My co-worker accused me of labelling

[abide]

Yesterday I had a heated discussion with one of my co-workers. We were discussing terrorism.
I told her that MOST MUSLIMS ARE TERRORIST. She was angry, she said I am labelling them. She went on to say that it is not fair to make that statement. Another member of staff, said to me perhaps it would be better to say.. Most terrorists are Muslims and she agreed. I am not sure if there is a great difference.

I asked why is it that our local Muslim community never on any occasion speak out against any of the terrorist activities. She had no answer, she said the ones here are not involved in anything like terrorism.

I don't want to appear to be labelling anyone, but being naive has never helped anyone. A belief system which is based on intolerance cannot be good for any society. Perhaps there are Muslims who in the privacy of their homes condemned such acts, but the fact that they cannot come out publicly and say it...shows that there is an inherent fear within this religious grouping.

 

[Pizzaguy]

I struggle with this, myself. While I concede that, perhaps, most muslims are peaceful and kind - the evidence strongly suggests that Islam has a "quirk": it is violent, and it teaches (or is based on) outdated, violent, intolerant beliefs.

It is very hard to draw a conclusion by watching the news. (And that statement applies to more than just assessing Islam.)

I DO know that, here in the Atlanta area, we have a somewhat large Islamic population. Many are from Mideastern countries. And NEVER have I heard the local "Imam" speak out against terrorism. I HAVE Heard him make excuses for terrorism and I have heard him explain that it is the USA's fault that terrorism happens. You can imagine how my view of Islam is shaped, and why.

 

[cyberjosh]

Yesterday I had a heated discussion with one of my co-workers. We were discussing terrorism.
I told her that MOST MUSLIMS ARE TERRORIST. She was angry, she said I am labelling them. She went on to say that it is not fair to make that statement. Another member of staff, said to me perhaps it would be better to say.. Most terrorists are Muslims and she agreed. I am not sure if there is a great difference.

I asked why is it that our local Muslim community never on any occasion speak out against any of the terrorist activities. She had no answer, she said the ones here are not involved in anything like terrorism.

I don't want to appear to be labelling anyone, but being naive has never helped anyone. A belief system which is based on intolerance cannot be good for any society. Perhaps there are Muslims who in the privacy of their homes condemned such acts, but the fact that they cannot come out publicly and say it...shows that there is an inherent fear within this religious grouping.

This remains mostly a matter of observation, although there actually is a substantial difference between the two statements in red. What if I said "Most green plants are lettuce"? A brief observation would show that this is patently not true. Lettuce is one among many plants that are green, but does not constitute the majority. In this case the "lettuce" are the terrorists and those espousing Islam are the "green plants". If however I said "Most lettuce is green", I would be correct, although some is red (hence "most"). I think it is observationally true that among all the kinds of terrorists on earth that Muslims make up the majority (and there have been Jewish, Irish, and Atheistic terrorists as well). But as I go into below a minority (even if sizable) of Muslims as a population are actually engaged in terrorism. The second statement above "Most terrorists are Muslims" is the more conservative and accurate statement though.

Here are some estimated stats so that you can be armed with them the next time you may get into such a discussion: https://sites.google.com/site/islam...w-many-muslims-are-there-how-many-are-jihadis.

It estimates that Muslims could (at the highest estimate) make up 1/4th of the world's population. That's one in four people you meet. There are not that many terrorists walking around on earth.

Then it goes on to say that 7% of Muslims are militant and confirmed to participate in terrorist activity (still a minority), and it estimates that up to 25% currently whether or not they are engaged in violence nonetheless support it. Still a minority though. That doesn't mean the "few" can't have a MAJOR effect on the world though. Now, that link makes an interesting prediction: "The only thing keeping US Muslims from more overtly supporting Jihadi violence is their minority status in this nation. As their numbers or concentrations in urban areas increase, you will see more overtly violent activity." I think it is also probably right that it says since many of their leaders support violence that the people will follow suit if unrestrained by law.

If you want to read a social study of the actual statistics, demographics, and reasons behind terrorism you might try "Terror in the Name of God: Why Religious Militants Kill", which I had to read for a class on the Sociology of Terrorism. It helped me to address the topic more precisely so that I don't make unfounded claims. So all I counsel is caution, attention to detail, and doing a little bit of research so that you can tell any Muslims or sympathizers "Hey, go look at this source which shows the proof." The truth will never need stretching. It speaks for itself.

If there is someone who thinks that "only" 7% of a religion's practitioners being actively violent is insignificant then they have some serious moral issues they need to sort out.

~Josh

 

[Claudya]

Yesterday I had a heated discussion with one of my co-workers. We were discussing terrorism.
I told her that MOST MUSLIMS ARE TERRORIST. She was angry, she said I am labelling them. She went on to say that it is not fair to make that statement. Another member of staff, said to me perhaps it would be better to say.. Most terrorists are Muslims and she agreed. I am not sure if there is a great difference.

Honestly, your statement was resentfull and labelling. The other red one is logically very different. It recognises the islamist terrorism threat, but doesn't say anything about how many of muslims are terrorists.

I asked why is it that our local Muslim community never on any occasion speak out against any of the terrorist activities. She had no answer, she said the ones here are not involved in anything like terrorism.

There are many statements of muslims organisations and individuals, and fatwas by muslim teachers, that condemn terrorism in general, and certain acts of terrorism (like 9/11 or the recent events in Kenya) in particular. So it's just not true that they don't condemn it. The condemnations just may not get the media attention they deserve. Here is just one example out of many many more: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatwa_on_Terrorism The book is online as a pdf file so you can read it for free (I'm pretty sure it's a copyright infringement, so I'm not gonna link it, but you'll surely find it via google.)

Maybe your local muslim community isn't speaking out against terrorism because they don't even see what their community has to do with terrorism at all?

I don't want to appear to be labelling anyone, but being naive has never helped anyone. A belief system which is based on intolerance cannot be good for any society. Perhaps there are Muslims who in the privacy of their homes condemned such acts, but the fact that they cannot come out publicly and say it...shows that there is an inherent fear within this religious grouping.

Like I said, there have been numerous examples of muslims condemning terrorism.
And as a christian and private person I wouldn't feel like I have to constantly condemn the disgusting behaviour of the westboro baptist church just because they claim to be christians too.

 

[Pizzaguy]

1) there have been numerous examples of muslims condemning terrorism.
2) And as a christian and private person I wouldn't feel like I have to constantly condemn the disgusting behaviour of the westboro baptist church just because they claim to be christians too.

1) Not the case in Atlanta.
2) Why not? I constantly condemn them on Facebook and the other forums I visit. They are disgusting and are making themselves to be a "voice" of Christianity and of God Himself. Why else am I here, but to respond to such a vile bunch?

 

[jasoncran]

if that was the case then I should just shut up about the anti-semeticism that I have seen on forums.but I wont. 7% is serious number.

 

[Milk-Drops]

I hate to say it OP, but you are labeling. You are stating that Muslims are terrorists. That is labeling. What really needs to be addressed is what you are using as evidence for your claim. You ask, "why aren't they standing against terrorists?". Well, have you actually gone to a temple or Mosque and asked for their religious leader's opinions? I don't blame you coworker for being dumbfounded, its because your question is just shifting the burden of proof. You made the statement that Muslims are terrorists, when confronted, you deflected and threw the question back the person asking.

You didn't establish that the Muslims in your area are terrorists. You are assuming they are terrorists because they didn't make a display in front of you.

The reality is that the reason we are hearing so much about "Muslim terrorists" is because there are groups of terrorists that use Islam to justify their actions. They are trying to recruit more followers by appealing to Islam.