Perpetual Forgiveness

[gordon777]

Scripture is very well explained, to know if we have the divine nature or not. ( sin nature is not the divine nature.)

2 Peter 1:4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.


Jesus Christ is God, and we are born of Him.

Also there are those not born of God, who not only sin, they try to insist they are not the many workers of iniquity( sinners) who call Jesus Lord, Lord.


John 1:13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

1 John 2:29 If ye know that he is righteous, ye know that every one that doeth righteousness is born of him.


Luke 13:25 When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are:
26 Then shall ye begin to say, We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets.
27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.



Because we have to be righteous even as Jesus Christ is righteous, purifying ourselves even as He is pure, no man can deceive us to think God sees us as pure, even when we act impure, or sees us as righteous, when we do unrighteousness, as that is not living up to scripture, of us righteous, even as He is, or pure even as He is.



1 John 3:3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.

1 John 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

 

[gordon777]

Nobody is born of God that commits sins, as all scripture regaridfng boern of God shows the very opposite.


1 John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

1 John 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.




They are testified, to either have ceased from sin, or CANNOT cease from sin.



1 Peter 4:1 Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;


2 Peter 2:14 Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:

 

[gordon777]

Romans 7 of unwillingly doing the evil, and unable to do the good, is the old covenant, the law, and as testified, we are not under the law, when we are led of the Spirit.

The law it is witnessed, is when we were weak, ( as Romans 7 rightly shows) but Romans 8 continues, to show we are no longer in that same weakness as Romans 7 was describing. ( the righteousness of the law is not fulfilled in anyone who is yet in the weakness of the law and unable to do what they would, because of not being led by the Spirit.)

We were held dead in the law, now we serve in newness of Spirit.

Paul talks of the law, and while talking of the law, ( which we are delivered from by the Spirit) talks of not being able to do what he would.



Galatians 5:17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.
18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

Romans 7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

Romans 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.

Romans 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

 

[gordon777]

Then when we do not follow the weakness of the law or what Paul describes in Romans 7 ( nobody after the Spirit believes in weakness. as that is the letter and flesh.) God works in us, to be blameless and harmless, with no rebuke from doing evil to anyone, as lights, not as darkness. ( light has no darkness at all.)


Luke 11:36 If thy whole body therefore be full of light, having no part dark, the whole shall be full of light, as when the bright shining of a candle doth give thee light.

Philippians 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.
14 Do all things without murmurings and disputings:
15 That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;

 

[Free]

Nobody is born of God that commits sins, as all scripture regaridfng boern of God shows the very opposite.


1 John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

1 John 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.




They are testified, to either have ceased from sin, or CANNOT cease from sin.



1 Peter 4:1 Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;


2 Peter 2:14 Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:

https://christianforums.net/threads...remain-a-christian.97836/page-55#post-1806898

 

[gordon777]

https://christianforums.net/threads...remain-a-christian.97836/page-55#post-1806898

Jesus sets us free from sin, before this we are free from righteousness, then we are equally free from sin. ( when free from righteousness, we did no righteousness, as the servant of sin serves it perfectly/wholly.)


John 8:34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.

Romans 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?



1 John 1 begins by telling us about what was from the beginning, which is love, love to some is hating others, but to God, Gods love is not idea of love.



1 John 1:1 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life;

1 John 2:7 Brethren, I write no new commandment unto you, but an old commandment which ye had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning.
8 Again, a new commandment I write unto you, which thing is true in him and in you: because the darkness is past, and the true light now shineth.
9 He that saith he is in the light, and hateth his brother, is in darkness even until now.
10 He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.
11 But he that hateth his brother is in darkness, and walketh in darkness, and knoweth not whither he goeth, because that darkness hath blinded his eyes.

 

[Free]

Jesus sets us free from sin, before this we are free from righteousness, then we are equally free from sin. ( when free from righteousness, we did no righteousness, as the servant of sin serves it perfectly/wholly.)


John 8:34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.

Romans 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?



1 John 1 begins by telling us about what was from the beginning, which is love, love to some is hating others, but to God, Gods love is not idea of love.



1 John 1:1 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life;

1 John 2:7 Brethren, I write no new commandment unto you, but an old commandment which ye had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning.
8 Again, a new commandment I write unto you, which thing is true in him and in you: because the darkness is past, and the true light now shineth.
9 He that saith he is in the light, and hateth his brother, is in darkness even until now.
10 He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.
11 But he that hateth his brother is in darkness, and walketh in darkness, and knoweth not whither he goeth, because that darkness hath blinded his eyes.

We are set free from slavery to sin but all believers still struggle with sin, that is what Jesus, John, and Paul all make clear.

 

[Tenchi]

After the Atonement of Christ at Calvary, there is no place in the entire New Testament where a born-again person is instructed to ask God for forgiveness. This is because, in Christ, for his sake, God has already forgiven them of all their sin. That forgiveness waits to be applied whenever confession of sin is made (1 John 1:9) but confession is merely agreeing with God that our sin is sin, not asking God for forgiveness.

