Revelation

[for_his_glory]

No, (Ezekiel 43:4) says God will bring His glory back to the Temple. You say no He won't.

The Temple spoken of in (Ezekiel 40-48) has never been built. It is not the 2nd Temple. But it will be built.

You say no, but Scripture says yes.

Quantrill

I'm not going to argue nor debate this as I believe what God has already given us about what the Temple is beginning with the Spiritual rebirth as Jew and Gentile are joined together as one body of Christ, Galatians 3:24-29. Let them build another temple, do you think God is going to delight in burnt offerings, plus there will be no mercy seat covering the ark of the covenant as no one knows what happened to it since 70AD.

Rev 21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
Rev 21:3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

Rev 21:22 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.

1Cor 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
1Cor 3:17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

 

[Quantrill]

I'm not going to argue nor debate this as I believe what God has already given us about what the Temple is beginning with the Spiritual rebirth as Jew and Gentile are joined together as one body of Christ, Galatians 3:24-29. Let them build another temple, do you think God is going to delight in burnt offerings, plus there will be no mercy seat covering the ark of the covenant as no one knows what happened to it since 70AD.

Rev 21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
Rev 21:3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

Rev 21:22 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.

1Cor 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
1Cor 3:17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

So, you are not going to argue or debate this. Which means you refuse to believe anything else than what you believe at this time. OK. I guess your understanding is absolute, at least to you anyway. But then you can't explain the glory returning to the Temple of Ezekiel in (Ezekiekl 43:1-5) when you said it wouldn't.

(Rev. 21) deals with the time after the 1000 year Millennium. Nothing in (Rev. 21) speaks against the Temple described by (Ezekiel 40-48).

I have no problem with the Church being the Temple on earth at this time. But, we are talking about a different time.

Quantrill

 

[for_his_glory]

So, you are not going to argue or debate this. Which means you refuse to believe anything else than what you believe at this time. OK. I guess your understanding is absolute, at least to you anyway. But then you can't explain the glory returning to the Temple of Ezekiel in (Ezekiekl 43:1-5) when you said it wouldn't.

(Rev. 21) deals with the time after the 1000 year Millennium. Nothing in (Rev. 21) speaks against the Temple described by (Ezekiel 40-48).

I have no problem with the Church being the Temple on earth at this time. But, we are talking about a different time.

Quantrill

I never argue nor debate the word of God as what He has already spoken and that of what He spoke is already written why would anyone want to debate or argue God for that is what you are doing as you come against that which is already written. My understanding is not always absolute, but the word of God is and that's why I give scripture within my understanding. I have already clearly in full detail with scripture explained why I do not think a third temple will be built.

Whether they build one or not is no concern to me as it has nothing to do with my salvation through Christ Jesus.

 

[Quantrill]

I never argue nor debate the word of God as what He has already spoken and that of what He spoke is already written why would anyone want to debate or argue God for that is what you are doing as you come against that which is already written. My understanding is not always absolute, but the word of God is and that's why I give scripture within my understanding. I have already clearly in full detail with scripture explained why I do not think a third temple will be built.

Whether they build one or not is no concern to me as it has nothing to do with my salvation through Christ Jesus.

Ones view of end time events will be interpreted based upon the theological system they hold to. Whatever system you hold to will also affect that which you believe about salvation. Your salvation.

Prophecy, and future events cannot be divorced from the rest of Scripture as many want to do. It is connected warp and woof.

Quantrill

 

[for_his_glory]

Ones view of end time events will be interpreted based upon the theological system they hold to. Whatever system you hold to will also affect that which you believe about salvation. Your salvation.

Prophecy, and future events cannot be divorced from the rest of Scripture as many want to do. It is connected warp and woof.

Quantrill

My theological system is the word of God taught only through the Holy Spirit that gives us wisdom and understanding. I let no one apart from the Holy Spirit teach me. The Holy Spirit will teach you history throughout all the Empires that have slaughter millions of God's people clear up to the last revived Empire as we see history repeat itself in the end of days as we can see clearly many of these events unfolding before our own eyes as many die a martyr's death even today for the witness and testimony of Christ. Even Jesus gave us the signs to watch for His coming. Prophecy extends from Genesis to Revelations in full context as when Christ returns He will at that time fulfill all prophecies.

