Wow, sorry it’s taken so long. Work has really been tasking me so I hope I can get a quick response to you now. (it’s 5:45 and I just now finished my work day, I’ll miss church tonight, so I opted to stay at work and reply) Well, here it goes.
Veritas said:
Mars Hill said:
[COVENANT]
ROOTS\
We affirm the central truths of historic orthodox Christian faith, seeing ourselves in a long line of generations taking part in the endless conversation between God and people. We believe the Bible to be the voices of many who have come before us, inspired by God to pass along their poems, stories, accounts, and letters of response and relationship with each other and the living God. To know where we’re going, we have to know where we’ve been.
RESPONSE: We covenant to go backward embracing the roots of our faith.
Ok, so I think the first part is good. But the other parts don't seem to quite line up with orthodox Christianity. They say "..inspired by God to pass along their poems, stories, etc" What do they mean by this?
I am an artist and I'm inspired by God to paint His wonderful world...but I definately don't claim that my paintings are "infallible/God breathed" like I believe God's Word to be. It really seems they do not mean the same thing as orthodox Christians do by using the word "inspired"....or they have purposely left the wording vague.
Well, for your first question, Don’t you think that the writers of our Bibles were inspired by God to write God’s word? That’s how I’m taking it and yes, I believe the Bible to be the inspired word of God, which takes the form of poetry, stories etc. The way I understand it, is it was the writers of the bible that wrote what “They†experienced personally or that which was orally taught them through the generations. Mark, Luke and Acts come to mind as second hand accounts and we can also look at some of the OT accounts and you’ll see what I’m talking about. All those stories and accounts in the OT are wonderful stories and accounts, but more than stories for the ones that experienced them first hand. In other words, the stories were real, they were not made up. For example, when Moses encountered YHWH on the mountain, we can experience this encounter through the written account as recorded in scripture, but Moses was there, it was “His†experience and his written account of that inspired moment. This I believe is one part that makes the bible an “Inspired†.
Question, can I see God’s inspiration through your paintings? The answer is yes simply because the Holy Spirit works in many areas.
Veritas said:
Mars Hill said:
JOURNEY\
We have great confidence that God will restore all of creation under the authority of Christ. We believe that every church has to ask the question: “What does it look like for us to live out that future reality today?†We are constantly exploring, questioning, and wrestling with new and creative ways to live out and communicate the teachings of Jesus. Because we see faith as a journey, change is assumed, innovation is expected, and rebirth is welcomed.
RESPONSE: We covenant to go forward because the life of faith is a journey.
Again, first part is good. But why would we live out that future today? It's not the future. And our job now is to spread the Good News of Christ...not try to do His job He will do when He comes back.
Veritas,
The Kingdom of God is now, yet we hope for the upcoming Kingdom of Heaven. I have said many times throughout the years that our walk with Christ is a journey, and I don’t think it will end when were in heaven, but rather heaven is just the beginning. I think your confusing the two.
Veritas said:
Mars Hill said:
WHOLENESS\
We believe that God wants to bring about a new humanity by redeeming every part of us. We embrace the salvation Jesus offers as the only hope for the healing of our relationships with God, each other, ourselves, and creation. We believe that all of life is spiritual, and that all of our fears, failures, and brokenness can be restored and made whole. We value the inner journey, because we want to be fully integrated peopleâ€â€mind, body, and soul, emotions and experiences all offered together to God.
This starts out lining up with God's Word again but why make the comment about all life being spiritual? There is a physical aspect to life too. We worship in spirit and truth, but life still is physical. And what is meant by "inner journey" and why would we value that, and what does it have to do with integration? I don't think that last part makes any sense.
Good questions.
All life is spiritual as God’s fingerprints are across every part of creation and as we know, God is Spirit. As far as worshipping in Spirit and truth, it is very much a physical act just like Christ himself was fully a physical man. Again, the physical has God’s fingerprints all over it.
As far as this “inner journeyâ€Â, I believe this is speaking to ones personal relationship with Christ and how only Christ can change us. I have a great testimony on how God has transformed my life, yet I know that my transformation won’t be complete until the resurrection. From point a to point b is a journey so why would I value that? I believe a portion of scripture speaks of a prostitute who wiped Jesus’ feet with her tears and her hair. Ohh, the Pharisees were outraged… but do you remember how Jesus replied?
You see, we have sinned and grown old, not God. Another story speaks of a “Non Jewish†woman at a particular well who had been married many times and the man she was with was not her husband… Do you recall how she responded? Knowing where God has brought us from creates an appreciation where we can’t help but to praise God in total spirit and truth!
Veritas said:
Mars Hill said:
RESPONSE: We covenant to go inward because we want to be whole people.
How is this Biblical? How does this make any sense?
We are mind, body and soul. We want to look inward so that we can empty ourselves of ourselves and fill ourselves with Christ. There is a story that speaks of who we, who are evil, can give good gifts to our children, then how much better gifts (Holy Spirit) will our father in heaven give us if we ask? If a child is hungry, he asks for something to eat. Ask yourself, are you hungry for Christ? Do you thirst for the water? If so, then ask.
Veritas said:
Mars Hill said:
COMMUNITY\
We value the image of God in all people, everywhere. We believe that we were created to live deeply with one another, carrying each other’s burdens, sharing our possessions, to pray for and confess our sins to each other, to suffer and celebrate together. ...
