Millennium

[jasoncran]

I think Reba is pointing out the apostiloc teaching that the natural and by nature lesser, preceeds the spiritual and by nature greater.

Natural Israel in that way preceeds spiritual Israel. And that is the pattern, allowing for no circular motion back to the natural.

what did the apostles mean in acts 1 with this? will thou at this time restore the kindgom to isreal?

if we are isreal today and have replaced that nation why would they ask such a DUMB question as by then knew that they were in the kingdom of heaven when they came to christ?

and take note of the response from the LORD he didnt say no, he said go and make disciples and that is not for me to now the times and season but for the father only.

so the apostles lost something when the lord said behold the kingdom is nigh? repent for the kingdom is at hand

and when we repent we are adopted as sons of God and whereby cry abba ,father

also are we not ambassadors for christ and an ambassador has to have a country and king to represent.
Do they not?

 

[Alabaster]

Was Dave's rule, nation and throne typical of anything?

So seated in heaven next to the Father surrounded in glory is no better than coming to earth where sin and death still operate even to the point of resulting in open rebellion after 1,000 years of perfect rule?

That's right. You are the only one who is making some sort of comparison. Why is that? As Jesus has a thousand year reign on the planet coming to Him, I should think it would be just as glorious as anything He receives from the Father.

 

[Alabaster]

Hmmm So when God set forth the plan that Jesus would come to earth to to the work of the cross and being raised from the dead ascend to the Throne and send the Comforter-He mad a mistake .You have implyed above that Christ's bodily presence is necessary to for him to gain the reward of his sacrfice. It follows then the God's plan outlined above is inadequate to fulfill his purpose.

The only inadequacy is people's failure to receive Christ.

In reality though Christ seated in Heaven and the Holy Spirit ministering on earth is the best possible program for expansion of the kingdom. If there were a better way God would have used it.

You are thinking only in terms of the Church Age. That ends when Jesus removes the Church. We are discussing the Millennial Age.

Jesus doesn't only sit enthroned in heaven now, but He will establish His throne in Jerusalem.

 

[Hitch]

That's right. You are the only one who is making some sort of comparison. Why is that? As Jesus has a thousand year reign on the planet coming to Him, I should think it would be just as glorious as anything He receives from the Father.

Then you shouldnt have any trouble explaining why the presence of sin and death on earth is as glorious as Heaven is today.

 

[Hitch]

what did the apostles mean in acts 1 with this? will thou at this time restore the kindgom to isreal?

if we are isreal today and have replaced that nation why would they ask such a DUMB question as by then knew that they were in the kingdom of heaven when they came to christ?

Because thay didnt have the entir canon of scripture or two thousand years of christian history to work from

and take note of the response from the LORD he didnt say no, he said go and make disciples and that is not for me to now the times and season but for the father only.

Jesus said he would remove thekingdom from Isrel and give it to a nation that would bear the fruit of it. Why should he take if from the nation bearing the fruit? Doesnt the fact teh JESUS said that new nation would indeed bear the fruit indicate that it deserves and does well with the kingdom ?

so the apostles lost something when the lord said behold the kingdom is nigh? repent for the kingdom is at hand

I havent the foggiest

and when we repent we are adopted as sons of God and whereby cry abba ,father

also are we not ambassadors for christ and an ambassador has to have a country and king to represent.
Do they not?

1. Peter 2:9
   But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;
   1 Peter 2:8-10 (in Context) 1 Peter 2 (Whole Chapter)

 

[Hitch]

The only inadequacy is people's failure to receive Christ.



You are thinking only in terms of the Church Age. That ends when Jesus removes the Church. We are discussing the Millennial Age.

Jesus doesn't only sit enthroned in heaven now, but He will establish His throne in Jerusalem.

Hmmm looks like in the parable of the Sower the Harvest is the end and at that tiem there is a complete seperation of the good and the evil.

But then Jesus thinks the resurrection is at the last day, I dont think he understood the dispensations very well.

 

[jasoncran]

Because thay didnt have the entir canon of scripture or two thousand years of christian history to work from Jesus said he would remove thekingdom from Isrel and give it to a nation that would bear the fruit of it. Why should he take if from the nation bearing the fruit? Doesnt the fact teh JESUS said that new nation would indeed bear the fruit indicate that it deserves and does well with the kingdom ? I havent the foggiest

1. Peter 2:9
   But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;
   1 Peter 2:8-10 (in Context) 1 Peter 2 (Whole Chapter)

one would think that the lord will tell them plainly when they asked a dumb question, and uh do you really think that the nt states anything new. read the ot and see that it doesnt.

i can find just about anything the lord says in the ot.

heres a quick one.

paul:
for he is not a jew outwardly but one inwardly

moses.
circumise the foreskin of your HEART and therefore be no more stiff necked.

same promise as in faith to all that believed ot and nt.

but not in land

where does it state the christian has any land by location forever?
it doesnt

to the jew it does in the ot.

we dont replace the jew you gentiles are grafted in.

his promised to the jew is what the gentiles recieved. Paul's states that plainly.

Does this mean that the gentile reigns or live only in isreal , no

 

[farouk]

jasoncran:

Faith is the key; it's the inward state of the heart, not the outward ceremonial situation that counts for God according to the NT. (At the same time, those who are cleased by the blood of Christ are called to be separate, too.)

