Mormonism

[waitinontheLamb]

I can tell you that when I left the mormon faith a few months ago, I lost my wife, stepkids, aunt, uncle, cousins, and many friends.

A person sometimes is incapable of facing these things. It is very important that when a person leaves the mormon faith or any cult for that matter that they see there is a body of Christians waiting to befriend them and be a shoulder to cry on.

 

[Veritas]

waitnontheLamb:
When I was here, I attacked those who really were trying to help me. I got myself in a corner and acted like a wild animal. I am so very sorry. I would like to know from the board if my being here is okay with them. I understand if there are some who would say no. I have already contacted Judy and she knows who I am and has welcomed me. I will not though post further unless the board is okay with my doing so.

Thanks for your ear and please know that I am sorry.

HALLELUIAH!!! Welcome back!!!! I pray that the Lord will keep you close.

I can tell you that when I left the mormon faith a few months ago, I lost my wife, stepkids, aunt, uncle, cousins, and many friends.

I am so sorry to hear that. I hope and pray that the Christians you are with can help give you the comfort and hope that you need.

This may seem kind of dorky (I hope not).... but here are some verses that have truely helped me in my times of trouble. I actually keep them in my wallet so I can read them when I want.

He heals my broken heart and binds up my wounds. Psalm 147:3
(I changed the wording a bit for me)

I am He who blots out your transgressions for My own sake and remembers your sin no more. Isaiah 43:25

"For I know the plans I have for you" declares the Lord, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future." Jer. 29:11

Be joyful always, pray continually; give thanks in all circumstances, for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus. 1 Thes. 5:16-18

Take heart, son; your sins are forgiven. Mat 9:2

All things are possible with God. Mark 10:27

 

[Rick W]

Are you in the valley waitinontheLamb?
If so try Calvary Chapel of Salt Lake (non-denominational) pastored by Terry Long. Used to attend for some years. The spirit is definity there and they do have experience in situations which you find yourself. They've helped a lot of people in these circumstances. A visit may very well be worth your while.
Suit and tie not necessary. 8-)

http://calvaryslc.org/index.php
460 Century Drive
Just west of Rt 15 off of 4500 south across from Lowe's about 2 blocks north.

 

[Solo]

I can tell you that when I left the mormon faith a few months ago, I lost my wife, stepkids, aunt, uncle, cousins, and many friends.

A person sometimes is incapable of facing these things. It is very important that when a person leaves the mormon faith or any cult for that matter that they see there is a body of Christians waiting to befriend them and be a shoulder to cry on.

Welcome back, waitinontheLamb!

I am sorry to hear about your difficulties with family in leaving the mormon faith, but know that your brothers and sisters in Christ will stand with you. Now you can have assistance in praying for their salvation and release.

God bless you and yours,
Michael

 

[waitinontheLamb]

Are you in the valley waitinontheLamb?
If so try Calvary Chapel of Salt Lake (non-denominational) pastored by Terry Long. Used to attend for some years. The spirit is definity there and they do have experience in situations which you find yourself. They've helped a lot of people in these circumstances. A visit may very well be worth your while.
Suit and tie not necessary. 8-)

http://calvaryslc.org/index.php
460 Century Drive
Just west of Rt 15 off of 4500 south across from Lowe's about 2 blocks north.

That is kind of cool. I have attended Calvary for about five years now (except of course my nine month hiatus). I love Terry. He is a close friend and one who dearly loves the Lord. I used to co-run the bookstore/coffee house there as well. Do you attend there at any time?

 

[waitinontheLamb]

Welcome back, waitinontheLamb!

I am sorry to hear about your difficulties with family in leaving the mormon faith, but know that your brothers and sisters in Christ will stand with you. Now you can have assistance in praying for their salvation and release.

God bless you and yours,
Michael

Thank you Solo and it is very nice to have your blessings as I have lashed out at you so many times. Thanks brother.

 

[Rick W]

That is kind of cool. I have attended Calvary for about five years now (except of course my nine month hiatus). I love Terry. He is a close friend and one who dearly loves the Lord. I used to co-run the bookstore/coffee house there as well. Do you attend there at any time?

I moved back to Pa about 1 1/2 years ago. Ted, the organ player, moved on just before I left Salt Lake City. I missed him a lot.
Yeah, Terry's great! Before they got to the building where they are now they were further south somewhere around 7800S 700E thereabouts. anyway, they were still growing then. Upon my first visit he said from the podium (to nobody in particular) "If there's something I say that offends you please hold your peace until after the service. We can meet in my office where I'll tell you some more things you're not going to like."
:-D
I thought... "Yep, this is the place." 8-)
I was still having a hard time with Terry changing from his normal jeans and shirt though. Somehow that jacket he wears isn't quite "him". :-D

I'll lay odds we've passed each other a time or three.

 

[Rick W]

Here's a pic of one of my step-granddaughters being baptised. Well, in the pic she's talking with Terry before the actual dunk.

