Should Churches be non-denominational?

[Dave Slayer]

Should Churches be non-denominational?

 

[Cornelius]

Should Churches be non-denominational?

The church IS non denominational

 

[Tina]

^

While I agree that church is non-denominational and should be non-denominational, I don't see denominations as entirely bad as long as they don't stray from biblical truths. When we stand before His Throne one day, God is not going to judge us as an Anglican, Methodist, Evangelical, Presbyterian, Pentecostal, Baptist, Lutheran or Catholic.... just as Christians.


:shades

 

[mutzrein]

Should Churches be non-denominational?

No. It's much easier to tell the difference! ;)

 

[Cornelius]

^

While I agree that church is non-denominational and should be non-denominational, I don't see denominations as entirely bad as long as they don't stray from biblical truths. When we stand before His Throne one day, God is not going to judge us as an Anglican, Methodist, Evangelical, Presbyterian, Pentecostal, Baptist, Lutheran or Catholic.... just as Christians.


:shades

In a matter like this, its better to see what God thinks about it: 1Co 1:10 Now I beseech you, brethren, through the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfected together in the same mind and in the same judgment.


Rom 16:17........ mark them that are causing the divisions......and turn away from them.

But the Bible also teaches that these faction/division/denominations are good, because they take those who are not approved, out of the real church. Those who are factious flock together and leave the main body: 1Co 11:18 For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that divisions exist among you; and I partly believe it.
1Co 11:19 For there must be also factions among you, that they that are approved may be made manifest among you.

Can you see, that Paul is saying that factions separate the approved from the unapproved ?

 

[mutzrein]

Can you see, that Paul is saying that factions separate the approved from the unapproved ?

Exactly!

 

[Cornelius]

So , let look at it from God's view. The Lord, through Paul, tells the church that they (the church) must not have factions , but to allow factions to happen to those who are factious, because this will separate them from the true church. Kind of like a natural selection. Those who adhere to man's doctrines, must move out of the true church and form denominations. That way, the true church stays pure.

Look again at this verse speaking to the true church first:

1Co 1:10 Now I beseech you, brethren, through the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfected together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

then he says to allow denominations, because they weed out the goats from the sheep.

1Co 11:19 For there must be also factions among you, that they that are approved may be made manifest among you.

 

[Tina]

No. It's much easier to tell the difference! ;)

What difference ?

 

[Tina]

So , let look at it from God's view. The Lord, through Paul, tells the church that they (the church) must not have factions , but to allow factions to happen to those who are factious, because this will separate them from the true church. Kind of like a natural selection. Those who adhere to man's doctrines, must move out of the true church and form denominations. That way, the true church stays pure.

Look again at this verse speaking to the true church first:

1Co 1:10 Now I beseech you, brethren, through the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfected together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

then he says to allow denominations, because they weed out the goats from the sheep.

1Co 11:19 For there must be also factions among you, that they that are approved may be made manifest among you.

I understand , but ......

every denomination claims to be "true" ......

So how would one determine which is the "true church" ?

 

[mutzrein]

No. It's much easier to tell the difference! ;)

What difference ?

Between the approved and unapproved . . . see Cornelius' post.

 

[mutzrein]

Look for a fellowship of believers that DOESN'T CLAIM to be the 'true' ones.

Look for those who worship the Father in Spirit and in Truth. These are the 'true' ones.

 

[Cornelius]

So , let look at it from God's view. The Lord, through Paul, tells the church that they (the church) must not have factions , but to allow factions to happen to those who are factious, because this will separate them from the true church. Kind of like a natural selection. Those who adhere to man's doctrines, must move out of the true church and form denominations. That way, the true church stays pure.

Look again at this verse speaking to the true church first:

1Co 1:10 Now I beseech you, brethren, through the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfected together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

then he says to allow denominations, because they weed out the goats from the sheep.

1Co 11:19 For there must be also factions among you, that they that are approved may be made manifest among you.

I understand , but ......

every denomination claims to be "true" ......

So how would one determine which is the "true church" ?

Well, there is no denomination that is the true church. The very fact that they are denominations , places them in the section where Paul says they must be, because they separated in some way from the truth of the Word.

As to finding the true church. Its hidden in plain sight, but God will have to show you. For that, you must ask Him and He will show you if your asking is sincere. In that way, you will know that no man convinced you of anything and that God Himself showed you.

C

 

[Adullam]

So , let look at it from God's view. The Lord, through Paul, tells the church that they (the church) must not have factions , but to allow factions to happen to those who are factious, because this will separate them from the true church. Kind of like a natural selection. Those who adhere to man's doctrines, must move out of the true church and form denominations. That way, the true church stays pure.

