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Some Won't Get Saved

rstrats said:
Are suggesting that people have the ability to consciously choose to believe that someone or something does or doesn't exist or that a certain proposition is or isn't true?
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rstrats,

I'm not suggesting but stating this is what the Bible teaches:

29 The jailer called for lights, rushed in and fell trembling before Paul and Silas. 30 He then brought them out and asked, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?”​
31 They replied, “[You]Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved—you and your household" (Acts 16:29-31 NIV).​

"Believe" is a Greek imperative - a command. "[You] believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved." God doesn't do the believing for us. He doesn't stop us from believing. He does "draw" us (Jn 6:44; 12:32) but we can refuse that drawing of Jesus for salvation.

The end result will be some will be damned because of their own fault. They did not choose to believe in Jesus. As far as I can see, that's what the Bible teaches.

Oz
 
wondering said:
I often wonder why some persons do not accept God's free gift of salvation.



Any thoughts?
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I think your comment would be more applicable if it were changed to read: "I often wonder why some persons who are convinced that there is a supreme being, and who believes that without salvation they will end up being tortured 24/7 for eternity do not accept a free gift of that salvation."
 
rstrats said:
I think your comment would be more applicable if it were changed to read: "I often wonder why some persons who are convinced that there is a supreme being, and who believes that without salvation they will end up being tortured 24/7 for eternity do not accept a free gift of that salvation."
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You think there are such persons?

I find that those that don't care to be saved really don't believe in God.

Why would they not accept God in YOUR scenario?
 
wondering said:
He won't answer to explain what it means.
It's very simple.
I DO wonder what he thinks it means.....
:chin
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wondering,

He's/she's skirting around the issue. Seems the person is not prepared to explain the meaning to us in direct language.

Oz
 
rstrats said:
Are you saying that a person can except the gift of salvation even if they don't believe that a supreme being exists?
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rstats,

I think you need to know the difference between "accept" and "except." In this sentence I think your "except" should be "accept."

Heb 11:6 (NIV) answers your question: "And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him."

So we must believe God exists before we can come to him and earnestly seek him.

Oz
 
rstrats said:
My bad, I have a reason but no excuse. BTW, it's rstrats and not rstats.
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rstrats,

Thank you for correcting my error in the spelling of your non deplume. What, then, is your explanation for some not being saved?

Oz
 
Who Me said:
You are not arguing with me but with Jesus.

Those who reject Jesus as John3:18 says are already condemned. This condemnation is confirmed when they are judged after there death.
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So if a atheist comes to believe in Jesus its too late? OR rather when they die in their unbelief its too late.
Just as people are destined to die once, and after that to face judgment.

I would state people who don't believe die in THEIR "sins"

The wages of sin is death.

In unbelief guilt remains.

Jesus said, “If you were blind, you would not be guilty of sin; but now that you claim you can see, your guilt remains.

So if asked, "will I die because I don't believe in Jesus?"
Its yes because Jesus is how God chose to forgive sin and apart from Him your guilt remains. You will die because of your own sin.

But he continued, “You are from below; I am from above. You are of this world; I am not of this world. 24I told you that you would die in your sins; if you do not believe that I am he, you will indeed die in your sins.”
 
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rstrats said:
I think your comment would be more applicable if it were changed to read: "I often wonder why some persons who are convinced that there is a supreme being, and who believes that without salvation they will end up being tortured 24/7 for eternity do not accept a free gift of that salvation."
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We have a witness the world doesn't know. "The Spirit of truth".

You must believe you are just flesh so when you die its over.

We believe we are spirit in the tent of the body. That God formed our spirit. That after the death of the body our spirit faces judgment. We believe in a resurrection of the unrighteous to judgment. We believe those in Christ will rise again to life without end.

You currently violate the greatest commandment.
’Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’

I believe archaeology will show a past temple and history of the Israelites in Israel. You have a vast witness of that God from the OT to the NT. If you believe its all made up so be it but your unbelief doesn't make it a lie.

I have the Spirit of Christ in me as a witness to my spirit to that truth. I have no reason to lie to you.
There are many in the grave today that regret the choices they made while in the life of the body.

Why are you here?
 
rstrats said:
I guess it might be because they didn't meet the supreme being's requirements needed to get their name written in the Book of Life.
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What would those requirements be and why couldn't they reach those requirements?

You're avoiding my question from #350. Let's be truthful and clear here.
 
for_his_glory said:
In three words, "lovers of self"
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Yes. To accept salvation, one has to acknowledge to one's self that one is a weak sinner, and that one's self is not God.

This is a huge obstacle for all of us. If many of the angels were unable to get past it, there's no surprise that we have difficulty with it.

Fortunately, He is merciful and long-suffering, desiring that not one of us be lost. But He has granted us the freedom to decide for ourselves.
 
OzSpen,
re: "What would those requirements be...?"

I don't know. But unless universalism is true, there must be some. Internet forums are rife with ideas about what are and what aren't requirements.


re: "...and why couldn't they reach those requirements?"

Some of them might require a change of feelings, e.g., belief in a supreme being, etc.


re: "You're avoiding my question from #350."

You asked for my explanation for some not being saved. I answered in post #352.
 
rstrats said:
I guess it might be because they didn't meet the supreme being's requirements needed to get their name written in the Book of Life.
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There is no need to "guess it might be." God has given this message with clarity, "And it is impossible to please God without faith. Anyone who wants to come to him must believe that God exists and that he rewards those who sincerely seek him" (Heb 11:6 NLT).

To please God,
  • The person must have faith (in God);
  • The person must believe God exists, and
  • They must believe God rewards those who sincerely seek him.
These beliefs are fundamental to receiving rewards from God - including eternal life.

Oz
 
rstrats said:
OzSpen,
re: "What would those requirements be...?"

I don't know. But unless universalism is true, there must be some. Internet forums are rife with ideas about what are and what aren't requirements.


re: "...and why couldn't they reach those requirements?"

Some of them might require a change of feelings, e.g., belief in a supreme being, etc.


re: "You're avoiding my question from #350."

You asked for my explanation for some not being saved. I answered in post #352.
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Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, everyone who sins is a slave to sin. 35Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever. 36So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.

For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”

Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, the new creation has come: The old has gone, the new is here!

You will not be able to overcome this world and live apart from the grace of God found in Christ Jesus.

Just as the living Father sent me and I live because of the Father, so the one who feeds on me will live because of me

At the start the world was full of unrestrained sin, ignorance, and many false Gods.

Jesus to Paul
‘I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting,’ the Lord replied. 16‘Now get up and stand on your feet. I have appeared to you to appoint you as a servant and as a witness of what you have seen and will see of me. 17I will rescue you from your own people and from the Gentiles. I am sending you to them 18to open their eyes and turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, so that they may receive forgiveness of sins and a place among those who are sanctified by faith in me.’

It is the Father who sent Jesus and the one who glorifies Jesus. He gave Jesus a name above all names that Jesus may give eternal life to all those the Father gives Him.
 
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