Revelation means unveiling as John was given visions while on the isle of Patmos of things which must come first before the return of Christ on the last day. These revelations are for us to be prepared for that which is coming, not to fear, but that we are ready to endure all things that will try and come against us for the sake of Christ.

 

[Quantrill]

My theological system is the word of God taught only through the Holy Spirit that gives us wisdom and understanding. I let no one apart from the Holy Spirit teach me. The Holy Spirit will teach you history throughout all the Empires that have slaughter millions of God's people clear up to the last revived Empire as we see history repeat itself in the end of days as we can see clearly many of these events unfolding before our own eyes as many die a martyr's death even today for the witness and testimony of Christ. Even Jesus gave us the signs to watch for His coming. Prophecy extends from Genesis to Revelations in full context as when Christ returns He will at that time fulfill all prophecies.

Revelation means unveiling as John was given visions while on the isle of Patmos of things which must come first before the return of Christ on the last day. These revelations are for us to be prepared for that which is coming, not to fear, but that we are ready to endure all things that will try and come against us for the sake of Christ.

Sure it is. Just you and God.

Quantrill

 

[for_his_glory]

Sure it is. Just you and God.

Quantrill

why would anyone need anything else apart from God's word and His Holy Spirit teaching us.

John 14:25 These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you.
John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

1 John 2:26 These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you.
1 John 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

 

[Quantrill]

why would anyone need anything else apart from God's word and His Holy Spirit teaching us.

John 14:25 These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you.
John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

1 John 2:26 These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you.
1 John 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

If these passages you give mean that every believer doesn't need other believers, who have gone before, and have studied the Bible and have been instrumental in building Bible doctrine, then why did the Lord give the gift of teaching to some believers? (Rom. 12:7) (1 Cor. 12:28) (Eph. 4:11)

In other words, the verses you give do not negate the need for other believers understanding of Scripture other than yours. They certainly speak to the necessity of the Holy Spirit in teaching any true doctrine.

You ask why does anyone need anything else then God's Word and His Spirit? Because the way you are using it, it makes you 'absolute' in your interpretation. In other words, why do you disagree with other believers? It must be, according to you, that you are always right and they are always wrong. They are not listening to the Spirit, you are.

Quantrill

 

[for_his_glory]

If these passages you give mean that every believer doesn't need other believers, who have gone before, and have studied the Bible and have been instrumental in building Bible doctrine, then why did the Lord give the gift of teaching to some believers? (Rom. 12:7) (1 Cor. 12:28) (Eph. 4:11)

In other words, the verses you give do not negate the need for other believers understanding of Scripture other than yours. They certainly speak to the necessity of the Holy Spirit in teaching any true doctrine.

You ask why does anyone need anything else then God's Word and His Spirit? Because the way you are using it, it makes you 'absolute' in your interpretation. In other words, why do you disagree with other believers? It must be, according to you, that you are always right and they are always wrong. They are not listening to the Spirit, you are.

Quantrill

I never said I was absolute in what I present nor ask anyone to believe me, but to go search that of what I give by first praying and asking the Holy Spirit teach them as they study the scriptures I present for my understanding. Apart from the Holy Spirit man can teach us nothing, but the Holy Spirit does work through others to help teach us, but it is up to us to test the spirits that are speaking.

Studying revelations, like any study, takes not only the full context of scriptures from Genesis to Revelations, but also the history of the various eras and cultures as we study the different Empires that have always ruled over Israel trying to destroy God's people . History, even now, is repeating itself with the continuation of mystery Babylon up to the time of Christ return where He will destroy the beast and its false prophet taking them alive and casting them into the lake of fire and we are at that time caught up to meet Christ in the air and will evermore be with Him.

 

[Quantrill]

I never said I was absolute in what I present nor ask anyone to believe me, but to go search that of what I give by first praying and asking the Holy Spirit teach them as they study the scriptures I present for my understanding. Apart from the Holy Spirit man can teach us nothing, but the Holy Spirit does work through others to help teach us, but it is up to us to test the spirits that are speaking.

