The Cross Is From Paganism

[Barbarian]

The Romans hanged people by both ways. The Messiah to come was to be hanged on a pole.

That's just a story you made up. But the evidence shows that Christians are right; Jesus was crucified on a cross.

KJV: Galatians 3:13 Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree”

You're making up things to suit your own wishes.

 

[Barbarian]

Ezra 6:11 is about Jewish law. Romans crucified Jesus, not Jews.

 

[KV-44-v1]

That's just a story you made up. But the evidence shows that Christians are right; Jesus was crucified on a cross.

KJV: Galatians 3:13 Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree”

You're making up things to suit your own wishes.

Mabye he believes that the Cross is just an allegory for some other method.

 

[locust]

It was removed because people were paying too much attention to it.

yes even as its done today to/with the cross . it needs to be destroyed as was the snake on the pole

 

[Free]

It was removed because people were paying too much attention to it.

Worshiping it, making offerings to it, and giving it a personal name is significantly more than "paying too much attention to it."

yes even as its done today to/with the cross . it needs to be destroyed as was the snake on the pole

2Ki 18:4 He removed the high places and broke the pillars and cut down the Asherah. And he broke in pieces the bronze serpent that Moses had made, for until those days the people of Israel had made offerings to it (it was called Nehushtan). (ESV)

How does that in any way relate to the cross?

 

[locust]

https://i.postimg.cc/8Cj03csC/360-F-645017611-f-Owjkt2xortjs64-KE5-X9bb-Wt-Hq-HLp-LAT-1.jpg

360 F 645017611 f Owjkt2xortjs64 KE5 X9bb Wt Hq HLp LAT (1) — Postimages

postimg.cc

 

[Free]

https://i.postimg.cc/8Cj03csC/360-F-645017611-f-Owjkt2xortjs64-KE5-X9bb-Wt-Hq-HLp-LAT-1.jpg

360 F 645017611 f Owjkt2xortjs64 KE5 X9bb Wt Hq HLp LAT (1) — Postimages

postimg.cc

Okay, but what is that actually showing? People worshiping and making sacrifices to the cross they call George? Or people worshiping God at the foot of the cross for what Christ accomplished for us? Besides, it's a made-up image, so it has no bearing on this discussion.

 

[locust]

I could be difficult getting a pic of the people giving worship to the snake on the pole .it would look remarkably the same
are you metaphorically in the pic ?

not want it an answer . the point is

John 4:24​

God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship with spirit and truth.”

John 4:23​

Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshippers will worship the Father with spirit and truth, for indeed, the Father is looking for ones like these to worship him.

 

[CherubRam]

That's just a story you made up. But the evidence shows that Christians are right; Jesus was crucified on a cross.

KJV: Galatians 3:13 Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree”

You're making up things to suit your own wishes.

Did the Romans crucify on a cross or stake?
The Bible doesn't specify the exact shape, and the Romans crucified people on a variety of shapes of crosses/stakes, including attaching people to trees. The word used in the New Testament can refer to simply a stake, but it doesn't necessarily.

The Messiah to come was to be hanged on a pole to fulfill Moses prophecy.

 

[locust]

Did the Romans crucify on a cross or stake?
The Bible doesn't specify the exact shape, and the Romans crucified people on a variety of shapes of crosses/stakes, including attaching people to trees. The word used in the New Testament can refer to simply a stake, but it doesn't necessarily.

The Messiah to come was to be hanged on a pole to fulfill Moses prophecy.

both , the cross bar did something the pole did not do . It prolonged the torture of hanging there for many more hours even days . You may have noted Jesus only hung on the pole for maybe 6 hours and then he died. had he been put on a cross it could have taken days for him to die. The Romans knew what they were doing it was a practice art

 

[CherubRam]

Sign of the cross
The Byzantine sign of the cross made with the right hand.

The Byzantine sign of the cross is made with thumb and the first twofingers of the right hand joined at the tips. The third and fourthfingers are closed on the palm.

The Byzantine way of making the sign of the cross pre-dates the Latin style used by the Roman Catholics.

The sign of the Trinity and Cross are both in the right hand.

The Hebrew word for sin is "chet," which literally means "missing the mark.”

The sign of being forgiven.
During the ancient days of Israel, if a person was forgiven in a court, theperson would receive a single ash mark on their forehead for everyone to see; that was done in remembrance of Moses’s snake on a pole.

The Catholic mark is a cross on the fore head made with a trinity sign with the right hand.