Imagine I've put in a brand new shower in my bathroom. It sits in my house, ready to be used whenever I get into it and turn on the water. But the showering effect of the shower is not mine to enjoy until I do so. It's benefits remain unapplied to me so long as I neglect to get into the shower and turn on the faucet. In the same way, forgiveness is already mine in Christ but I don't access the benefits of that forgiveness until, by confession of my sin, I turn on the "shower" of that forgiveness and stand under it's cleansing flow.

 

[gordon777]

We are set free from slavery to sin but all believers still struggle with sin, that is what Jesus, John, and Paul all make clear.

We struggle with sin when we have no love of God in us, the law was the struggle, and the Spirit and love of Christ has no such struggle, this i what Christ, and HIs Apostles did in actions, no details of any actual sin exist in the Apostles.

 

[gordon777]

Sin is when a person doubts Christ is risen, as sin is what is not of faith.

If we wash in filthy water, we will believe in sin, but if we wash in pure water, we can no longer believe in sin.
Being cleansed of all unrighteousness/filth, is pointless, if we believe we are washed in filthy water, that means we are sill in the sin/in the filth.


Romans 14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

 

[gordon777]

We are set free from slavery to sin but all believers still struggle with sin, that is what Jesus, John, and Paul all make clear.

Wat Paul did not make clear, was what those who do wrong, wrest against, and against the other scriptues of Jesus and John too, to their own destruction..


2 Peter 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

 

[gordon777]

Two chapters are used for people to excuse sinning, yet they are completely unwilling to talk about those two chapters, one is about law, the other is about darkness, neither can be showing sin is unavoidable, as the answers are freedom from law/sin and light with no darkness.

 

[gordon777]

Where are your answers on your own verses used to excuse sinning, why not try to reason with someone like me for once, as I just did for you.

 

[netchaplain]

We are set free from slavery to sin but all believers still struggle with sin, that is what Jesus, John, and Paul all make clear.

Like your reply here! Just wanted to share that the old man had the power to cause us to desire sin. But now this power is annulled by the promise that "sin shall not have dominion over you" (Ro 6:14). This means the sin nature (old man) can no longer cause you to desire sin, even though we still sin. Sinning is now against our desire, like a "captive" held against his will (Ro 7:23); instead of being like before--a willing subject!

It's what's in our heart that matters to God, because that's where your treasure is (Mat 6:21). We treasure God, even in the sinning! Only He can do this, because He has separated (sanctified) us from the "old man," we no longer live after the sin nature (flesh), but after the Spirit (Ro 8:9).

 

[gordon777]

Like your reply here! Just wanted to share that the old man had the power to cause us to desire sin. But now this power is annulled by the promise that "sin shall not have dominion over you" (Ro 6:14). This means the sin nature (old man) can no longer cause you to desire sin, even though we still sin. Sinning is now against our desire, like a "captive" held against his will (Ro 7:23); instead of being like before--a willing subject!

It's what's in our heart that matters to God, because that's where your treasure is (Mat 6:21). We treasure God, even in the sinning! Only He can do this, because He has separated (sanctified) us from the "old man," we no longer live after the sin nature (flesh), but after the Spirit (Ro 8:9).

If we do not desire to sin, we do not give our desire to sin, Cain has his desire as sin.

Cain does hatred, evil, being not of God, the other does good, being of God. Love does not do sin, you should learn that in scripture.





Genesis 4:7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

1 John 3:11 For this is the message that ye heard from the beginning, that we should love one another.
12 Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous.

Romans 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

 

[Free]

We struggle with sin when we have no love of God in us, the law was the struggle, and the Spirit and love of Christ has no such struggle, this i what Christ, and HIs Apostles did in actions, no details of any actual sin exist in the Apostles.

That's not what Jesus, Paul, and John say. John explicitly says that any believer who claims to be without sin is self-deceived, makes God a liar, and doesn't have either the truth or God's word in them (1 John 1:8, 10). He also talks about when believers sin in 1 John 1:9, 2:1, and 5:16.

 

[gordon777]

It's what's in our heart that matters to God, because that's where your treasure is (Mat 6:21). We treasure God, even in the sinning! Only He can do this, because He has separated (sanctified) us from the "old man," we no longer live after the sin nature (flesh), but after the Spirit (Ro 8:9).

What is in the heart is good and honest or bad and evil, not two measures, that is for the unstable folk.


Luke 8:15 But that on the good ground are they, which in an honest and good heart, having heard the word, keep it, and bring forth fruit with patience.

Matthew 12:35 A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things.

 

[gordon777]

That's not what Jesus, Paul, and John say. John explicitly says that any believer who claims to be without sin is self-deceived, makes God a liar, and doesn't have either the truth or God's word in them (1 John 1:8, 10). He also talks about when believers sin in 1 John 1:9, 2:1, and 5:16.

We are in sin and are called to stop sinning.


We do stop sinning when born of God.


1 John 5:16 If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.
17 All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.
18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

 

[gordon777]

Does Free, or anyone have anything with understanding to share, just a simple reasoning of 1 John and Romans 7 will do.

 

[gordon777]

As said for born of God and sinning not, so those who do not do HIs commandments are not born of Him, do not know Him, they have to have HIs love perfected in them and walk even as He walked.

This is easy to know and also no need for one verse wonders.


1 John 2:My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.
6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.