School system

[Edward]

It's not surprising as I see that type stuff here. Degrees,even hvac with experience only paying 16 per hour .that's not much

That is why I moved away from Florida. Wages suck down there. I went to colorado and had a plumbing job for one month, then quit cuz the thief was trimming my hours. Then I couldn't find another job in [plumbing! So I thought, hmmm, plumbing and heating...I'll go to a heat and air shop! And did. That was 89 for 6.50 an hour to start and by 1992 I was making 18 dollars an hour.

 

[Edward]

Ok, I joined a union shop, but I tested B class so was making 18. Good money

 

[WIP]

Here's a little something else I'll share. I mentioned that I worked as an electrical designer for my company. My schooling was very limited. It was a 2-year technical institute (technical college today) program designed to gear us toward working in industrial electrical maintenance for the manufacturing and packaging industries. We didn't spend a serious amount of time on any one thing but touched on a variety of subjects. Over the course of the two years we worked on board level electronics, troubleshooting NEMA, IEC, VFD, and servo motor controls, reading and understanding electrical drawings, conduit installation, instrumentation, PLC programming and controls, CAD systems, NEC code book reading, pneumatic and hydraulic controls, technical writing, and so on.

What this means is that when I came out of the program I was not highly skilled but just had entry level training. I worked my way through the company and began designing the modifications for existing equipment in the field. I have made a fair middle class income from this but there is a limit on how high I can go.

This may not be true everywhere as there are always exceptions but I believe this is a pretty reliable general statement. If I carried an EE my pay scale at this company would be higher. The EEs that we have working here are in a group with a higher job classification so they have the potential to earn higher wages.

I also know that in the teaching field the same is true. Teachers that do not pursue higher education such as attaining their masters, will not likely have the same opportunity for income growth as those that do.

My brother-in-law works in the forestry field and he was telling me about some of the things he does and so forth and I commented that I should get a job like his. He replied, "All you have to do is get a masters in forestry." Basically, he was telling me that without higher education, my chances are slim.

 

[GodsGrace]

Here's a little something else I'll share. I mentioned that I worked as an electrical designer for my company. My schooling was very limited. It was a 2-year technical institute (technical college today) program designed to gear us toward working in industrial electrical maintenance for the manufacturing and packaging industries. We didn't spend a serious amount of time on any one thing but touched on a variety of subjects. Over the course of the two years we worked on board level electronics, troubleshooting NEMA, IEC, VFD, and servo motor controls, reading and understanding electrical drawings, conduit installation, instrumentation, PLC programming and controls, CAD systems, NEC code book reading, pneumatic and hydraulic controls, technical writing, and so on.

What this means is that when I came out of the program I was not highly skilled but just had entry level training. I worked my way through the company and began designing the modifications for existing equipment in the field. I have made a fair middle class income from this but there is a limit on how high I can go.

This may not be true everywhere as there are always exceptions but I believe this is a pretty reliable general statement. If I carried an EE my pay scale at this company would be higher. The EEs that we have working here are in a group with a higher job classification so they have the potential to earn higher wages.

I also know that in the teaching field the same is true. Teachers that do not pursue higher education such as attaining their masters, will not likely have the same opportunity for income growth as those that do.

My brother-in-law works in the forestry field and he was telling me about some of the things he does and so forth and I commented that I should get a job like his. He replied, "All you have to do is get a masters in forestry." Basically, he was telling me that without higher education, my chances are slim.

Hi WIP
College is the new High School.
It's been like this here since when I could remember.
You have to be a bookkeeper to get a job as a cashier at a bank.
There are lawyers doing this job and also accountants.
It's crazy.

 

[HeIsRisen2018]

I hope that everyone here won't mind if I add my but this topic sort of reminds me of my own topic of whether or not parents should let their children dropout of school. The way I see it is I'm not against education. I'm just against the way it's being taught if that makes sense.



