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Drake is the man
Darkcell said:Drake is the man
I hope SHE doesn't take offense to that. : :
What Pre-Wrath is:
the first 3 1/2 years .....................l....................the second 3 1/2years
Sorry Darkcell, I am working on just about 3 hours sleep.
Lecoop, do you believe in the pre trib rapture? If so tell me why you do. If not, tell me why you don't?
Alot of people are saying its not going to happen because the elects are mentioned in the great trib, and it says the anti-christ will go after the Godly ones.
And have the 4th seal passed yet? Is it time for the great trib to happen?
Coop:
Yes, most certainly I do believe in a pre-trib rapture, but I have been accused of being a "partial preterist." Why? Because I know that the "trib" or the 70th week starts with the 7th seal. His wrath also starts there, so in effect, I am pre-trib and prewrath! Why do I believe this? First, we are to be saved from His wrath. Second, John sees the raptured church in heaven, just before the 7th seal is broken. That is to say, just before the start of the day of the Lord and the 70th week of Daniel.
Don't be thrown by the words "the great tribulation" in the discription of the great crowd. All God means here by "great tribulation" is great pressure being put on Christians. Even today, in some parts of the world, people are being killed just because they are Christians. What God is telling us here, is that it will be this way around the globe just before the rapture of the church. At the time that John sees this great crowd, the 70th week has not even started, so God cannot be saying that these came out of that time after the abomination that comes at the midpoint of the week. Everyone would believe this is the raptured church, if they understood these words, "great tribulation." It is not referring to a specific time, but to what life will be like just before the rapture.
Next, JOhn sees the church in heaven, at the marriage supper, in chapter 19. It would not make any sense that part of the church stayed on earth, while those that died before attended the wedding! No, all the church will be there!
Last, it is totally against the charactor of God that His bride go through His wrath. That is just silly to think that.
People say a lot of things on these forums, but alas, most of them are confused! They just do not understand much of the end times. God called the Jews His elect long before the church existed. In fact, when Jesus gave the Olivet discourse, where this "elect" is mentioned, the church did not exist. The main thrust of His discourse was Daniel's 70th week, which has nothing to do with the church. Therefore,this mention of gathering together HIs elect is referring to bringing all the Jews back to Israel. He promised to do it, and in one place, He said He would do it in a day. Therefore, don't be confused about the "elect."
Of course the antichrist will go after the Jews, and then after those that refuse his mark. But wait - many born again people will miss the rapture, because they are living in the world, and not looking for His coming. They are living in sin, and know they are, but don't want to change. Jesus is coming for those that are looking for Him. Therefore, there will be many Christians left. Then immediately after the rapture, there will be millions turn to God, for they wake up and realize that they missed Him. However, will these be around after the midpoint? Somehow, they MUST get to heaven for the marriage, for God will not have only part of His church there. Therefore, I am convinced that there will be a second rapture, to take the rest of His church to heaven.
After all, the two witnesses are raptured. The 144,000 are raptured. It is written that at the 7th trumpet, the mystery of God would be finished. I believe this is the mystery of God in the Gentiles. Therefore, the age of the church will close at the midpoint of the week. The fulness of the Gentiles will have all come in at that time, and the church will be closed. However, many will still turn to God after the midpoint. They will believe the messages of the angels and turn and worship God. They will refuse the mark, and most will be put to death. Those that survive, will attend the sheep and goat judgment, and then will go into the millennial kingdom.
So there will be God's people on earth during that second half of the week - it just won't be members of His church. IMO
Where are we now? The first five seals have been broken, and we are waiting for the sixth, and the great earthquake. Did you notice at Jesus death, that there was a resurrection? And what else? A great earthquake! It seems then, that resurrections and earthquakes go together. I am convinced that the rapture of the church, and the ressurection of the dead in christ, take place at the 6th seal, just before the 70th week will start.