Studying revelations, like any study, takes not only the full context of scriptures from Genesis to Revelations, but also the history of the various eras and cultures as we study the different Empires that have always ruled over Israel trying to destroy God's people . History, even now, is repeating itself with the continuation of mystery Babylon up to the time of Christ return where He will destroy the beast and its false prophet taking them alive and casting them into the lake of fire and we are at that time caught up to meet Christ in the air and will evermore be with Him.

Well, actually you do present yourself as absolute in your doctrine. According to you it is just you and the Holy Spirit that results in your interpretation. Post #(25). And in post #(27), you ask why would anyone need anything else than the Holy Spirit and God's Word.

So, what happens if another believer comes along and interprets differently than you? One of yall must not be listening to the Holy Spirit? Correct? So, according to you, it must be the other one as you only listen to the Holy Spirit and God's Word. Or are you willing to say, you can err also?

But now you also say we need teachers. Correct? But why do we need teachers when you have the Bible and the Holy Spirit? You just gave a bunch of Scriptures that supposedly say that.

And if we need teachers with the gift of teaching from the Holy spirit, how does that not speak to being established in a correct doctrine. In other words, I stated in post #(24) that ones view of the end time events will be based on the theological system they hold to. You immediately say you just believe the Holy Spirit and the Bible. You accept no mans teaching. You see the confusion of your statements.

You want it perceived that it is just you and God and your understanding is what counts. But when pushed, you want to acknowledge the teaching gifts in others of the Holy Spirit. Well, when the teaching gifts in others goes against you, what then? I know. They are just not listening to the Holy Spirit. You are. Absolute.

Quantrill

 

[for_his_glory]

I'm not infallible and I know I make mistakes at times, but it's only those times when The Holy Spirit sends me correction by working through someone that has a greater Spiritual knowledge than I do and then I gladly accept the correction.

You go right ahead and keep man's doctrines that you learn from as that is your right to do so. I have no problem with that. Again, my understanding comes from scripture, history and the Holy Spirit directly or working through others to teach me. If you have a problem with that then it's your problem, not mine.

 

[Quantrill]

I'm not infallible and I know I make mistakes at times, but it's only those times when The Holy Spirit sends me correction by working through someone that has a greater Spiritual knowledge than I do and then I gladly accept the correction.

You go right ahead and keep man's doctrines that you learn from as that is your right to do so. I have no problem with that. Again, my understanding comes from scripture, history and the Holy Spirit directly or working through others to teach me. If you have a problem with that then it's your problem, not mine.

How am I any different than how you describe yourself? I depend on the Holy Spirit's teaching also. I trust Him to send people my way that teach and correct. My understanding also comes from Scripture, history, and the Holy Spirit working on others.

But when I do it, according to you, I am keeping man's doctrines and not God's, as you are.

What makes those men whom the Lord sends you different?

Quantrill

 

[for_his_glory]

How am I any different than how you describe yourself? I depend on the Holy Spirit's teaching also. I trust Him to send people my way that teach and correct. My understanding also comes from Scripture, history, and the Holy Spirit working on others.

But when I do it, according to you, I am keeping man's doctrines and not God's, as you are.

What makes those men whom the Lord sends you different?

Quantrill

It was you that said you believe in some of the many doctrines of Darby so what else am I suppose to believe when what you are following is man's theories as they manipulate the word of God to make it say what they want. I just can't buy into that anymore as I have been lied to many times as I could not find in scripture what men like Darby and all the bandwagon preachers are teaching and that's why I separated myself from man's teachings and started studying for myself to find truth.

I can't make you understand that of what I present nor can I make you agree with what I post. All I can ask of others is to take the scriptures I give and go search for themselves and draw their own conclusions. God called me to teach others many years ago, but He also had to equip me first in His word to present that of what is already written. All I ask of others is that if I am in error that the Holy Spirit would use them to correct me as He has done many times as am grateful of others that have a better Spiritual knowledge than I as all of us are on different levels of understanding by how we study. I learnt through the years to use the full context of scripture from Genesis to Revelations when I study the scriptures and ask the Holy Spirit be my teacher. I know, everyone says that, but not everyone hears what the Holy Spirit is teaching as traditional teachings sound good and make sense to us, but yet leaves us void of Spiritual truth. I can only hope and pray what I present is truth and I know that the Holy Spirit will correct me if it is not. I'm not ashamed to come back and say I was wrong as I own up to the mistakes I have made in the past and will continue if need be in the future.