For example, you can't get through life without knowing mathematics or how to read and write,.. but how is knowing all of the presidents or state capitals by heart going to cause conflict in the way you live your life? Because to me I'm doing just fine and it is unnecessary information. However learning how to cook, fill out job applications, signing checks etc. those are all very important life skills and I do believe (except for the job application thing I'm not so sure of) that I studied them all in school.




How to treat people the way you want to be treated also comes in handy and certain subjects like social studies and science (even though I actually like the second subject) should only be electives and the choice of religion (instead of evolution) should be added. Granted there are few things in social studies and science that I think is extremely important to learn but schools should just stick to those things (like map reading, the constitution, bill of rights etc.) and not make children learn things that they will never have to use later on in life.

 

[Michael74]

... but how is knowing all of the presidents or state capitals...

I think its someone's idea of how to instill patriotism in people. However, since most people hate memorizing things, this practice may be having the opposite effect. It just gives an unpleasant association between unpleasant memorization and the country for people. There are probably better ways than memorizing long lists to instill patriotism.

 

[WIP]

I hope that everyone here won't mind if I add my but this topic sort of reminds me of my own topic of whether or not parents should let their children dropout of school. The way I see it is I'm not against education. I'm just against the way it's being taught if that makes sense.



For example, you can't get through life without knowing mathematics or how to read and write,.. but how is knowing all of the presidents or state capitals by heart going to cause conflict in the way you live your life? Because to me I'm doing just fine and it is unnecessary information. However learning how to cook, fill out job applications, signing checks etc. those are all very important life skills and I do believe (except for the job application thing I'm not so sure of) that I studied them all in school.




How to treat people the way you want to be treated also comes in handy and certain subjects like social studies and science (even though I actually like the second subject) should only be electives and the choice of religion (instead of evolution) should be added. Granted there are few things in social studies and science that I think is extremely important to learn but schools should just stick to those things (like map reading, the constitution, bill of rights etc.) and not make children learn things that they will never have to use later on in life.

As I understand it, you're only complaint, if I can call it that, is the way history is taught and I agree with you. What I feel is more important is the background behind the story like, sure it is important to the context of the story to know the who's involved but what was the reason for the historic events and what were the mistakes made? How can we learn from those mistakes and improve life now?

Evolution is a part of science and I have no problem with digging into it. It is man's way of understanding the world as we see it but what needs to be made absolutely clear is that it is not a fact but only a theory (educated guess) to explain the observations that have been made. Studying other things like mythology should be handled the same way. It is called mythology for a reason so make sure students understand that reason.

Parents play a vital role in how our school systems work. We do it through school board representation and congressional legislation but we don't pay attention to the actual candidates. Instead we argue back and forth about the political parties which has no value whatsoever. Look at the candidates themselves and ignore the political rhetoric that is intentionally slanted and geared toward infecting your perspective.

REMEMBER, they are job applicants and we are the employer. Imagine if you went into a job interview and when asked to tell about yourself you begin to tell about everything you can think of that is wrong about your competition. How long do you think your interview would last? Well, that is exactly what political campaigns do. We never hear about what a candidate really stands firm on. All we hear is the negative rhetoric about the opposition. It's a bunch of hooey.

 

[HeIsRisen2018]

I think its someone's idea of how to instill patriotism in people. However, since most people hate memorizing things, this practice may be having the opposite effect. It just gives an unpleasant association between unpleasant memorization and the country for people. There are probably better ways than memorizing long lists to instill patriotism.

As I understand it, you're only complaint, if I can call it that, is the way history is taught and I agree with you. What I feel is more important is the background behind the story like, sure it is important to the context of the story to know the who's involved but what was the reason for the historic events and what were the mistakes made? How can we learn from those mistakes and improve life now?

Evolution is a part of science and I have no problem with digging into it. It is man's way of understanding the world as we see it but what needs to be made absolutely clear is that it is not a fact but only a theory (educated guess) to explain the observations that have been made. Studying other things like mythology should be handled the same way. It is called mythology for a reason so make sure students understand that reason.