 

[waitinontheLamb]

Yeah, the jacket is a crackup! He never wears it anymore. He rides his harley all the time and is in the Bikers for Christ ministry. I have photos of me in the same tank. We have a brand new worship ministry in the church now. Very good. Terry still says things like that too. Now he says, if you are not offended yet, hang around a little while. I guarantee I will offend you.

He cracks me up.

 

[Rick W]

If you want your ears tickled don't go there... if you want the truth that's the place to be. I've not known another pastor like him. In his opening prayer he usually included, "Lord, help me stay out of the way ..." He has just the right mixture of authority and humor I found refreshing.
I think because of the lack of sugar-coating the church grew as it did. There is no put on, no show, no beating around the bush. But that was mixed with a large portion of compassion and honest love for the people he comes in contact with.

 

[MrVersatile48]

From http://www.crosswalk.com

SBC Warns Christians about Teachings of Mormonism
Allie Martin

Rob Bowman with the North American Mission Board of the Southern Baptist Convention (SBC) says Christians need to be aware that the beliefs of the Mormon Church are inconsistent with biblical Christianity.

As one Mormon candidate launches his White House bid, the Southern Baptist official is urging Christians to take advantage of materials his denomination offers that teach the truth about Mormonism.

As former Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney officially announced his presidential candidacy this week, a cover story in USA Today looked at the beliefs of the Mormon Church, formally known as the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

Rob Bowman, manager of the apologetics and interfaith evangelism department of the SBC's North American Mission Board (NAMB), thinks Christians would be wise to take an even closer look at the Mormons, lest any be deceived about the nature and tenets of that religious group.

He says although the Mormon Church wages an expensive public relations campaign, using terms familiar to appeal to evangelicals, the core teachings of the church do not line up with scripture and are inconsistent with evangelical Christianity.

For this reason, Bowman says the SBC has for decades offered, through its various entities, information resources focusing on the Mormon Church.

Many of these resources detail the differences between Christian and Mormon beliefs -- of which there are many, the NAMB official observes.

For example, Bowman notes, "In 15 short years, [Mormon Church founder] Joseph Smith went from being a thoroughgoing monotheist, a believer in one god, to a thoroughgoing polytheist, teaching the existence of many gods."

Also, he points out, the Latter-day Saints teach that humans can achieve godhood by joining the church and taking part in specific deeds and ceremonies.

Such divergent beliefs are among the reasons, the NAMB official asserts, why Christians must know the Bible, so as not to be fooled by non-biblical Mormon teachings.

As for the Mormon Church members themselves, he adds, "Our concern is that they don't really know the God of the Bible. So we're concerned for their salvation."

The concern of Bible-believing Christians is that Mormons do not know the real Jesus of scripture, Bowman explains.

The SBC's desire, he says, is not only to see evangelicals learn about the differences between Mormonism and Christianity but also to see Mormons come to know Jesus and have an authentic relationship with Him.

 

[Jeff Mills]

An interesting thread. We have many Mormons here in Guatemala trying to convert the Christians already converted and they have left a trail of pain in families. If a husband or wife converst and the other partner doesn't they advise you divorce your partner! I always ask them to answer 1 Galatians 1:8 "But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other Gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed."
I am always couteous to them and often invite them to come to my house for a chat but they never take the offer up. I wonder why?

 

[waitinontheLamb]

So, here is the latest in the attacks from satan on me...

He has been whispering that when I left to go back into mormonism, I actually left Jesus and that I am no longer saved.

Anyone have any input for this one?

Thanks.

 

[christian_soldier]

waitin,

God's Word says you will not be snatched from the Father's hand.

Is it possible to jump out of it?

Mormonism teaches an entirely different 'Jesus'. They present Jesus as a creation, and brother of Lucifer.

Come back to the fold!

 

[Rick W]

Just wondering:
Have you talked with Terry lately or haven't you sought his advice?

 

[Vic C.]

So, here is the latest in the attacks from satan on me...

He has been whispering that when I left to go back into mormonism, I actually left Jesus and that I am no longer saved.

Anyone have any input for this one?

Thanks.

Hi Curtis. Yes, I have a thought... maybe it's not satan whispering. ;-)

christian_soldier was on to something... though there are many folds, I'd say, Come back to His flock! Folds are confined to pens. The flock gets to graze freely! :angel:

Anyway, I have a question that has been troubling me. I was discussing this on another Site.

How does the Mormon church stand on Biblical historicism? I ask because it has come to my attention that they baptize on behalf of the dead. They get this from here:

1 Cor 15:29 Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead?

Do you know who the "they" is in that verse? They are pagans form a town not too far from Corinth. It seems they did baptize people in the name of the dead. (baptism is practiced by more than just Christians) It also seems that Paul was trying to correct this problem by asking the Corinthians why they adopted this practice. For the next passage says:

1 Cor 15:30 And why stand we in jeopardy every hour?
1 Cor 15:31 I protest by your rejoicing which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily.
1 Cor 15:32 If after the manner of men I have fought with beasts at Ephesus, what advantageth it me, if the dead rise not? let us eat and drink; for to morrow we die.
1 Cor 15:33 Be not deceived: evil communications corrupt good manners.
1 Cor 15:34 Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.

