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Spirit Dwelling in US ?

agua. said:
Gday Butch,

Isn't this the struggle between the Spirit and the flesh ? I mean the Christian may commit adultery but the Spirit will convince them they are in sin and lead them towards repentance. This is what Paul talked about in Romans 7&8 I think.
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Hi Aqua,

I don't know, it could be. I'm just wondering how God or the Spirit could be in that situation. I mean if God or the Spirit is literally inside of the human body it seems to me that they would be right in the middle of the sinful act. If the Scriptures mean God or the Spirit is, in, with, or among you as a collective whole I could see how a person could separate themselves, even if just for a time, while in the sinful act and God or the Spirit wouldn't be present at the act.
 
Butch5 said:
That's what I've found doing a quick search of the more memorable passages. I'm sure there are plenty that need to be checked. Since they are plural Paul is speaking of the group collectively. That would mean dwelling in the group collectively. I was looking for a passage that would require an interpretation where God/Spirit dwells inside of a single individual. That would pretty much make the case.
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Two questions for you and RevSRE and agua. or anyone for that matter.

Psalms 51 - David said, do not take your holy spirit from me. What do you think he meant?

Is the gift of the Holy Spirit indwelling? It is given to individuals.
Peter said, repent, be baptized, and receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
 
First I want to offer what I have always been told, I may have to think a little more on it.
God the Holy Spirit is everywhere and "sin" is not new to Him. He is in us as the comforter and we in Him , He cannot and will not partake of sin. YES, if we go so far as to sin (big or little) we expose our God to our sin. That is a very serious thing to be guilty of. We brought disgrace to our-self in the presence of The Most High GOD!

Psalms 51 - David said, do not take your holy spirit from me. What do you think he meant?
David was in a different time a time when the Holy Spirit "Moved upon people" David knew he needed the Spirit to be a good King. David ask forgiveness he repented and ask KJV
Psa 51:9 Hide thy face from my sins, and blot out all mine iniquities.
Psa 51:10 Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me.
Psa 51:11 Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me.
Psa 51:12 Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free spirit.

Is the gift of the Holy Spirit indwelling? It is given to individuals.
I think like David, when we truly come to God and repent, The Holy Spirit dwells in us This Body becomes the temple of God, WE are Priest of the Most High God, with Christ as our High Priest, we are adopted into the family of God, ( think about it we are not called children of Abraham we are called CHILDREN OF GOD!)
KJV
1Co_3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
1Co_3:17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.
 
RevSRE said:
First I want to offer what I have always been told, I may have to think a little more on it.
God the Holy Spirit is everywhere and "sin" is not new to Him. He is in us as the comforter and we in Him , He cannot and will not partake of sin. YES, if we go so far as to sin (big or little) we expose our God to our sin. That is a very serious thing to be guilty of. We brought disgrace to our-self in the presence of The Most High GOD!

Psalms 51 - David said, do not take your holy spirit from me. What do you think he meant?
David was in a different time a time when the Holy Spirit "Moved upon people" David knew he needed the Spirit to be a good King. David ask forgiveness he repented and ask KJV
Psa 51:9 Hide thy face from my sins, and blot out all mine iniquities.
Psa 51:10 Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me.
Psa 51:11 Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me.
Psa 51:12 Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free spirit.

Is the gift of the Holy Spirit indwelling? It is given to individuals.
I think like David, when we truly come to God and repent, The Holy Spirit dwells in us This Body becomes the temple of God, WE are Priest of the Most High God, with Christ as our High Priest, we are adopted into the family of God, ( think about it we are not called children of Abraham we are called CHILDREN OF GOD!)
KJV
1Co_3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
1Co_3:17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.
Click to expand...

You gave really good answers and I gave no explanation for my questions.
I was trying to think of a verse that would grammatically show that an individual can/is indwellt by the Holy Spirit.

When I read what David wrote, not just this Psalms, I get the impression that he did have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. I know it's taught that no one had it all the time. That the HS would just overcome them at certain times.
 
Deborah13 said:
Two questions for you and RevSRE and agua. or anyone for that matter.

Psalms 51 - David said, do not take your holy spirit from me. What do you think he meant?

Is the gift of the Holy Spirit indwelling? It is given to individuals.
Peter said, repent, be baptized, and receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Click to expand...