Parents play a vital role in how our school systems work. We do it through school board representation and congressional legislation but we don't pay attention to the actual candidates. Instead we argue back and forth about the political parties which has no value whatsoever. Look at the candidates themselves and ignore the political rhetoric that is intentionally slanted and geared toward infecting your perspective.

REMEMBER, they are job applicants and we are the employer. Imagine if you went into a job interview and when asked to tell about yourself you begin to tell about everything you can think of that is wrong about your competition. How long do you think your interview would last? Well, that is exactly what political campaigns do. We never hear about what a candidate really stands firm on. All we hear is the negative rhetoric about the opposition. It's a bunch of hooey.

Well I just had to add that there are certain ways that I believe that Christianity and science go together but evolving directly from monkeys can't possibly be true because otherwise wouldn't it still be happening then?

 

[WIP]

As I think about it, I didn't care much for history either. Too much memorization and that was of no interest to me. Of course, if I enjoyed history like my neighbor, then things would have been a lot different. I have mentioned that my reading comprehension is lacking. For this reason, I do not have a lot of interest in reading books. But I believe it is important just the same. Every once in a while I am reminded that both of these subjects have impacted my life in some way. Geography was another one but yet, I find it extremely humorous when someone thinks that Minnesota is located somewhere near the arctic circle. This happened to me one time when I was working in SC. One of the machine operators made that mistake. I remember one time when I was talking on the phone to a parts representative from Michigan and to determine which warehouse to send the part from they asked me which was closer, Michigan or Maine. I about spit coffee all over my computer keyboard.

 

[jasonc]

I hope that everyone here won't mind if I add my but this topic sort of reminds me of my own topic of whether or not parents should let their children dropout of school. The way I see it is I'm not against education. I'm just against the way it's being taught if that makes sense.



For example, you can't get through life without knowing mathematics or how to read and write,.. but how is knowing all of the presidents or state capitals by heart going to cause conflict in the way you live your life? Because to me I'm doing just fine and it is unnecessary information. However learning how to cook, fill out job applications, signing checks etc. those are all very important life skills and I do believe (except for the job application thing I'm not so sure of) that I studied them all in school.




How to treat people the way you want to be treated also comes in handy and certain subjects like social studies and science (even though I actually like the second subject) should only be electives and the choice of religion (instead of evolution) should be added. Granted there are few things in social studies and science that I think is extremely important to learn but schools should just stick to those things (like map reading, the constitution, bill of rights etc.) and not make children learn things that they will never have to use later on in life.

Because you find history as boring as I do with Disney ,Disney is banal to old Orlando guys,old Orlando is very much what I post.

I passed by the hallstrom house, it's older home was a tin one,with a kitchen away from it as then those were never in the home,as fires could move too fast.

The owner who lived in that ,and the new house ,both over 100 years old died in 99.she bequeathed the homes to the society for posterity,to be what it is a museum of her family history where there was no time for frivolous, they as kids worked the pineapplease groves or traveled ,and learned as the hallstroms,had money .homes ,brick type ,ornate implied you had money .

History is local ,but in school they can't always have you met people of the eras of discussion. They did do that with stories of ww2,Jim crows place. My middle school is in that Gifford video.those graves I mentioned were left to rot in a Woodline.

I can easily talk to blacks who remember whites telling them to leave their store,Jim crow laws.I work with one. History is so easy to touch for me and all over ,societies are all over to educate,preserve.much of my photos are from them telling the story .

One day my veterangeneration will be dead abd just a foot note in a book.we will however have more videos ,recordings to tell in then those before with the talking memorials.

 

[WIP]

Well I just had to add that there are certain ways that I believe that Christianity and science go together but evolving directly from monkeys can't possibly be true because otherwise wouldn't it still be happening then?

