Living without sin?

[Hopeful]

That is why verse 17 is used for the reference, because it says "now", as in not a past life.

It is if one is speaking from an old POV.
Have you ever replayed an event in your past life wherein you act as though you were "in the moment"?

The understanding of the flesh was proper, and I would be lying if I said I have no idea why you are making this leap on my behalf. I also now understand you are in the role of someone thinking the old man is somehow dead while you yet still draw breath. That says all I need to know. Thank you for the conversation.

I would like to copy/paste Rom 8:1-11, but my computer is acting up.
The old man is dead, as per Rom 6:6..."Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin."
I believe it and walk after the Spirit now.

 

[PaulChristensen]

Thanks for the recommendation for this book, but I'm not much for reading books. The Holy Spirit will always convict us when we fall short and brings us to the place of repentance with a humbled heart.

No problem at all. I downloaded the book as a pdf file and saved in my Voice-Dream app in my iPad, so I can have a very pleasant British voice reading it to me to save my elderly eyes from eye strain.

 

[PaulChristensen]

Aren't they who submit to God non-sinners?
No man can serve two masters, so servants of sin don't serve God.

Sin and temptation are always with us and we make mistakes more often than we would like. But as David said, "There is forgiveness with thee that thou mayest be feared". Tripping, falling and getting up again is quite different from staying on the ground and letting sin dominate us. We become servants of sin when we allow sin to get right through to our hearts. When we are walking with the Lord, the Holy Spirit stops our errors to get as far as our hearts, and gives us the way of escape through directing us to the throne of grace that we will find mercy and grace to help in our time need.

 

[PaulChristensen]

It is if one is speaking from an old POV.
Have you ever replayed an event in your past life wherein you act as though you were "in the moment"?

I would like to copy/paste Rom 8:1-11, but my computer is acting up.
The old man is dead, as per Rom 6:6..."Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin."
I believe it and walk after the Spirit now.

If I think that I am getting closer to perfectly walking in the Spirit, I ask my 29 year old daughter if she thinks I am. Her answer usually stops that flight of fancy! She would say, "Oh, come on Dad. Get off the grass!"

 

[Hopeful]

Sin and temptation are always with us and we make mistakes more often than we would like.

Temptation may always accompany our walk on earth, but sin doesn't need to.
Jesus gave us the means to kill the old "fleshly" minded man and to be reborn of His seed.

But as David said, "There is forgiveness with thee that thou mayest be feared". Tripping, falling and getting up again is quite different from staying on the ground and letting sin dominate us. We become servants of sin when we allow sin to get right through to our hearts. When we are walking with the Lord, the Holy Spirit stops our errors to get as far as our hearts, and gives us the way of escape through directing us to the throne of grace that we will find mercy and grace to help in our time need.

Jesus said "He who committeth sin is the servant of sin." (John 8:34)
There goes your justification for a fall and get up again theme.
One sin shows who a man serves, and as Jesus said "No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon." (Matt 6:24)
Sinners hate God.

 

[Hopeful]

If I think that I am getting closer to perfectly walking in the Spirit, I ask my 29 year old daughter if she thinks I am. Her answer usually stops that flight of fancy! She would say, "Oh, come on Dad. Get off the grass!"

Kill the old man and it will happen instantly.
Just as it is written..."2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.

 

[JLB]

Aren't they who submit to God non-sinners?

Those who obey Jesus Christ as Lord are given eternal life.

No man can serve two masters, so servants of sin don't serve God.

Servants of sin reap the wages of sin; eternal damnation.


Thank goodness if we should sin, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. The unsaved do not.


John includes himself in this passage —

• If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.
My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. 1 John 1:8-2:1





JLB

 

[Hopeful]

Those who obey Jesus Christ as Lord are given eternal life.




Servants of sin reap the wages of sin; eternal damnation.


Thank goodness if we should sin, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. The unsaved do not.


John includes himself in this passage —

• If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.
My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. 1 John 1:8-2:1
JLB

Servants of God don't serve any other master.

 

[for_his_glory]

No problem at all. I downloaded the book as a pdf file and saved in my Voice-Dream app in my iPad, so I can have a very pleasant British voice reading it to me to save my elderly eyes from eye strain.

That's a great idea. Sometimes it is better to listen at your leisure.

 

[JLB]

Servants of God don't serve any other master.

Unbelievers do not have Jesus as an Advocate.

Jesus is an Advocate for Christians, not unbelievers.



Thank goodness if we should sin, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. The unsaved do not.


John includes himself in this passage —

• If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves,and the truth is not in us.

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.
My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. 1 John 1:8-2:1

 

[Adradtos275]

I just caught a little flak for posting about life without sin.
It got me wondering...isn't that the point of giving up this world to follow Christ?

I want you to define for me what giving up this world means to you . What does it entail ?

 

[Edward]

I said it before but now I found the scripture.

Philemon 1:6
6 that the sharing of your faith may become effective by the acknowledgment of every good thing which is in [b]you in Christ Jesus.../

So I do acknowledge that...I am the Righteousness of God in Christ Jesus...!!! ...in my spirit. My soul has to wait until the Lord's 2nd Coming.

 

[Hopeful]

Unbelievers do not have Jesus as an Advocate.

Anyone looking for the Advocate was an unbelieving sinner first.

Jesus is an Advocate for Christians, not unbelievers.
Thank goodness if we should sin, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. The unsaved do not.

