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The Cross Is From Paganism

Mystery Babylon
Quoting: Mr. Rev. Clarence Larkin.
“When Attalus, the Pontiff and King of Pergamos, died B.C. 133, he bequeathed the Headship of the Babylonian Priesthood to Rome.

When the Etruscans came to Italy from Lydia (The region of Pergamos), they brought with them the Babylonian religion and rites. They set up a Pontiff who was head of the Priesthood. Later the Romans accepted this Pontiff as their civil ruler. Julius Caesar was made Pontiff of the Etruscan Order in B.C. 74. In B. C. 63, he was made Supreme Pontiff of the “Babylonian Order,” thus becoming heir to the rights an title of Attalus, Pontiff of Pergamos…Thus the first Roman Emperor become head of the “Babylonian Priesthood” and Rome the successor of Babylon (p. 151-152).” ...

Constantine the Great coinage carried the symbols of the sun-cult until 324. Even when he dedicated the new capital of Constantinople, which became the seat of Byzantine Christianity for a millennium, he did so wearing the Apollonian sun-rayed Diadem. Constantine was the Pagan High priest of the Babylonian Mystery cult.

Attalus III (in Greek Attalos III) Philometor Euergetes (ca 170 BC – 133 BC) was the last Attalid king of Pergamon, ruling from 138 BC to 133 BC.

Rev. Alexander Hislop states: “… There never has been any difficulty in the mind of any enlightened Protestant in identifying the woman sitting on seven hills, and having on her fore head the name written ‘Mystery, Babylon the great,’ with the Roman apostasy. No other city in the world has ever been celebrated, as the city of Rome has … for its situation on seven hills (p. 2).”

Mystery Babylon.

That city is Rome, and more specifically, Vatican City.

Catholic apologist Karl Keating admits that Rome has long been known as Babylon. Keating claims that Peter's statement "The church here in Babylon ... sends you her greeting" (from I Peter 5:13) proves that Peter was writing from Rome. He explains further:

"Babylon is a code word for Rome. It is used that way six times in the last book of the Bible [four of the six are in chapters 17 and 18 and in extrabiblical works such as Sibylling Oracles (5, 159f.), the Apocalypse of Baruch (ii, 1), and 4 Esdras (3:1).

Eusebius Pamphilius, writing about 303, noted that "it is said that Peter's first epistle... was composed at Rome itself; and that he himself indicates this, referring to the city figuratively as Babylon."

Interesting as ancient history is, pagan practises have no relevance to Christianity.

The cross is an Instrumpet of torture and slow cruel death.
Only the spiritually blind believe it is a talisman.

As for plenary indulgences.

Only Jesus forgives all sins, trusting in an indulgence rather than in Jesus is foolhardy.
 
The word stake was replaced with the word cross.

Luke 9:23.
23 Then he said to them all: “Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their (cross / stake) daily and follow me.
So you believe that God's Word is so weak that a word that supposedly matters SO MUCH (cross vs stake) is easily changed en masse by mere men? Lol. Sad. Clearly the term 'Cross' is correct.

biblehub.com/luke/9-23.htm

Tell me, why do nonBelievers like to use an upside down CROSS to mock Christianity? Why not use a stake? Why did kkk burn CROSSES and not stakes?? Why do grave come in the shape of cross but never stake??

! your belief DOES NOT FOLLOW/FIT with the evidence. !!

Your hyperpaganism (believing "this is pagan that is pagan everything i find odd/out of place is pagan") is nonBiblical and gets you nowhere.

Hyperpaganism paranoia makes a bad image on Christians and athiests use such people as examples, to smear Christianity.


Jesus did not die on a "cross", but died upon a torture stake, for that is the meaning of the Greek word stauros, and is used interchangeably by the Bible writers with the Greek word xylon, translated as "tree" or "wood" by the King James Bible
So a random guy on the interwebs has more credibility and knowledge on the subject than those behind the majority of translations, which accept "cross" and dont use 'stake'? LOL!
 
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Constantine the Great coinage carried the symbols of the sun-cult until 324.
Oh? What symbols were they?

Examples?

Even when he dedicated the new capital of Constantinople, which became the seat of Byzantine Christianity for a millennium, he did so wearing the Apollonian sun-rayed Diadem. Constantine was the Pagan High priest of the Babylonian Mystery cult.
From where did your "rev" get this info? Just trust him on a say so, right?

Okay, all this info tells us nothing about why the Cross is somehow pagan.

Why does the Bible talk about "carrying your Cross"? Luke 9:23

Do you really believe that God wants us to take up a pagan symbol daily?? Your belief is not rooted in the Bible but in vague, arbitrary connections.
 