Revelation 14:9
A third angel followed them and said in a loud voice: “If anyone worships the beast and its image and receives its mark on their forehead or on their hand,

 

[CherubRam]

both , the cross bar did something the pole did not do . It prolonged the torture of hanging there for many more hours even days . You may have noted Jesus only hung on the pole for maybe 6 hours and then he died. had he been put on a cross it could have taken days for him to die. The Romans knew what they were doing it was a practice art

John 19:30. When he had received the drink, Jesus said, “It is finished.” With that, he bowed his head and gave up his spirit.

Upon fulfilling prophecy he left his body.

 

[CherubRam]

The word Cross.

Homeric and classical Greek
In Homeric and classical Greek, stauros meant an upright stake, pole, or piece of paling, upon which anything might be hung.
In the literature of that time, it never means two pieces of timber placed across one another at any angle, but always one piece alone.

Koine Greek
In Koine Greek, the form of Greek used between about 300 BC and AD 300,the word σταυρός (Stauros) was used to denote a structure on which theRomans executed criminals. In the writings of the Diodorus Siculus (1stcentury BC), Plutarch and Lucian – non-Christian writers, of whom onlyLucian makes clear the shape of the device – the word stauros isgenerally translated as "stake."

Crucify Cross Stake

Stauroo
stauroó: to stake out.

Original Word: σταυρόω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: stauroó
Phonetic Spelling: (stow-ro'-o)
Definition: To fix to a stake; fig: To destroy, or mortify.

Stauros
stauros: an upright stake.

Original Word: σταυρός, οῦ, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: stauros
Phonetic Spelling: (stow-ros')
Definition: a stake.

Origin of the word crux. Latin for: stake, scaffold, or cross, used in executions or torment.
The English term "cross" is derived from the Latin word crux. From about 1635 to 1645 AD.

Labarum
An upright pole with cross section to display a standard such as a flag, banner, or emblem.

Word Origin
From Late Latin, and of obscure origin
This standard was known by the name "labarum"—a word the etymology of which is very uncertain. The etymology of the word is unclear. Some derive itfrom Latin /labāre/ "to totter, or to waver." The labarum was also used to hold the ancient Babylonian sky-god emblem.

Patibulum
It is a establish fact that the two-beamed cross was in existence in the time of Yahshua, and that the word crux was used to refer to it. The crux was composed of two main pieces: The stipes, which is the upright pole,and the patibulum attached to it. The patibulum is the cross beam.

Stipe
Stipe is an upright support.

From Latin stipes "log, post, tree trunk"

Stauros
Stauros (σταυρός) is the Greek word for stake or post.

And so the mark of forgiveness is a single (mark, line, pole, post, stake,) whereas the cross is the mark of the (beast / nation.)

The cross is a pagan symbol that was used in Egypt for thousands of years before Christ was born into this world. The Roman Catholic Church adopted the cross symbol about 600 years after Christ was hanged on a stake. The early Christians of North Africa also rejected the cross after Tertullian condemned it.

Tertullian confessed that pagans worshiped crucified saviors by hanging them on a cross.

"Crosses, moreover, we Christians neither venerate nor wish for. You indeed who consecrate gods of wood venerate wooden crosses, perhaps as parts of your gods. For your very standards, as well as your banners, and flags of your camps, what are they but crosses gilded and adorned? Your victorious trophies not only imitate the appearance of a simple cross,but also that of a man affixed to it."

The pagan roots of Christianity are indicated by his confession. Tertullian was a Christian who later became a Gnostic. He implies that Pagan Christians borrowed the sun-god myth.

 

[Free]

I could be difficult getting a pic of the people giving worship to the snake on the pole .it would look remarkably the same
are you metaphorically in the pic ?

not want it an answer . the point is

John 4:24​

God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship with spirit and truth.”

John 4:23​

Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshippers will worship the Father with spirit and truth, for indeed, the Father is looking for ones like these to worship him.

The difference is this: the Bible clearly states that the Israelites were worshiping the snake and had given it a name, as a god, but you have not provided any evidence that any Christian anywhere is worshiping the cross itself, making sacrifices to it, or giving it a name as a god.

You haven't proven anything.

 

[Free]

both , the cross bar did something the pole did not do . It prolonged the torture of hanging there for many more hours even days . You may have noted Jesus only hung on the pole for maybe 6 hours and then he died. had he been put on a cross it could have taken days for him to die. The Romans knew what they were doing it was a practice art

Begging the question. Where is your proof? I have asked for it before and have yet to see any.

 

[Barbarian]

Did the Romans crucify on a cross or stake?