The public school system is secular. They will teach what is secular and how it applies to world living and that includes things that may contrast with what is Christian. It is the role of the Church and the parents to teach what is Christian.

 

[Razeontherock]

What do you think about today's school system?

It is TERRIBLE!

Ever since government took over by creating the DoE.

Individual teachers can be great, but still need to stick within established guidelines.

 

[Razeontherock]

As I think about it, I didn't care much for history either. Too much memorization and that was of no interest to me. Of course, if I enjoyed history like my neighbor, then things would have been a lot different. I have mentioned that my reading comprehension is lacking. For this reason, I do not have a lot of interest in reading books. But I believe it is important just the same. Every once in a while I am reminded that both of these subjects have impacted my life in some way. Geography was another one but yet, I find it extremely humorous when someone thinks that Minnesota is located somewhere near the arctic circle. This happened to me one time when I was working in SC. One of the machine operators made that mistake. I remember one time when I was talking on the phone to a parts representative from Michigan and to determine which warehouse to send the part from they asked me which was closer, Michigan or Maine. I about spit coffee all over my computer keyboard.

I always hated history in school.

What fascinates me now is what was happening at the same time, in different places.

History should be taught like that!

 

[jasonc]

It is TERRIBLE!

Ever since government took over by creating the DoE.

Individual teachers can be great, but still need to stick within established guidelines.

Uhm the state, county ,city ran schools are not govt .yes one hundred years ago ,and I have a photo of the first public school here it was a house afterwards then a store.it held ten kids .govt owned ,ran .state mandated education goes back to the colonies .they simply mandated a kid must have an education not who would,then later on the gov't did it all,mid 1800s is when that started.

Blacks ,minor ties were ignored.blacks here built ,taught in their own schools.then gave that over to the state.

I'm not a fan of the DoE but let's not be ignorant of history and how long the gov't has been education.

 

[jasonc]

I always hated history in school.

What fascinates me now is what was happening at the same time, in different places.

History should be taught like that!

It wa taught like that to me.

Try looking at the history of colonization of america,similiar stories of failure ,indians helping, being screwed,fighting and over taken.local it was these,the timculans,ocala,the ais,the first turkey day was in st.augustine with de leon and the timculan chief together eating.

 

[jasonc]

I can touch pre america history locally.I habe a few photos to gather from a fossil or two.

 

[Razeontherock]

At my grade there is nothing useful to get out of an education. College is a scam and just leaves you in debt.

You can get AP and earn College credit for free.

You have to take an interest though

Math and science is highly useful. Engineering is the top field for the educated. A good job is useful

 

[Razeontherock]

It wa taught like that to me.

Try looking at the history of colonization of america,similiar stories of failure ,indians helping, being screwed,fighting and over taken.local it was these,the timculans,ocala,the ais,the first turkey day was in st.augustine with de leon and the timculan chief together eating.

The Colonial era and Revolutionary War is pretty much all we were taught; I grew up in one of the 13 original colonies.

What was happening in Europe? Asia? The west of North America? South and Central America?

Even just that one time period, it becomes much more interesting (to me) to see how it's inter-related, and independent.

Better yet is to see the progress through time, and how different regions did that differently, and how we wound up where we are now.

 

[ezra]

education is great but with out common sense it does no good . my dad who was born in 1918 for over 30 years ran a successful grocery store he owned he had a 8 th grade education . in today standard he would be laughed at . he figured his own % on profit around 25 - 30 % .he took care of his customers .he served the community if a death happen he took groceries from the store and it did not matter if they was customers or not . if not careful on extended education..you have educated idiots .i remember a man who worked for mo conservation dept.. he climed a fire tower and spotted fires. took bulldozer and built fire lines. had his shirt burnt off his back fighting fire. they sent him to school to learn how to fight fires

 

[ezra]

You can get AP and earn College credit for free.

You have to take an interest though

Math and science is highly useful. Engineering is the top field for the educated. A good job is useful