David was indwelt with the Holy Spirit same as you :) imo

I believe the Holy spirit has always indwelt believers and they're saved by grace through faith OT and NT. I think some confusion comes when people think all of Israel were true believers and that wasn't the case. There has always been a remnant of true believers though imo. Also recall the OT Prophets.

1Pe 1:10-11 Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you: (11) Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

Including Noah

1Pe 3:18-20 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: (19) By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison; (20) Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.


In the NT the Holy spirit became more effusive and came to the whole world as prophesied by Joel .
 
agua. said:
David was indwelt with the Holy Spirit same as you :) imo

I believe the Holy spirit has always indwelt believers and they're saved by grace through faith OT and NT. I think some confusion comes when people think all of Israel were true believers and that wasn't the case. There has always been a remnant of true believers though imo. Also recall the OT Prophets.

1Pe 1:10-11 Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you: (11) Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

Including Noah

1Pe 3:18-20 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: (19) By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison; (20) Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.


In the NT the Holy spirit became more effusive and came to the whole world as prophesied by Joel .
Click to expand...

:amen:goodpost
 
Butch5 said:
Hi Aqua,

I don't know, it could be. I'm just wondering how God or the Spirit could be in that situation. I mean if God or the Spirit is literally inside of the human body it seems to me that they would be right in the middle of the sinful act. If the Scriptures mean God or the Spirit is, in, with, or among you as a collective whole I could see how a person could separate themselves, even if just for a time, while in the sinful act and God or the Spirit wouldn't be present at the act.
Click to expand...

Sure Butch but we have the Holy spirit here upon the Earth as we speak and yet satan is the ruler of this world. God helps us, and the Spirit intercedes for us , but doesn't stop us from sinning. imo Do you believe the Holy spirit cannot be present when we sin ? If this is the case He must come and go a lot ( that sounds like a joke but think about it )
 
Deborah13 said:
You gave really good answers and I gave no explanation for my questions.
I was trying to think of a verse that would grammatically show that an individual can/is indwellt by the Holy Spirit.

When I read what David wrote, not just this Psalms, I get the impression that he did have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. I know it's taught that no one had it all the time. That the HS would just overcome them at certain times.
Click to expand...
Ezekiel 36:26-27; "I will put my Spirit in you and move you to follow my decrees and be careful to keep my laws".
 
Butch5 said:
I was looking for a passage that would require an interpretation where God/Spirit dwells inside of a single individual. That would pretty much make the case.
Click to expand...
Luke 1:15 (ESV) ​
for he will be great before the Lord. And he must not drink wine or strong drink, and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit, even from his mother's womb.
[That’s pretty personal.]
Luke 1:41 (ESV)​
And when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, the baby leaped in her womb. And Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit,
[That too. But was JTB special with respect to the Spirit being in him?]
Ephesians 5:18 (ESV) And do not get drunk with wine, for that is debauchery, but be filled with the Spirit,​
Do church bodies get drunk? No, some individual people within it do.
Acts 2:38 Lexham English Bible (LEB) 38 And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized, each one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.​
Hmm, do we baptize a ‘church’ or do individuals, “each one of us” that repents, get baptized and receive the gift…? Why say “each one of you” if that’s not what he meant?
 
chessman said:
Luke 1:15 (ESV) ​
for he will be great before the Lord. And he must not drink wine or strong drink, and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit, even from his mother's womb.
[That’s pretty personal.]
Luke 1:41 (ESV)​
And when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, the baby leaped in her womb. And Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit,
[That too. But was JTB special with respect to the Spirit being in him?]
Ephesians 5:18 (ESV) And do not get drunk with wine, for that is debauchery, but be filled with the Spirit,​
Do church bodies get drunk? No, some individual people within it do.
Acts 2:38 Lexham English Bible (LEB) 38 And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized, each one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.​
Hmm, do we baptize a ‘church’ or do individuals, “each one of us” that repents, get baptized and receive the gift…? Why say “each one of you” if that’s not what he meant?
Click to expand...

Hi chessman,

These are good passages. What I'm trying to get at is the "indwelling" of the Spirit. I guess a better way to put it might be does the Holy Spirit "live" in the person. We know that a person can have a spirit in them we see that from the Scriptures. To dwell means to live in a place. I'm trying to see if the Holy Spirit actually abides in us not just comes and goes. Does that make sense?