A cross. That's what "crucify" means...

crucify (v.)​

mid-14c., "to put to death by nailing or otherwise affixing to a cross," from Old French crucifer crucefiier (12c., Modern French crucifier), from Vulgar Latin *crucificare, from Late Latin crucifigere "to fasten to a cross," from cruci, dative of Latin crux "cross" (see crux) + figere "to fasten, fix" (from PIE root *dheigw- "to stick, fix").


An ancient mode of capital punishment considered especially ignominious by the Romans and Greeks

And as you know, we have physical proof of this. Would you like to see that again?

 

[CherubRam]

The difference is this: the Bible clearly states that the Israelites were worshiping the snake and had given it a name, as a god, but you have not provided any evidence that any Christian anywhere is worshiping the cross itself, making sacrifices to it, or giving it a name as a god.

You haven't proven anything.

The cross is a symbol of the Christian faith and the crucifixion of Jesus Christ. While some Christians do not use the cross in worship, others venerate it as a way to honor Christ and his sacrifice:

Catholics
Catholics venerate the cross as a symbol of Christ's sacrifice, and some believe that the cross itself is worthy of worship. St. Thomas Aquinas believed that the cross should be venerated because it was joined to Christ's body and saturated with his blood. Catholics may kneel before or kiss a crucifix to honor the cross.

The cross is also used as a talisman.

 

[CherubRam]

A cross. That's what "crucify" means...

crucify (v.)​

mid-14c., "to put to death by nailing or otherwise affixing to a cross," from Old French crucifer crucefiier (12c., Modern French crucifier), from Vulgar Latin *crucificare, from Late Latin crucifigere "to fasten to a cross," from cruci, dative of Latin crux "cross" (see crux) + figere "to fasten, fix" (from PIE root *dheigw- "to stick, fix").


An ancient mode of capital punishment considered especially ignominious by the Romans and Greeks

And as you know, we have physical proof of this. Would you like to see that again?

Where it says "crucify" in the bible it actually says "staked out."

 

[CherubRam]

Stauros (σταυρός) is a Greek word for a stake. A army stauros is a "LINE" of defense.

The words "cross" and "crucify" are mistranslations, a "later rendering," of the Greek words stauros and stauroo. According to Vine's Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words, STAUROS denotes, primarily, an upright pole or stake. The shape of the two-beamed cross had its origin in ancient Chaldea and was used as the symbol of the god Tammuz. In the third century A.D., pagans were received into the apostate ecclesiastical system and were permitted largely to retain their pagan signs and symbols.

According to The Companion Bible, crosses were used as symbols of the Babylonian Sun-god. The evidence is complete; the Lord was put to death upon an upright stake, not on two pieces of timber placed at an angle.

According to Encyclopaedia Britannica, in the Egyptian churches the cross was a pagan symbol of life borrowed by the Christians and interpreted in the pagan manner.

According to Greek dictionaries and lexicons, the primary meaning of stauros is an upright pale, pole, or stake. The secondary meaning of "cross" is admitted to be a "later" rendering. In spite of the evidence, almost all common versions of the Scriptures persist with the Latin Vulgate's crux (meaning cross) as the rendering of the Greek stauros.

The most accepted reason for the "cross" being brought into Messianic worship is Constantine's famous vision of "the cross superimposed on the sun" in A.D. 312. What he saw is nowhere to be found in Scripture. Even after his so-called "conversion," his coins showed an even-armed cross as a symbol for the Sun-god. Many scholars have doubted the "conversion" of Constantine because of the wicked deeds that he did afterwards.

After Constantine had the "vision of the cross," he promoted another variety of the cross, the Chi-Rho or Labarum. This has been explained as representing the first letters of the name Christos (CH and R, or, in Greek, X and P). The identical symbols were found as inscriptions on rock, dating from ca. 2500 B.C., being interpreted as "a combination of the two Sun-symbols." Another proof of its pagan origin is that the identical symbol was found on a coin of Ptolemeus III from 247-222 B.C.

According to An Illustrated Encyclopedia of Traditional Symbols, the labarum was also an emblem of the Chaldean sky-god. Emperor Constantine adopted the labarum as the imperial ensign. According to Dictionary of Mythology Folklore and Symbols, the symbol was in use long before Christianity. Chi probably stood for Great Fire or Sun. Rho probably stood for Pater or Patah (Father). The word labarum yields "everlasting Father Sun."

 

[locust]

when the pole with the snake on it was destroyed ,I imagine those people were just as upset as many of you would be if the cross was also destroyed
Exodus 20:4-6: "You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them nor serve them".
some would argue thats not a law that needs to be followed ,any more. however it was restated about idols

Acts 15:20​

but to write them to abstain from things polluted by idols, ..........

Acts 15:29​

to keep abstaining from things sacrificed to idols, ..........

Apparently idols are a big deal