Just like Unitarianism, " stakeism " is a thing cults tend to believe.

Certain cults, most notably the Jehovah’s Witnesses, are adamant that Jesus did not die on a cross and that the cross is in fact a pagan symbol. Their insistence on this point is curious, given the ambiguity of the Greek word. But they have worded their New World Translation to say that Jesus died on a “torture stake” rather than a cross. Given that the Jehovah’s Witnesses also deny the deity of Christ and His bodily resurrection, it stands to reason that they should object to other details of traditional Christianity.

Arguing against the Jehovah’s Witnesses’ teaching that Jesus died on a “torture stake” are some indirect clues in the New Testament. One of these is found in John 21. Jesus gives Peter a glimpse of the manner of his death: “‘When you are old you will stretch out your hands, and someone else will dress you and lead you where you do not want to go.’ Jesus said this to indicate the kind of death by which Peter would glorify God” (verses 18–19). The fact that Peter (who tradition says was crucified) would “stretch out” his hands indicates that Roman crucifixion usually involved outspread arms such as would be positioned on a crosspiece.

The other clue that Jesus was crucified on a cross is found in John 20. Thomas, in his famous moment of doubt, said, “Unless I see the nail marks in his hands and put my finger where the nails were, and put my hand into his side, I will not believe” (verse 25). Note Thomas’s mention of the nails (plural) that had scarred Jesus’ hands. If Jesus had been crucified on a stake or a pole, only one nail would have been used. The fact of two nails in the hands suggests a traditional cross.



Doubt the stake side has many solid answers to this.
 
The first thing I looked at supports a traditional cross. There is a lot of evidence you’re not addressing. Not to mention:

Mat 27:37 And over his head they put the charge against him, which read, “This is Jesus, the King of the Jews.” (ESV)

Jhn 19:19 Pilate also wrote an inscription and put it on the cross. It read, “Jesus of Nazareth, the King of the Jews.”
Jhn 19:20 Many of the Jews read this inscription, for the place where Jesus was crucified was near the city, and it was written in Aramaic, in Latin, and in Greek. (ESV)

So, it would seem a rather sizeable inscription was put above his head, not his hands.
Jhn 21:18 Truly, truly, I say to you, when you were young, you used to dress yourself and walk wherever you wanted, but when you are old, you will stretch out your hands, and another will dress you and carry you where you do not want to go.”
Jhn 21:19 (This he said to show by what kind of death he was to glorify God.) And after saying this he said to him, “Follow me.” (ESV)

Hands stretched out would indicate crucifixion on a cross, not a stake.

The Cross as a Talisman

A talisman is an object that someone believes holds magical properties that brings good luck protecting the possessor from evil or harm.
This has nothing to do with anything. If you want to make that argument, then the very same argument applies to “torture stake.”

You should listen to the audio in THIS LINK to hear just how the cross is hated by demons, based on Dr. Walter Martin’s personal experience with exorcisms.

A plenary indulgence removes all punishment due for sins. The Cross on the Catholics death bed is for that purpose.






Yahshua did not die on a "cross", but died upon a torture stake,
He died on a cross, as history indicates.

for that is the meaning of the Greek word stauros, and is used interchangeably by the Bible writers with the Greek word xylon, translated as "tree" or "wood" by the King James Bible.(Acts 5:30)

For Yahshua to become the "accursed" one, to fulfill the Mosaic Law, it was required for him to die upon a "tree" or more literally a "stake", for Deuteronomy 21:22,23 says: " And if a man have committed a sin worthy of death, and he be to be put to death, and thou hang him on a tree.(Hebrew ‛ets´) His body shall not remain all night upon the tree (Hebrew ‛ets´), but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day; (for he that is hanged is accursed of God."

The apostle Paul quoted from Deuteronomy 21:23, saying that "Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree (Greek xylon ):"(Gal 3:13, King James Bible)

Thus, the Hebrew word ‛ets´ corresponds to the Greek word xylon and means a timber, or a "beam". To show that this is the case, at 1 Kings 6:15, in building the temple, it said that Solomon, "from the floor of the house up to the rafters of the ceiling he overlaid (the walls) with timber (Hebrew ‛ets´) inside." Thus, "timber" ("a large piece of wood, usually squared, used in a building, for example, as a beam", Microsoft® Encarta® Reference Library 2005) of cedar was used to overlay the walls, and was upright "timber" of wood and not "cross" forms.

