Miracle Or Hoax?

[reba]

2 other moderators have suggested a bit of decorum, now the third keep it polite or don't post.

 

[Brother Mike]

Well, I don't think your testimony is a hoax, Mike. I think by God's grace, through your faith, you stood on the Word of God, and you received what the Lord had for you and your family.
Your son's life is a Miracle. Don't think it cost you a dime either.

Well, we do believe in Doctors, and do believe you need to do all that you can to stand, STAND!!! It was a lot cheaper than it could have been. Fight all colds, fevers, with everything you got. It does not belong to us. Don't substitute Aspirin for a Headache over taking authority and prayer, then Aspirin. Get God involved in everything, even the little things.

God made our bodies to self heal. If it was not His will to heal, none of out cuts would close up, or the Body fight infections. Doctors can't heal anyone, they help the body not be so taxed so the body can do what God designed it to do. If the Doctors can't do anything, and the body can't keep up, we still have Jesus on the throne and in charge.

When Delia Knox walked for the first time in 23 yrs. it was on the national news and the net. The world did take notice. Can we blame the world for skepticism, that God heals, when so many Christians don't believe either and we can't blame the Christians for their skepticism when there are so many fakes in it for the money, fame or both.

People that personally knew them will tell you, The women was paralyzed. These are people that ate with them and spent time with the family personally. Even if she just was able to walk a little, then a little more it's still God. Jesus said you shall lay hands on the sick and they shall (Be instantly healed??) or did He say recover? James said anoint them with Oil and God shall (Instantly heal them?) or rise them up?

Healing, the gift of healings is a Holy Spirit anointing that comes on someone as the (Spirit wills) I find it hard to believe you can just hold meetings and make a demand on the Holy Spirit like that where everyone that comes up gets healed. It may make a good TV show, but I just don't see it working that way.

Jesus only did what He saw His Father do. That was with every instant healing, everything, He got direction first, then acted. Jesus said the Works I do, ye shall do. I find it hard to believe that if Jesus had gotten direction on everyone He healed, then we don't need to?

My Pastor trained for 20 years under Kenneth Hagin. Talk about Miracles, but my Pastor taught in Rhema healing school and only ran Healing lines if directed by the Holy Spirit, most of it was just teaching the Word and getting people encouraged in God. He models our own Healing school after Rhema and it's all teaching and sharing with others to give encouragement. I have yet to see an instant healing there, but I have heard many testimonies about people getting stronger, the cancer just going away, the circulation and veins regrowing.

Every single (Instant) Healing God had me involved in I heard direction first. I think a lot of skepticism is Christians don't understand faith and patience inherit the promise without wavering, They think if God heals it has to be instant and not something you just believe the word only on and take an immovable stance, and like you said those "fake" healers. I don't understand how Brother Hinn can just run every meeting with little teaching and expect all these instant miracles. God deals with each person as a person, it's not like in Jesus day where they did not have the Word to stand and believe on.

Mike.

Shame on those who teach little children that these fakers are actually channeling the power of the creator of the universe. Shame on those who poison children's brains with false hope. Not every child who is diagnosed with cancer will have such good fortune, no matter how much "faith" they have.

As opposed to what other hope? You put your faith in something, right? Give up? My child is not going out by cancer or any other means. I have covenant with God, and my kids are included in that. There were some kids we met that did die, same hospital as my son. Is what we believed and whom I believed in make a difference?

In fact that is the question, Does faith in God for anything make a difference as opposed to someone that does not know God?

 

[Guest]

@VirginShallConceive Check out definition 2..http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/Faith?s=t

Do you grant every claimed miracle that you ever heard throughout your entire life the same validity?


Why or why not?

Do you know what God's goodness looks like.

 

[Deborah13]

Dr. Walter Martin on the topic of Miracles (mp3 lecture):


http://www.apologetics315.com/2008/04/lecture-on-miracles-by-walter-martin.html

Thank you for sharing this. A familiar voice from the past.
Dr Martin presents very intelligent answers to David Hume's circle argument against miracles.

When we limit what can happen, to what we understand to be the laws of nature, we are in fact telling the Creator, who created those laws, that we are limiting Him. We are telling Him that He can only do those things that we understand, in the way that we will accept, at the time we will accept, and by the people we will accept.

 

[VirginShallConceive]

I don't think that I could classify this one as a hoax. It is either a miracle, or something somewhat ordinary that is being pumped up as being more extraordinary than it actually is:

[video=youtube;hQSJprLbRZ0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hQSJprLbRZ0[/video]

 

[lw9]

Edward: These are excellant scriptures, but how would one try these spirits? If he's a faker, he'll deny and say "truth!" and if it's real he'll say "truth!"

The charlatans usually don't just claim to heal. They also typically claim to be prophets and 'specially anointed' teachers. So put them to the Biblical test --

Prophets must be 100% correct with no error or falsehood.
Deut 18:20 But the prophet who shall speak a word presumptuously in My name which I have not commanded him to speak... that prophet shall die. 21 And you may say in your heart, `How shall we know the word which the Lord has not spoken?' When a prophet speaks in the name of the Lord, if the thing does not come about or come true, that is the thing which the Lord has not spoken. The prophet has spoken it presumptuously. Do not be afraid of him.

2 Pet 2:1 But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them – bringing swift destruction on themselves. 2 Many will follow their shameful ways and will bring the way of truth into disrepute. 3 In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up.

Jer 23:21 “I did not send these prophets, yet they have run with their message. I did not speak to them, yet they have prophesied. 22 But if they had stood in my council, they would have proclaimed My words to My people and would have turned them from their evil ways and from their evil deeds.”

Jer 23:25 “I have heard what the prophets say who prophesy lies in my name. They say, ‘I had a dream! I had a dream!’ 26 How long will this continue in the hearts of these lying prophets, who prophesy delusions of their own minds?

Jer 28:9 But the prophet who prophesies peace will be recognized as one truly sent by the Lord only if his prediction comes true.

Eze 22:28 Her prophets whitewash these deeds for them by false visions and lying divinations. They say, ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says’ – when the Lord has not spoken.

Eze 33:33 When all this comes true – and surely it will – then they will know that a prophet has been among them.

True prophets must come only in the name of the Lord.

Deut 18:20 'But the prophet who speaks a word presumptuously in My name which I have not commanded him to speak, or which he speaks in the name of other gods, that prophet shall die.'

Prophets must bring the true word of God.
How many ‘prophets’ today preach the true Christ of the Bible? How many water down the message for the masses? How many avoid speaking of sin and repentance but instead appease with news of riches and health and that God is tolerant of all?

Jer 23:21 “I did not send these prophets, yet they have run with their message. I did not speak to them, yet they have prophesied. 22 But if they had stood in my council, they would have proclaimed My words to My people and would have turned them from their evil ways and from their evil deeds.”

Jer 23: 26 “Let the [false] prophet who has a dream tell his dream, but let the one who has My word speak it faithfully.”

Prophets must live according to God’s word.
The fruits of the spirit will be obvious in them.

Matt 7:15 “Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. 16 By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles. 17 Likewise every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. “

Jer 23:14 “And among the prophets of Jerusalem I have seen something horrible: They commit adultery and live a lie.”

Jer 23:10 The prophets follow an evil course and use their power unjustly.”

If you do a little research on Todd Bentley, you'll find he's a false prophet and false teacher, left his wife for another woman while at the height of his 'prophetic' fame, has forcefully kicked and punched people during 'healings' [it's all on youtube, people], and has made wild claims of visions and dreams that do not fit with scripture. Judge from scripture and the conclusion becomes very clear.