The passages from Luke seem to strongly suggest this at least verse 15. I don't think the Ephesians passage is talking about the Holy Spirit and the Acts passage doesn't necessitate that receiving the Spirit be an indwelling
 
agua. said:
Sure Butch but we have the Holy spirit here upon the Earth as we speak and yet satan is the ruler of this world. God helps us, and the Spirit intercedes for us , but doesn't stop us from sinning. imo Do you believe the Holy spirit cannot be present when we sin ? If this is the case He must come and go a lot ( that sounds like a joke but think about it )
Click to expand...

Hi agua,

That's actually what I am considering. Does the Spirit come and go from within our physical bodies or is the Spirit just among us collectively, or maybe both. I don't know if the Spirit can be present when there is sin, that is one of the reasons that has made me wonder about this subject.
 
Butch5 said:
Hi agua,

That's actually what I am considering. Does the Spirit come and go from within our physical bodies or is the Spirit just among us collectively, or maybe both. I don't know if the Spirit can be present when there is sin, that is one of the reasons that has made me wonder about this subject.
Click to expand...

That's a good question, that I asked awhile back, but worded much more poorly than yours. What it amounts to is that we do have the constant indwelling of the Holy Spirit, as came after Jesus ascended to the father (The Comforter) which acts as our conscience and nudges us towards God...However, this is not the same as "being in the Spirit" which comes and goes as you say.

Even john in Revelation confirms this.

Revelation 1:9-10
9 I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.

10 I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,/(KJV)

We can't live being in the Spirit constantly. It is too much in most circumstances. Think of people in church being overcome by the Spirit. They fall down usually and many times can not speak. This is the time when revelation is given, healing takes place, visions are seen (like John) and so forth and so on. I believe that there is different levels of intensity of being in the Spirit. Some have reported of being in the Spirit for 30 days and such, while usually it does not last that long. I don't think we can sin in that state, or if we did, the Spirit would be grieved and leave. But the 'indwelling' which we have never leaves. I hope I'm making sense. When I asked this question before, awhile back, I didn't really know what I was talking about, and was misunderstood and was told that of course we are indwelt, it is a promise. But what I really meant was being "in the Spirit"

 
Deborah13 said:
I agree with you, we are indwelled. I've never heard associated but I'm going to see what I can find, if anything.
If you don't mind, what denomination is your supervisor?
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Ha, Ha, Deb. I'll bet he wasn't Pentecostal!! or Bapticostal.:rofl2
 
Butch5
What about
1Co 6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
 
Deborah13 said:
Butch5
What about
1Co 6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
Click to expand...

Hi Deborah,

This is one of the first passages I looked at. I am currently trying to see exactly what it means. However, the words "your" and "you" are both plural. It seems to me that by body Paul is referring to the body of believers in the Corinthian church as a collective group since he uses plural pronouns.
 
Edward said:
That's a good question, that I asked awhile back, but worded much more poorly than yours. What it amounts to is that we do have the constant indwelling of the Holy Spirit, as came after Jesus ascended to the father (The Comforter) which acts as our conscience and nudges us towards God...However, this is not the same as "being in the Spirit" which comes and goes as you say.

Even john in Revelation confirms this.

Revelation 1:9-10
9 I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.

10 I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,/(KJV)

We can't live being in the Spirit constantly. It is too much in most circumstances. Think of people in church being overcome by the Spirit. They fall down usually and many times can not speak. This is the time when revelation is given, healing takes place, visions are seen (like John) and so forth and so on. I believe that there is different levels of intensity of being in the Spirit. Some have reported of being in the Spirit for 30 days and such, while usually it does not last that long. I don't think we can sin in that state, or if we did, the Spirit would be grieved and leave. But the 'indwelling' which we have never leaves. I hope I'm making sense. When I asked this question before, awhile back, I didn't really know what I was talking about, and was misunderstood and was told that of course we are indwelt, it is a promise. But what I really meant was being "in the Spirit"
Click to expand...

Hi Edward,

This isn't quite where I was going with the question. I wasn't referring to any gifts. My understanding of that is different from what you've posted here. What I'm trying to get at is where the Holy Spirit dwells.
 
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