Look again at this verse speaking to the true church first:

1Co 1:10 Now I beseech you, brethren, through the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfected together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

then he says to allow denominations, because they weed out the goats from the sheep.

1Co 11:19 For there must be also factions among you, that they that are approved may be made manifest among you.

:amen

 

[Free]

Well, there is no denomination that is the true church. The very fact that they are denominations , places them in the section where Paul says they must be, because they separated in some way from the truth of the Word.

So, how is it then that if every gathering called itself non-denominational that that would be any different than having denominations? It would actually be worse since each gathering could be teaching different things. It would result in increased, near infinite, factions.

Those who adhere to man's doctrines, must move out of the true church and form denominations. That way, the true church stays pure.

The obvious error here is that even those who claim to be non-denominational adhere to man's doctrines, even more so.

Your position is completely self-defeating.

 

[Adullam]

Well, there is no denomination that is the true church. The very fact that they are denominations , places them in the section where Paul says they must be, because they separated in some way from the truth of the Word.

So, how is it then that if every gathering called itself non-denominational that that would be any different than having denominations? It would actually be worse since each gathering could be teaching different things. It would result in increased, near infinite, factions.

Those who adhere to man's doctrines, must move out of the true church and form denominations. That way, the true church stays pure.

The obvious error here is that even those who claim to be non-denominational adhere to man's doctrines, even more so.

Your position is completely self-defeating.

Except for the guidance of the Holy Spirt you would be right!

 

[Free]

Except for the guidance of the Holy Spirt you would be right!

What do you mean? I am right. I can guarantee you that if I find 100 non-denominational churches, all claiming to be lead by the Holy Spirit, I will get 100 different views on any given topic.

 

[Cornelius]

Well, there is no denomination that is the true church. The very fact that they are denominations , places them in the section where Paul says they must be, because they separated in some way from the truth of the Word.

So, how is it then that if every gathering called itself non-denominational that that would be any different than having denominations? It would actually be worse since each gathering could be teaching different things. It would result in increased, near infinite, factions.

Those who adhere to man's doctrines, must move out of the true church and form denominations. That way, the true church stays pure.

The obvious error here is that even those who claim to be non-denominational adhere to man's doctrines, even more so.

Your position is completely self-defeating.

I must ask you if you have noticed that I have not given you my opinion. I have merely told you what Paul wrote, and Paul wrote what the Holy Spirit gave him to to write, so your problem is not not with me.All I have posted, I first made sure I can back up with Scripture. Now you must do the same. You must prove that denominations are good and from God and that they are in line with Scripture to be the perfect plan for the church.You must show me in Scripture where they are called the true church.

I have proven from Scripture that indeed they are the will of God, because they separate those who are following the doctrines of men, and places them into denomination. Those with the same errors flock together. Just so that we are clear ; "Non-denominational " can also be a sect and division. Just because we call something by a good sounding name, does not mean that it is in fact void of error.

I will again post that scripture, so that we do not have to be unsure of which scripture verse actually tells us that they (denominations ) separate the false doctrines out of the church .

1Co 11:19 For there must be also factions among you, that they that are approved may be made manifest among you.

So my view is supported by Scripture. Denominations manifest those who are approved.They do that by leaving the approved and flocking together around their error.

 

[Free]

You have merely posted Scripture and doing so does not constitute support for your position. I have shown that your position is inconsistent with that very Scripture. My whole point is that you seem to think that it applies to others and not you when you are just as guilty of the very things you are accusing others of.

 

[Vince]

There is no one true answer to Dave's question, but I'd like to point out a few things:

Many "non-denominational" churches are really independent churches that believe what some denomination believes. Some of them believe what their leader believes, when no denomination will accept their leader. Many of them are charismatic.

After a series of sex scandals, many independent Baptist churches turned Ruckmanite (King James Only). Under Ruckman's influence, they have split into steadily smaller groups, hostile to one another, with no one group able to claim a majority of them. They also had a lot more sex scandals. However, independent Baptists as a group are still doing quite well, have rejected Ruckmanism, and are well-represented in America's 100 largest churches. But they usually go under names like "Community Bible Church, etc., and they claim to be non-denominational.

 

[Cornelius]

You have merely posted Scripture and doing so does not constitute support for your position.

I sincerely hope to continuously merely be posting Scripture. There is no other way of knowing the truth.The mere opinions of man are the very reasons why there are denominations. They lack the respect for the mere Scriptures.

I have shown that your position is inconsistent with that very Scripture.

No you have not, you have only shown your personal disagreement, without using Scripture.

My whole point is that you seem to think that it applies to others and not you when you are just as guilty of the very things you are accusing others of.

I have not mention myself in any post. I have been addressing the issue of denominations, the topic of this treat. You must still prove your point by using Scripture.