Like I have told you a few times, you have every right to believe as you do and I have no problem with that even though many times I do not always agree with you. It's when you tell others they error, not believing you, is when I have to draw a line of disrespect for you.

 

[Quantrill]

It was you that said you believe in some of the many doctrines of Darby so what else am I suppose to believe when what you are following is man's theories as they manipulate the word of God to make it say what they want. I just can't buy into that anymore as I have been lied to many times as I could not find in scripture what men like Darby and all the bandwagon preachers are teaching and that's why I separated myself from man's teachings and started studying for myself to find truth.

I can't make you understand that of what I present nor can I make you agree with what I post. All I can ask of others is to take the scriptures I give and go search for themselves and draw their own conclusions. God called me to teach others many years ago, but He also had to equip me first in His word to present that of what is already written. All I ask of others is that if I am in error that the Holy Spirit would use them to correct me as He has done many times as am grateful of others that have a better Spiritual knowledge than I as all of us are on different levels of understanding by how we study. I learnt through the years to use the full context of scripture from Genesis to Revelations when I study the scriptures and ask the Holy Spirit be my teacher. I know, everyone says that, but not everyone hears what the Holy Spirit is teaching as traditional teachings sound good and make sense to us, but yet leaves us void of Spiritual truth. I can only hope and pray what I present is truth and I know that the Holy Spirit will correct me if it is not. I'm not ashamed to come back and say I was wrong as I own up to the mistakes I have made in the past and will continue if need be in the future.

Like I have told you a few times, you have every right to believe as you do and I have no problem with that even though many times I do not always agree with you. It's when you tell others they error, not believing you, is when I have to draw a line of disrespect for you.

I said I was Dispensational. And I am. Your accusation that Dispensationalism 'manipulates the Word of God' is not true. I may well agree with Darby in many areas concerning Dispensationalism. But I don't follow Darby. I agree with many areas of Calvinism. But I don't follow Calvin.

You disagree with Dispensationalism. That doesn't make it 'man's doctrines'. It is based upon Scripture. Of course you say you trust just the Holy Spirit and that is where your doctrine comes from. But again, so do I. So, that bring us back to post #(32). How am I different than you?

Concerning the Dispensational view of Scripture, I say the same as you. Check the Scriptures. Seek the Holy Spirit's help. How am I different than you?

So, when we disagree, we are disagreeing concerning the interpretation of Scripture, because I base what I believe on Scripture also. So how am I different than you?

Disrespect or respect of me from you matters little. What matters is just how 'Scriptural' you really are as opposed to what you claim to be. You said the glory of God would never return to the Temple. post #(17) I showed you that (Ezekiel 43:4) says otherwise. post #(18,20) Your answer...you no longer want to discuss it.

You see, your doctrine, based on you, doesn't have an answer. Doesn't want to admit that the glory of God will return to the Temple.

Quantrill

 

[for_his_glory]

I said I was Dispensational. And I am. Your accusation that Dispensationalism 'manipulates the Word of God' is not true. I may well agree with Darby in many areas concerning Dispensationalism. But I don't follow Darby. I agree with many areas of Calvinism. But I don't follow Calvin.

You disagree with Dispensationalism. That doesn't make it 'man's doctrines'. It is based upon Scripture. Of course you say you trust just the Holy Spirit and that is where your doctrine comes from. But again, so do I. So, that bring us back to post #(32). How am I different than you?

Concerning the Dispensational view of Scripture, I say the same as you. Check the Scriptures. Seek the Holy Spirit's help. How am I different than you?

So, when we disagree, we are disagreeing concerning the interpretation of Scripture, because I base what I believe on Scripture also. So how am I different than you?

Disrespect or respect of me from you matters little. What matters is just how 'Scriptural' you really are as opposed to what you claim to be. You said the glory of God would never return to the Temple. post #(17) I showed you that (Ezekiel 43:4) says otherwise. post #(18,20) Your answer...you no longer want to discuss it.