 

[jasoncran]

jasoncran:

Faith is the key; it's the inward state of the heart, not the outward ceremonial situation that counts for God according to the NT. (At the same time, those who are cleased by the blood of Christ are called to be separate, too.)

i know that,

why did jesus say to the jews for if ye knew moses yould know me?

what did he mean by that?

He tell us in that next sentence

for he(moses)spoke of me.

and paul said that moses forsook the riches and wealth of egypt seeing that the reproach of the cross was some better thing.

hmm moses knew jesus?

comments

 

[farouk]

Jasoncran:

I think part of the answer is in Hebrews 11, where it says the Old Testament saints 'received not the promises', but saw them afar off, but 'were persuaded of them and embraced them, and confessed they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth'.

 

[jasoncran]

Jasoncran:

I think part of the answer is in Hebrews 11, where it says the Old Testament saints 'received not the promises', but saw them afar off, but 'were persuaded of them and embraced them, and confessed they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth'.

partly but your arent seeing what i'm saying

first the nt isnt nothing new just a rehash.
get deep in the ot and you will see that. and what i mean by this that cross is central to the nt but what is said by the lord really isnt new at all.

if you read the entire ot its all there.

for instance in order to be forgiven in the ot way(sacrifice)
faith was needed
you had to actually stop the same sin.

the problem was that the law didnt give you the strength but read up on the faithful that the paul talks about and see if you dont see any semblance of christ.

when the men of faith moved in the lord they were also able to see what we saw.
they didnt understand it when they wrote it but we having the full picture can look back and see it clearly.

 

[Sissy]

Was Dave's rule, nation and throne typical of anything?

Yes.
That father/son (David/Solomon) was a type of another Father/Son who would rule from the same throne.

1 Chronicles 29
(23) Then Solomon sat on the throne of the LORD as king instead of David his father, and prospered; and all Israel obeyed him.

 

[farouk]

The beginning of Psalm 110 is also interesting in this regard.

 

[Alabaster]

Then you shouldnt have any trouble explaining why the presence of sin and death on earth is as glorious as Heaven is today.

That is a very weird comment, but I chalk it all up to the lack of understanding of God's great plan.

Sin and death will exist until it is cast into the Lake of Fire AFTER the Millennium.

Heaven is not our ultimate home. It is Earth, the New Earth.

 

[Hitch]

Yes.
That father/son (David/Solomon) was a type of another Father/Son who would rule from the same throne.

1 Chronicles 29
(23) Then Solomon sat on the throne of the LORD as king instead of David his father, and prospered; and all Israel obeyed him.

Exactly.
What throne is Jesus seated at today if not the throne of the LORD?

 

[Hitch]

That is a very weird comment, but I chalk it all up to the lack of understanding of God's great plan.

Sin and death will exist until it is cast into the Lake of Fire AFTER the Millennium.

Heaven is not our ultimate home. It is Earth, the New Earth.

That's right. You are the only one who is making some sort of comparison. Why is that? As Jesus has a thousand year reign on the planet coming to Him, I should think it would be just as glorious as anything He receives from the Father.

Hence my comment.

Then you shouldnt have any trouble explaining why the presence of sin and death on earth is as glorious as Heaven is today.

 

[Hitch]

one would think that the lord will tell them plainly when they asked a dumb question, and uh do you really think that the nt states anything new. read the ot and see that it doesnt.

i can find just about anything the lord says in the ot.

heres a quick one.

paul:
for he is not a jew outwardly but one inwardly

moses.
circumise the foreskin of your HEART and therefore be no more stiff necked.

same promise as in faith to all that believed ot and nt.

but not in land

where does it state the christian has any land by location forever?
it doesnt[/to the jew it does in the ot.

we dont replace the jew you gentiles are grafted in.

his promised to the jew is what the gentiles recieved. Paul's states that plainly.

Does this mean that the gentile reigns or live only in isreal , no

I have no idea what you mean Jason.

 

[Sissy]

Don’t you find it interesting that most will readily accept the typologies of the actual sacrifices, temple, priesthood, and even the king (David) all as typologies of Christ and His church.
But when it comes to the actual kingdom of Israel, their minds are closed to it being a typology, and they insist that the kingdom of Israel must forever remain literal and not a typology at all.

It may be beneficial to discuss the typologies of the kingdom of Israel and the king of Israel, instead of arguing back and forth about it.
Each individual will of course draw their own conclusion, but at least we will be better informed on the subject.

 

[Alabaster]

Hence my comment.

Then you shouldnt have any trouble explaining why the presence of sin and death on earth is as glorious as Heaven is today.

Once again, that is a very weird comment, and has no basis.

 

[jasoncran]

I have no idea what you mean Jason.

simple our faith is jewish in origin not gentile.

read up and look at the lord and his lineage and what an actual jew is(not all are blood to abraham) and then you will see exactly what paul meant by being grafted in.

to whom did the lord come to first? the jew.

and then Paul and others went to the gentile.

one would first have to assume that the apostle when they asked that stupid question that the never got it about the kingdom of heaven , and them already possesing and the lord just ok remain in your stupidity then.

But he didnt surely if apostles need to know that why would the lord at a later time tell them that and not just then?(the gentiles and the idea of non-literal kingdom of isreal being the idea here)