If Paul is admonishing them for doing so, then no church who claims to be Christian should be doing it also.

Any thought? Anyone??

 

[Rick W]

Yes Vic, they baptize for the dead, hence the interest in geneology. The mormon geneology records are kept on microfilm and are second to none in the US.

You have to get permission or a temporary recommend to practice baptism by proxy. This is not to be confused with a full temple recommend which by the way is necessary to marry in the temple. Nobody without the temple recommend are allowed to attend the wedding, only those who have qualified are granted access. That includes the parents of the groom or bride. So when a couple tells you, "WE were married in the temple" you're supposed to be duly impressed.

And there's the "Temple Endowment Ceremony".

Your Endowment is, to receive all those ordinances in the House
of the Lord, which are necessary for you, to enable you to walk back to
the presence of the Father, passing the angels who stand as sentinels,
being enabled to give them the key words, the signs and the tokens,
pertaining to the Holy Priesthood, and gain your eternal exaltation.

http://home.teleport.com/~packham/endow90.htm

Now, I don't know where all that comes from and I don't think it's even in any mormon texts such as the Book of Mormon, Pearl of Great Price or Doctrine and Covenants. I think a lot of it comes from a semblence of Masonic rituals of which I was a member back in the mid 80's. Joseph Smith was a Mason and I see a lot of Masonic knock-offs in the Mormon Church including the compass and square, Masonic symbols, used on Mormon "garments" as well.

And do be careful when speaking with them. Though the words may be the same they've been taught different meanings to common words in Christian literature, scripture. It's usually a good idea to first define some key words such as grace, salvation and sin before any discussion. That in itself can be quite an obstacle.

And never never forget that those who turn away from Mormonism stand to lose just about everything including family, job and friends. This is no exaggeration. It's VERY real. Peer pressure can be extremely intense. It's a very rough experience to accept the true Christ for a Mormon who was in good standing.

 

[Vic C.]

Thanks Rick.

And do be careful when speaking with them. Though the words may be the same they've been taught different meanings to common words in Christian literature, scripture. It's usually a good idea to first define some key words such as grace, salvation and sin before any discussion. That in itself can be quite an obstacle.

Personally, I find this a problem in many churches. This is why I am so gosh darn bent on Hebrew and Greek word studies and why I lean on Biblical history so much.

And never never forget that those who turn away from Mormonism stand to lose just about everything including family, job and friends. This is no exaggeration. It's VERY real. Peer pressure can be extremely intense. It's a very rough experience to accept the true Christ for a Mormon who was in good standing.

From a family experience, I found this out to be true of the JWs also. My cousin became one in the 70's. It was rough on her family. It took her years to get out from under it, but when she did, she eventually would up in a Baptist church. Would you know, my aunt, her mother, became a JW many years later! Go figure.

I'd still like to know about this baptism for the dead. Clearly, it's not scriptual.

God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.

 

[Rick W]

I'd still like to know about this baptism for the dead. Clearly, it's not scriptual.

Well, here's a place to start.

Baptism for the dead

 

[Vic C.]

I think Christian Orthodoxy got it right. It is ludicrous to want to baptize someone who didn't believe in the first place. Imagine baptizing on behalf of someone like Sagan or any number of Atheists. :o

I got this from CARM a couple of weeks ago, It was used in my discussion of this on the other Site I mentioned.

But, the Mormons are incorrect. They have usurped this verse and taken it out of context. So, let's examine 1 Cor. 15 briefly so we can see what Paul is talking about when he mentions baptism for the dead.

In Verses 1-19, the fact of Christ's resurrection is detailed by Paul. Beginning in verse 20 and going through verse 23, Paul speaks about the order of the resurrection. Christ is the first one raised -- in a glorified body -- and then who are His at His return. Next, verses 24 - 29 mention Christ's reign and the abolition of death. This is when this controversial verse occurs: "Otherwise, what will those do who are baptized for the dead? If the dead are not raised at all, why then are they baptized for them?"

Just north of Corinth was a city named Eleusis. This was the location of a pagan religion where baptism in the sea was practiced to guarantee a good afterlife. This religion was mention by Homer in Hymn to Demeter 478-79.2 The Corinthians were known to be heavily influenced by other customs. After all, they were in a large economic area where a great many different people frequented. It is probable that the Corinthians were being influenced by the religious practices found at Eleusis where baptism for the dead was practiced.

Paul used this example from the pagans in 1 Cor. 15:29, when he said, "...if the dead are not raised, then why are they baptized for the dead?" Paul did not say we. This is significant because the Christian church was not practicing baptism for the dead, but the pagans were.

http://www.carm.org/questions/baptismfordead.htm