Looking for a church

[sourberry]

I wonder if such church exists, where the focus would not be on doctrines and teachings, and no teaching would prevail, but the focus was on the heart and what Jesus thinks of the heart?

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Sounds New Age to me.

 

[sourberry]

Needs to be centered on Jesus Christs.

 

[Mike S]

I wonder if such church exists, where the focus would not be on doctrines and teachings, and no teaching would prevail, but the focus was on the heart and what Jesus thinks of the heart?

Try an unprogrammed Quaker meeting, they have a silent worship. Their doctrine is that they have no doctrine at all. You can locate a meeting at the Friends General Conference website. http://www.fgcquaker.org/connect/quaker-finder

 

[sourberry]

That is not what I meant, but thanks.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

You can't center on Jesus if you know nothing about him.
It's all in the Scriptures, but you say no Scriptures.
Definitely New Age.

 

[sourberry]

Jesus did not write any Scriptures. However I understand what you mean, as I think.

I have some thoughts about the scriptures, however they are just my thoughts, not a doctrine. Somebody may have different thoughts about the scriptures, and I do not see this as an issue, as long as neither of the thoughts are imperative to the others.

 

[Christ_empowered]

Why don't you just go church shopping locally? Visit one on a Wednesday night, another on a sunday, so on and so forth.

 

[sourberry]

Why don't you just go church shopping locally? Visit one on a Wednesday night, another on a sunday, so on and so forth.

I do not feel I will succeed.

Whether people call themselves trinitarians or unitarians, and whether they treat Sunday or Sabbath - they do it for the Lord. If some doctrines make people closer to God, that is great.

I do not have issues with the doctrines, they just do not reside in my heart. You see?.

 

[Mike S]

I do not feel I will succeed.

Whether people call themselves trinitarians or unitarians, and whether they treat Sunday or Sabbath - they do it for the Lord. If some doctrines make people closer to God, that is great.

I do not have issues with the doctrines, they just do not reside in my heart. You see?.

If you're not willing to make an effort, what are you doing here and why are you asking for advice? There is only one why you're going to find a church...look for it.

 

[farouk]

I wonder if such church exists, where the focus would not be on doctrines and teachings, and no teaching would prevail, but the focus was on the heart and what Jesus thinks of the heart?

This brings us back to the central question of Who is the Lord Jesus, and what does the Bible say about Him and His death at the Cross?

Without a a doctrinal emphasis, and with no particular teaching prevailing, I'm not sure whether such a group could in the strictest sense be called a New Testament church...

 

[farouk]

Jesus did not write any Scriptures. However I understand what you mean, as I think.

I have some thoughts about the scriptures, however they are just my thoughts, not a doctrine. Somebody may have different thoughts about the scriptures, and I do not see this as an issue, as long as neither of the thoughts are imperative to the others.

"Christ died for our sins, according to the Scriptures".

"It is written".

Wherever you go in the New Testament, reference to, and fulfilment of, the Scriptures in relation to the Lord Jesus will not be far away.

 

[sourberry]

If you're not willing to make an effort, what are you doing here and why are you asking for advice? There is only one why you're going to find a church...look for it.

Guilty as charged. If you were to find home churches, how would you do it?

 

[sourberry]

"Christ died for our sins, according to the Scriptures".

"It is written".

Wherever you go in the New Testament, reference to, and fulfilment of, the Scriptures in relation to the Lord Jesus will not be far away.

Yes, we have written sermons. And I do not have an answer why we have written sermons. I do not have an answer why they are written.

There are many things I do not understand. You may say that somebody can read these written sermons, and then go and preach.

I do not know what is better? Is is better to read written sermons, or is it better to listen to the preacher who has read the written sermons?

 

[farouk]

Yes, we have written sermons. And I do not have an answer why we have written sermons. I do not have an answer why they are written.

There are many things I do not understand. You may say that somebody can read these written sermons, and then go and preach.

I do not know what is better? Is is better to read written sermons, or is it better to listen to the preacher who has read the written sermons?

