first hand accounts of His signs and wonders, but others had Spiritual accounts not even knowing Jesus while he was here on earth. Paul comes to mind. The word holds authority and power through that of Gods Spirit as it gives us instruction on how to live a life that is pleasing to the Father. How do we know it is truth, by applying what God said to our own lives to know for a surety that it is Gods truth through His spoken word penned by man and by us having that personal relationship with Christ.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

I've always been taught the reverence of God's word.
No, I would not purposely drop it.
No, I would never stand on it.
No, I don't put anything on top of it.
There is nothing in the physical world more important than the Word of God.
If a person worships the Bible more than God, that's their problem.
If a person stomps on top of the Bible, than that's their problem.
You could stomp on your pastor's head and it would be less problematic than stomping on the Bible.

 

[reba]

We stand on His Word

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

We stand on His Word

Are you saying that you stomp on the Bible, Madam Administrator?

 

[reba]

I said we stand on His Word.
For_His_Glory was not being disrespectful in making the point she made. There might be a case where i would do the same. I use my Bibles they are beat-up, marked up dogged eared.. taped.. some even have a good cover of dust ..... One is in two hunks... the oldest one is my treasure , it was one of dad's, when i open it little peaces of the pages flutter to the floor.
Growing up in a Bible reading/believing home i was bless with some knowledge... abusing the essence of His Word IMO would be stomping on it.. Knowing what He asks of us and not trying to abide is abusing His Word.