The online interlinear Scripture4all renders xylon as "wood". Another Greek word used for the instrument Yahshua died upon, stauros, is at Matthew 10:38; 16:24; 27:32, 40, 42 and is rendered as "pale"(online interlinear Scripture4all ), which means "fence stake: a pointed slat of wood for a fence."(Microsoft® Encarta® Reference Library 2005) That he died upon a "pole" or "stake", is that the apostle Peter said of Yahshua, that "we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree:"(Acts 10:39, King James Bible; "tree", Greek xylon)

The apostle Paul told the Jews in Antioch in Pisidia, that "when they had fulfilled all that was written of him, they took him (Yahshua) down from the tree." (Acts 13:29, King James Bible; "tree", Greek xylon) The apostle Peter wrote: "Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree."(1 Peter 2:24, King James Bible; "tree", Greek xylon) Hence, Yahshua died upon a "tree" or "pale", a "stake", not cross.

The Hebrews had no word for the traditional cross. To designate such an implement, they used “warp and woof,” alluding to yarns running lengthwise in a fabric and others going across it on a loom.(Lev 13:56-59) The French Dictionnaire Encyclopédique Universel (Encyclopedic Universal Dictionary) says: “For a long time we believed that the cross, considered a religious symbol, was specifically for Christians. This is not the case.” The book Dual Heritage—The Bible and the British Museum (1986) states: “It may come as a shock to know that there is no word such as ‘cross’ in the Greek of the New Testament. The word translated ‘cross’ is always the Greek word [stau·ros´] meaning a ‘stake’ or ‘upright pale.’ The cross was not originally a Christian symbol; it is derived from Egypt and Constantine.”

The New Strong's Concise Concordance & Vine's Concise Dictionary of the Bible states that the meaning of "stauros (4716) denotes, primarily , "an upright pale or stake." On such malefactors were nailed for execution. Both the noun and the verb stauroo, "to fasten to a stake or pale," are originally to be distinguished from the ecclesiastical form of a two beamed "cross." The shape of the latter had its origin in ancient Chaldea, and was used as the symbol of the god Tammuz (being in the shape of the mystic Tau, the initial of his name) in that country and in adjacent lands, including Egypt. By the middle of the 3rd cent. A.D. the churches had either departed from, or had travestied, certain doctrines of the Christian faith. In order to increase the prestige of the apostate ecclesiastical system pagans were received into the churches apart from regeneration by faith, and were permitted largely to retain their pagan signs and symbols. Hence the Tau or T, in its most frequent form, with the cross-piece lowered, was adopted to stand for the "cross" of Christ."(Vine's Concise Dictionary of the Bible, pg 75, 1999 edition)

Under the Hebrew word ‛ets´ (6086), Vine's Concise Dictionary of the Bible says "tree; wood; timber; stick; stalk." It goes on to say that "this word may signify a single "tree," as it does in Gen. 2:9; or a genus of tree, Isa. 41:19. ‛ets´ can mean "wood as a material from which things are constructed, as a raw material to be carved, Exod. 31:5. Large unprocessed pieces of "wood or timber" are also signified by ‛ets´, Hag 1:8. The end product of wood already processed and fashioned into something may be indicated by ‛ets´, Lev 11:32. This word means "stick" or "piece of wood" in Ezek. 37:16...‛ets´ one time means "stalk," Josh. 2:6."(pg 387)

And under the Greek word xylon (3586), Vine's Concise Dictionary of the Bible says "wood, a piece of wood, anything made of wood," is used, with the rendering "tree,"....the tree being the stauros, the upright pale or stake to which Romans nailed those who were thus to be executed, Acts 5:30; 10:39; 13:29; 1 Pet 2:24."(pg 387-88)

Thus, whether it be ‛ets´, xylon, or stauros, the meaning was the same, that of a "tree", "timber", "wood", "stick", or "upright pale or stake" and not a cross.
Not relevant.
 
Interesting as ancient history is, pagan practises have no relevance to Christianity.

The cross is an Instrumpet of torture and slow cruel death.
Only the spiritually blind believe it is a talisman.

As for plenary indulgences.

Only Jesus forgives all sins, trusting in an indulgence rather than in Jesus is foolhardy.
The Messiah had to die on a stake or pole to fulfill prophecy.
 
Which verse says stake/pole specifically?
Deuteronomy 21:22
If someone guilty of a capital offense is put to death and their body is exposed on a pole,

Deuteronomy 21:23
you must not leave the body hanging on the pole overnight. Be sure to bury it that same day, because anyone who is hung on a pole is under God’s curse. You must not desecrate the land the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance.


Numbers 21:8
The Lord said to Moses, “Make a snake and put it up on a pole; anyone who is bitten can look at it and live.”

Numbers 21:9
So Moses made a bronze snake and put it up on a pole. Then when anyone was bitten by a snake and looked at the bronze snake, they lived.