Orally, or in writing, it all needs to be checked out from the Bible, right? about who the Lord Jesus is? about what I am without Him, etc.

Having people in front of you telling you about Him, does make it more urgent.

 

[sourberry]

This brings us back to the central question of Who is the Lord Jesus, and what does the Bible say about Him and His death at the Cross?

Without a a doctrinal emphasis, and with no particular teaching prevailing, I'm not sure whether such a group could in the strictest sense be called a New Testament church...

I did not plan to dwell into scriptures in this thread, but it might be worthy to look how Paul, in my opinion, solves the problem of doctrines, and avoids separation of the church into denominations:

20 To the Jews I became as a Jew in order to gain Jews; to those under law I became as under law, though I myself am not under law, in order to gain those under law.
21 To those without law I became as without law, although I am not without law toward God but under law toward Christ, in order to gain those without law.
22 To the weak I became weak, in order to gain the weak. I have become all things to people of all sorts, so that I might by all possible means save some.
23 But I do all things for the sake of the good news, in order to share it with others.

 

[sourberry]

Orally, or in writing, it all needs to be checked out from the Bible, right? about who the Lord Jesus is? about what I am without Him, etc.

Having people in front of you telling you about Him, does make it more urgent.

You are trying to dive into doctrines, and that is fine in my opinion. You think that all needs to be checked out from Bible. It is a doctrine. And it is all fine, as I think.

Preaching is not just telling, in my opinion. I do not think that Paul, or those that joined him in fellowship would carry a set of books saying - "hey, what we preach is in these books, and you need to check that all what we are preaching is in these books" (synagogue is a special case, when Paul would use Moses books). There were no books, as I think, but there was living water running out of the belly, this is how Gentiles were preached. You see? The doctrine of Bible came later, as I think.

 

[farouk]

I did not plan to dwell into scriptures in this thread, but it might be worthy to look how Paul, in my opinion, solves the problem of doctrines, and avoids separation of the church into denominations:

20 To the Jews I became as a Jew in order to gain Jews; to those under law I became as under law, though I myself am not under law, in order to gain those under law.
21 To those without law I became as without law, although I am not without law toward God but under law toward Christ, in order to gain those without law.
22 To the weak I became weak, in order to gain the weak. I have become all things to people of all sorts, so that I might by all possible means save some.
23 But I do all things for the sake of the good news, in order to share it with others.

Paul here is talking about his presentation of the truth to people of different backgrounds, rather than about the heart of the body of Biblical doctrine that he above almost anyone else strove to assert.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

I did not plan to dwell into scriptures in this thread, but it might be worthy to look how Paul, in my opinion, solves the problem of doctrines, and avoids separation of the church into denominations:

20 To the Jews I became as a Jew in order to gain Jews; to those under law I became as under law, though I myself am not under law, in order to gain those under law.
21 To those without law I became as without law, although I am not without law toward God but under law toward Christ, in order to gain those without law.
22 To the weak I became weak, in order to gain the weak. I have become all things to people of all sorts, so that I might by all possible means save some.
23 But I do all things for the sake of the good news, in order to share it with others.

"15 So then, brothers and sisters, stand firm and hold fast to the teachings we passed on to you, whether by word of mouth or by letter." (2 Thessalonians 2:15 NIV)

14 Take special note of anyone who does not obey our instruction in this letter. Do not associate with them, in order that they may feel ashamed.15 Yet do not regard them as an enemy, but warn them as you would a fellow believer." (2 Thessalonians 3:14-15 NIV)

Paul wrote 2 Thessalonians. Paul insists that we maintain denominational separation from those who do not obey his teachings in his written letters.

 

[sourberry]

Paul here is talking about his presentation of the truth to people of different backgrounds, rather than about the heart of the body of Biblical doctrine that he above almost anyone else strove to assert.

I agree.

I also think that Jewish background may have had so many doctrines, that Paul would need to go through some process of reconciliation to gain and save some Jews.

The last thing Paul would allow is for the teachings and doctrines to separate the church, as I think.