You see, your doctrine, based on you, doesn't have an answer. Doesn't want to admit that the glory of God will return to the Temple.

Quantrill

You say you agree with Darby in many areas and John Calvin in many areas so that would make you a follower of sorts whether you see it or not.

I will always disagree with Dispensationalism for how it twist and manipulates scripture, which again I can not make you see or understand this. My doctrine is the doctrine of Christ for what He has already taught that we read in the scriptures.

I already explained why your way of learning is different than mine. Our difference is that I do not view scripture according to man's theories, but gain knowledge and understanding of that which Christ has already taught.

God's glory is not going to return to a temple made by hands as I thoroughly explained all of that and I have no need to keep reiterating it over and over in the same thread.

No, I have no doctrine of my own like Darby and Calvin that like to add to and take away from the word of God. My doctrine is that of what has already been written in the scriptures as the only outside source I use is the study of history and cultures of those various eras. The doctrine of Christ Jesus always has an answer to any question we have, but we have to learn to separate from man's theories and points of view in order to hear the Holy Spirit teach us.

One of the most treacherous teachings that Darby taught was a pretrib rapture theory (which I once believed in) that has no bases found in scripture, but yet you follow that teaching. How many other false teachings have you been blinded to by those who manipulate scripture to fit their theories.

I've said this to you many times that you have every right to follow Dispensationalist teachings and I have every right to reject that which is not found in scripture. I don't have all the answers or all the knowledge and wisdom the Bible contains, but I do have God's Holy Spirit that will answer my questions giving me knowledge and understanding in those things God wants me to now. We all say the Holy Spirit teaches us, but all I can do is Spiritually discern that of what others teach and I would hope others would do that with what I teach. I am not infallible.

 

[Quantrill]

You say you agree with Darby in many areas and John Calvin in many areas so that would make you a follower of sorts whether you see it or not.

I will always disagree with Dispensationalism for how it twist and manipulates scripture, which again I can not make you see or understand this. My doctrine is the doctrine of Christ for what He has already taught that we read in the scriptures.

I already explained why your way of learning is different than mine. Our difference is that I do not view scripture according to man's theories, but gain knowledge and understanding of that which Christ has already taught.

God's glory is not going to return to a temple made by hands as I thoroughly explained all of that and I have no need to keep reiterating it over and over in the same thread.

No, I have no doctrine of my own like Darby and Calvin that like to add to and take away from the word of God. My doctrine is that of what has already been written in the scriptures as the only outside source I use is the study of history and cultures of those various eras. The doctrine of Christ Jesus always has an answer to any question we have, but we have to learn to separate from man's theories and points of view in order to hear the Holy Spirit teach us.

One of the most treacherous teachings that Darby taught was a pretrib rapture theory (which I once believed in) that has no bases found in scripture, but yet you follow that teaching. How many other false teachings have you been blinded to by those who manipulate scripture to fit their theories.

I've said this to you many times that you have every right to follow Dispensationalist teachings and I have every right to reject that which is not found in scripture. I don't have all the answers or all the knowledge and wisdom the Bible contains, but I do have God's Holy Spirit that will answer my questions giving me knowledge and understanding in those things God wants me to now. We all say the Holy Spirit teaches us, but all I can do is Spiritually discern that of what others teach and I would hope others would do that with what I teach. I am not infallible.

Well, I believe my doctrine is the doctrine of Christ also. I believe Dispensationalism best describes the doctrines of Christ and God, because it reveals the truths that God is giving us in the Scripture.

So, what now? You say you have no doctrine of your own. OK. Whose doctrine do you have? You say Christ's...so do I.

I don't mind that you reject the Dispensational view of Scripture. I mind that you pretend that your doctrine is just you and God's. That you don't have a theological system that you have agreed with.

You can say the Holy Spirit teaches you. I can say the Holy Spirit teaches me. When we differ though, you claim I am following the doctrines of men. Because I don't agree with you. And 'you' are not infallible, as you have said yourself.

And, God's glory will return to the Millennial Temple as stated in the book of (Ezekiel).

Quantrill