Sin hanged on a pole.


Galatians 3:13
Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who is hung on a pole.”
 
The religious symbolism of the cross has its roots in ancient paganism. It became a symbol of Christianity only after the time of Constantine. The historical record shows that Christianity adapted the influences of pagan worship, which included the symbol of the cross.

Christ died on a (stake / poll) in fulfillment of Moses prophecy. The cross is the mark of the (Beast / Nation.)
That is nothing more then the teaching (heresy) of the Watchtower (JW) society.

They reject the traditional symbol of Christianity, the cross, as being of pagan origin. They translate the Greek word from the Christian Scriptures "stauros" as "torture stake", and believe that Jesus was crucified on a single upright wooden stake with no crossbeam. They view the cross as an Idol and wearing or displaying one is considered idol worship.

The New World Translation is a translation of the KJV Bible rewritten and published by the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society. It is used and distributed by Jehovah's Witnesses.

They do not believe in the Trinity. Instead, they follow a strict monotheism, in which: Jehovah is the Supreme Being. Jesus is the Son of God, a created being. Christ is believed to have originally existed in a pre-human state as the Archangel Michael. He later took human form as a man like any other person, except that he was sinless at birth and remained so throughout his earthly life. Jehovah’s Witnesses do not believe in the bodily resurrection of Christ. They believe that after the crucifixion, Christ died and was resurrected as an invisible, non-material, glorious, spirit creature. They believe that Jesus appeared on earth after his resurrection in a special body that Jehovah created for him.
The Holy Spirit they believe, is not a separate entity, but is simply a force: the method by which God interacts with the world.
 
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You guys
That is nothing more then the teaching (heresy) of the Watchtower (JW) society.

They reject the traditional symbol of Christianity, the cross, as being of pagan origin. They translate the Greek word from the Christian Scriptures "stauros" as "torture stake", and believe that Jesus was crucified on a single upright wooden stake with no crossbeam. They view the cross as an Idol and wearing or displaying one is considered idol worship.
You Guys are not smart enough to talk with. Bye.
 
Deuteronomy 21:22
If someone guilty of a capital offense is put to death and their body is exposed on a pole,

Deuteronomy 21:23
you must not leave the body hanging on the pole overnight. Be sure to bury it that same day, because anyone who is hung on a pole is under God’s curse. You must not desecrate the land the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance.


Numbers 21:8
The Lord said to Moses, “Make a snake and put it up on a pole; anyone who is bitten can look at it and live.”

Numbers 21:9
So Moses made a bronze snake and put it up on a pole. Then when anyone was bitten by a snake and looked at the bronze snake, they lived.


Sin hanged on a pole.


Galatians 3:13
Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who is hung on a pole.”
You must post the Bible version you are referencing. I believe I have asked you to do this before.

The use of "pole" is not relevant. It isn't even relevant whether it's "pole" or "cross." Your argument misses the importance of the penal substitutionary atonement of Christ for our sins. The point is, he died on a tree (wood) for our sins and was raised again. This is not a relevant issue, although history does tell us it was a cross and the Bible strongly suggests it was.

Deu 21:22 “And if a man has committed a crime punishable by death and he is put to death, and you hang him on a tree,
Deu 21:23 his body shall not remain all night on the tree, but you shall bury him the same day, for a hanged man is cursed by God. You shall not defile your land that the LORD your God is giving you for an inheritance. (ESV)

Deu 21:22 "If a man has committed a sin worthy of death and he is put to death, and you hang him on a tree,
Deu 21:23 his corpse shall not hang all night on the tree, but you shall surely bury him on the same day (for he who is hanged is accursed of God), so that you do not defile your land which the LORD your God gives you as an inheritance. (NASB)

Deu 21:22 'And when there is in a man a sin—a cause of death, and he hath been put to death, and thou hast hanged him on a tree,
Deu 21:23 his corpse doth not remain on the tree, for thou dost certainly bury him in that day—for a thing lightly esteemed of God is the hanged one—and thou dost not defile thy ground which Jehovah thy God is giving to thee—an inheritance. (YLT)

Just picking one version that happens to support your beliefs doesn't prove anything.
 
You guys

You Guys are not smart enough to talk with. Bye.
That would probably be you because you had no answers to for_his_glory 's argument. So you just back out, because error is inherently indefensible. 1 Peter 3:15
Can your belief stand the 1 Peter 3:15 test? They haven't.
The devil hates the cross. He's not afraid of mere poles, we hang things from poles like flags. And he sure isn't scared of stakes either, which we use to anchor down tents with. No, he's afraid of the CROSS.

Early Christians did not believe your narrative as far as I know. Doubt you can show otherwise.
 
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