Sounds great again at first. But it loses it in the next sentence:
Destiny, this ones for you. To confess our sins, assumes repentance.
Veritas said:
Mars Hill said:
...It’s in these honest, loving relationships that God transforms us and truth becomes a reality. The way of Jesus cannot be lived alone.
RESPONSE: We covenant to go withward because we were made to live in community.
We may happen to be in honest and loving relationships with people when we are transformed but God transforms us through Christ. And why does truth have to become a reality. Truth simply IS reality. Jesus is Truth.
Reality is also physical, remember? When you pray to our Father, you are opening yourself up for God to use you to answer prayers. I had a profound experience on our way to Indianapolis this Easter, to make a long story short, our drive kept getting interrupted and I thought we’d never make it! Last minute got off at an exit to pick up a swim suit at Myers and my wife spotted a Kohls (if I would have seen the Wal-Mart, we would have went there). But I didn’t see the Wal-Mart and we ended up going to Kohls. It was windy and a shopping cart rolled in back of my car just after I parked, well, I looked at the lady across the way and said something with a smile when she said that she had just lost a receipt for $180 that she needed to return. My wife started talking to her, and I was moved to step forward a few feet. Well, three rows over I spotted something blowing away so I took off after it. Guess what? It was her lost receipt!
She made a comment, and that comment was this. “I didn’t expect God to answer my Prayer so quickly!â€Â
God used me to answer “HER†prayer. But this wasn’t only an answer to her prayer, it was also an answer to mine for I have been praying that God use me to do his will. I was edified as much as the gal who lost her receipt!
Yes, Truth is reality, and the reality is that both of our prayers were answered and ironically, it was a spiritual blessing for both of us.
Veritas said:
Mars Hill said:
SERVING\
We believe that Jesus is God in human form and that the church is God’s ongoing presence in the world. Led by the Spirit of God, we are passionate about relieving suffering and fighting injustice, joining the God of the oppressed in living out the transforming message of the resurrected Jesus. Jesus calls his church to be a compelling force for good in the world, and we believe that the church is at its best when it serves, sacrifices, and loves, caring about the things God cares about. We were created to live for
something larger than ourselves.
RESPONSE: We covenant to go outward because Jesus calls us to serve the world.
This sounds pretty good. However its a little odd they are so concerned about relieving suffering and put that ahead of justice and the message of the ressurected Jesus. Especially considering we are told in God's Word we must suffer:
For it has been granted to you on behalf of Christ not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for him. Philippians 1:29
...anyone who does not take his cross and follow me is not worthy of me. Matthew 10:38
This is bigger than just us “Christiansâ€Â. We Americans have it made and we often loose site of the millions of people who are suffering daily whether it be starvation, abuse or oppression. Don’t take for granted your good life. Let me put it to you this way.
A bridge is more beautiful than a bomb is.
An open hand is stronger than a fist.
Listening is louder than words.
Want to bring those who are suffering in the world to Christ? Then assist them for that is truth in action. I believe there is a scripture that speaks about being a servant, for Christ came to serve. Also, there is a scripture that states that if we see suffering, and do nothing but give lip service, then were basically hypocrites and those who are hypocrites are those spoken about in Mt. 25.
Veritas said:
Mars Hill said:
CELEBRATION\
We take great joy in partnering with God to change the world, embracing the truth that all of life is sacred, hope is real and tomorrow can be better than today. We celebrate the divine in the daily, pursuing lives of hope, gratitude, and worship. God invites everyone everywhere into this way of life, and we believe it is the best possible way to live.
RESPONSE: We covenant to go upward celebrating God’s redemption of all things.
Ok, are we really partners of God? We are his children.
Children whom He loves dearly, and although we really mess up with trying to change His world for the better and deserve nothing but death, He will save all who believe in Him. He changes the world.
We are his children and we do what He will. We have been changed by the grace of God to bring change to others. Again, faith is by hearing and our “Personal†relationship with Christ is our journey. Israel was blessed, so that they could be a blessing to the nations around them, yet look what they did. (Ez 16).
Do you tithe? If so, why do you tithe? Are you tithing to the “Church†or are you tithing to God? Do you believe that you God has blessed you with material wealth simply for your own comfort because your such a swell Christian? Well, maybe part of that is true, but I believe that we have been blessed so that we can bless those around us and I don’t care if it’s with money, time or any other blessing that God has given you. We don’t give because we expect back, we give out of the blessing that God has given us.
God is love, our God is love… and Love.. Can.. Change… The.. World.
Yes, God will save all who believe in Him, but we are part of that for God uses us to answer the prayers of others. When you pray, do you pray for only yourself and other Christians, or do you pray for those only close to you? How about your enemies? Do you pray for them to? I believe that God answers prayers sometimes by placing the right person in the right spot at just the right time. Yes, we are definatly a part of God’s kingdom.
This is certainly not as complete as I would have liked it to be and I’m sorry for not taking my time and posting more scripture. I know I could have done a better job, but that was a lot to go through.
I would hope that you would choose one topic in this list and we can venture from there. Time isn’t on my side this week for doing a lot of posting so please excuse me for the delay.
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