Some Won't Get Saved

[Randy]

Rev 21:7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
Rev 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

Just trying to show causes NOT from Gods will or act that cause people to perish.

I agree we must overcome this world which can only be by the Son setting us free from the enslavement of sin. - Christ in us.



They answered him, “We are Abraham’s descendants and have never been slaves of anyone. How can you say that we shall be set free?”
34 Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, everyone who sins is a slave to sin. 35 Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever. 36 So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed

In fact, this is love for God: to keep his commands. And his commands are not burdensome, 4for everyone born of God overcomes the world. This is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. 5Who is it that overcomes the world? Only the one who believes that Jesus is the Son of God.

 

[Bethel]

In fact, this is love for God: to keep his commands. And his commands are not burdensome, 4for everyone born of God overcomes the world. This is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. 5Who is it that overcomes the world? Only the one who believes that Jesus is the Son of God.

What you posted is very beautiful.
Nothing is more beautiful than a soul saved and a saved soul giving Credit to Christ for being their eternal life.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

I often wonder why some persons do not accept God's free gift of salvation.

All that is necessary is to accept it.

Maybe it's fear of letting go and trusting God...
Maybe it's a sin they can't let go of...
They could just be atheist...

Any thoughts?

Only God knows for sure.

 

[Who Me]

To the contrary, Who Me,

Those who reject the idea of God saving and people choosing to reject the light of God in creation (Rom 1:18-30 ESV) and to reject the light of God in conscience (Rom 2:7 ESV) are the ones who will be damned.

Yes, God elects but it is not on the basis of "you are in" and "you are out" by the arbitrary will of God.

Oz

That is not what John 3:18 teaches.

 

[GodsGrace]

That is not what John 3:18 teaches.

What does john 3:18 teach ?

 

[GodsGrace]

Only God knows for sure.

Don't you think a person can know why they don't believe?

We here can come up with different reasons - but an individual person certainly knows why they do not believe.

For most of those I speak to, it's because they don't accept that God exists.

 

[Randy]

Don't you think a person can know why they don't believe?

We here can come up with different reasons - but an individual person certainly knows why they do not believe.

For most of those I speak to, it's because they don't accept that God exists.

While what you state is accurate John 3:18 context was the Israelites who believed that God exists but didn't believe in Jesus. That is Jesus came from God and was testifying to the truth He received from God. That He was the living bread that came down from heaven and that whoever eats this bread will live forever. They also hated Him because He testified that what they did was evil. He pointed out their hypocrisy. But those on the side of truth listened to Him.

 

[OzSpen]

That is not what John 3:18 teaches.

Your verse does not prove what you want it to say. Because of human free will, we can choose to accept or reject the Saviour. We are damned by our refusal to accept God's offer of salvation.

 

[GodsGrace]

That is not what John 3:18 teaches.

What do you believe it means?

 

[Randy]

Your verse does not prove what you want it to say. Because of human free will, we can choose to accept or reject the Saviour. We are damned by our refusal to accept God's offer of salvation.

That's the consequence of rejecting the atonement as their "guilt" remains and they are actually condemned by what they did as in the wages of sin is death.

And one in Judaism might state I don't need Jesus I can just ask God to forgive me.

But the Lord would answer, "Its not for you to choose how to forgive sin"

Its salvation through the forgiveness of sins - The straight path John the Baptist prepared the people for the Lord.

There are those in religions that don't believe in Jesus and there are those who don't believe in God.

I having difficulty seeing were you and wondering differ.

 

[OzSpen]

That is not what John 3:18 teaches.

Who Me,

John 3:18 (ESV) does not prove what you want it to prove: "Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God."

Those who will not be saved are "whoever does not believe is condemned already" and they are damned because "he has not believed." I have no difficulty with admitting that some will be damned because of their free will choice not to believe.

Oz

 

[GodsGrace]

Who Me,

John 3:18 (ESV) does not prove what you want it to prove: "Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God."

Those who will not be saved are "whoever does not believe is condemned already" and they are damned because "he has not believed." I have no difficulty with admitting that some will be damned because of their free will choice not to believe.

Oz

He won't answer to explain what it means.
It's very simple.
I DO wonder what he thinks it means.....

 

[OzSpen]

He won't answer to explain what it means.
It's very simple.
I DO wonder what he thinks it means.....

wondering,

You are correct in that the meaning of John 3:18 is for 'whoever believes' is quite simple. It is not for those whom God chooses to predestine. It is for human beings who believe - "whoever believes."

This situation is solved easily if we introduce human free will into the equation. This is not works salvation but is the way God has organized it that human beings must respond in faith to Jesus. They must believe.

Oz

 

[Who Me]

What does john 3:18 teach ?

If you have not understood it when you read it.

Then it teaches that judgement does not wait untill the second coming but happens at the moment one rejects Jesus as saviour.

 

[Who Me]

We are damned by our refusal to accept God's offer of salvation.

As you say, by rejecting Jesus one is damned.

 

[OzSpen]

If you have not understood it when you read it.

Then it teaches that judgement does not wait untill the second coming but happens at the moment one rejects Jesus as saviour.

Who Me,

That is not what Heb 9:27 (NIV) teaches: "Just as people are destined to die once, and after that to face judgment, . ."

I suggest you read The Book to determine what happens at death. You have not given me confidence about where I go, as a Christian, at death.

Oz

 

[Who Me]

Who Me,

That is not what Heb 9:27 (NIV) teaches: "Just as people are destined to die once, and after that to face judgment, . ."

I suggest you read The Book to determine what happens at death. You have not given me confidence about where I go, as a Christian, at death.

Oz

You are not arguing with me but with Jesus.

Those who reject Jesus as John3:18 says are already condemned. This condemnation is confirmed when they are judged after there death.

 

[OzSpen]

You are not arguing with me but with Jesus.

Those who reject Jesus as John3:18 says are already condemned. This condemnation is confirmed when they are judged after there death.

Who Me,

​

THEY are arguing with Jesus as it is THEY who believe and not some God who deterministically determines who will be saved. I'm also supported by the Lord God of the OT:

​

Now therefore fear the Lord and serve him in sincerity and in faithfulness. Put away the gods that your fathers served beyond the River and in Egypt, and serve the Lord. And if it is evil in your eyes to serve the Lord, choose this day whom you will serve, whether the gods your fathers served in the region beyond the River, or the gods of the Amorites in whose land you dwell. But as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord (Josh 24:14-15 ESV).​

People will be damned because they did not CHOOSE to believe in God and to believe in Jesus for salvation (Acts 16:31 ESV). The NT commands people to "(you) believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved."

Oz

 

[rstrats]

People will be damned because they did not CHOOSE to believe...

Are suggesting that people have the ability to consciously choose to believe that someone or something does or doesn't exist or that a certain proposition is or isn't true?

 

[GodsGrace]

Are suggesting that people have the ability to consciously choose to believe that someone or something does or doesn't exist or that a certain proposition is or isn't true?

Hi rstrats
Good to see you on a different thread!

Although I fear we will not be agreeing.


Free choice is all over the NT and OT.