What you are saying is that the seed of God CAN bring forth liars. adulterers, and thieves.
1 John 3:9-10 refutes that idea.

John includes himself in this passage —

• If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves,and the truth is not in us.

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.
My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. 1 John 1:8-2:1

If those walking in darkness say the have fellowship with God they are liars and do not the truth. (1 John 1:6)
Is John also including himself in that bunch?
Or is he in the group that walks in light and CAN say he does have fellowship with God?

John is writing about two very different kinds of men in 1 John 1.
Some of the verses apply to those who walk in light (which is God), and other verse apply to those walking in darkness (sin).

If one walking in darkness (sin) says he has no sin, it is a lie.
But those walking in the light (God) can say they have no sin, because there is no sin in God.
Or do you think there IS sin in God?

 

[Hopeful]

I want you to define for me what giving up this world means to you . What does it entail ?

A lot, starting with a real, permanent turn from sin.
I won't list all the evil things of the flesh, but will say they are avoided by those who walk in the Spirit instead of in the flesh.
Like Paul wrote..."Abstain from all appearance of evil." (1 Thes 5:22)

 

[Hopeful]

I said it before but now I found the scripture.

Philemon 1:6
6 that the sharing of your faith may become effective by the acknowledgment of every good thing which is in [b]you in Christ Jesus.../

So I do acknowledge that...I am the Righteousness of God in Christ Jesus...!!! ...in my spirit. My soul has to wait until the Lord's 2nd Coming.

If you are "in Christ Jesus", you are righteous.
Is there sin "in Christ"?
No.
Those with sin "in them" are not in Christ either.

 

[JLB]

Anyone looking for the Advocate was an unbelieving sinner first.

Thank goodness, children of God do indeed have an Advocate in heaven if they sin.


Jesus is an Advocate for Christians, not unbelievers.

What you are saying is that the seed of God CAN bring forth liars. adulterers, and thieves.

No those are your words that you are using to misrepresent me.

Please don’t do that.


Just read what the scripture so plainly says, and adjust your theology to line up with God’s truth rather than continuing to promote a man made doctrine that is not from Christ. That is not from the truth.

• If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 1 John 1:8-10

• If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

This confessing of sin, is for believers, children of God. Unbelievers, who are not God’s children do not have this promise, since they do not believe in Christ or His sacrifice on the cross.



JLB

 

[Hopeful]

Thank goodness, children of God do indeed have an Advocate in heaven if they sin.

Your base point, that children of God commit sin, is a moot point.
It is written..."Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him." (1 John 3:6)
And..."He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother." (1 John 3:8-10)
You are implying that grape vines can bear figs.

 

[Truthfrees]

Your base point, that children of God commit sin, is a moot point.
It is written..."Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him." (1 John 3:6)
And..."He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother." (1 John 3:8-10)
You are implying that grape vines can bear figs.

would you say the most misunderstood point AFTER the one above is HOW to deal with temptation so that one does NOT sin?

in any case can you speak to that point? - what kinds of things best help a person successfully resist temptation? - what kinds of things weaken one's ability to successfully resist temptation?

God bless you

 

[JLB]

Your base point, that children of God commit sin, is a moot point.

That is not my base point and is a lie.

Do you understand what John is saying here.

He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. 1 John 3:8


committeth - Strong's G4160 - poieō

1. to make
   1. with the names of things made, to produce, construct, form, fashion, etc.
   2. to be the authors of, the cause
   3. to make ready, to prepare
   4. to produce, bear, shoot forth
   5. to acquire, to provide a thing for one's self
   6. to make a thing out of something
   7. to (make i.e.) render one anything
      1. to (make i.e.) constitute or appoint one anything, to appoint or ordain one that
      2. to (make i.e.) declare one anything
   8. to put one forth, to lead him out
   9. to make one do something
      1. cause one to
   10. to be the authors of a thing (to cause, bring about)
2. to do
   1. to act rightly, do well
      1. to carry out, to execute
   2. to do a thing unto one
      1. to do to one
   3. with designation of time: to pass, spend
   4. to celebrate, keep
      1. to make ready, and so at the same time to institute, the celebration of the passover
   5. to perform: to a promise

This word implies that it is practiced. It’s enjoyed and continues to be fulfilled as something that is perpetually performed.


It’s practiced. It works both ways. Practicing righteousness is expected from children of God. Practicing sin is of the devil.


Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous. 1 John 3:7


In this the children of God and the children of the devil are manifest: Whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is he who does not love his brother. 1 John 3:10







My Point:

The children of God have an Advocate in heaven, if they should sin.

The children of God can confess their sin and be forgiven and cleansed of all unrighteousness.

This is my point and it’s clear.


If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.
1 John 1:8-10


Claiming you are sinless, when you physical body does in fact contain sin, and is at war against the Spirit within us, each and every moment of every day, trying to tempt us to give in to its lustful cravings, is only deceiving yourself and those whom you are trying to convince.

• If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
• If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

Claiming you have no sin, is making Him out to be a liar.


John who wrote this inserts himself in this instruction.


Practicing sin, (committing sin) or practicing unrighteousness is a different story.


Again when I asked you if you believe Christians can confess their sins and be forgiven you replied no, they don’t need to because true ChristIan’s do not sin.



Is this what you believe?




JLB

 

[JLB]

You are implying that grape vines can bear figs.

This is a false claim and misrepresenting me.

You have made up a false narrative about what I believe at least two or three times now.


Last warning,



Please don’t misrepresent me again.




JLB