"The degrading of many Prophets in the Bible as worshipers of false gods"

[jmt356]

I was wondering if there were any thoughts about the section of Dr. H. M. Baagil's book Muslim Christian Dialogue discussing "the degrading of many Prophets in the Bible as worshipers of false gods and accusing them of incest, rape and adultery" (p. 25). Specifically, he writes:

Noah is shown to have been drunk to the point of becoming naked in the presence of his grown-up sons (Genesis 9:23-24): "And Shem and Japhet took a garment, and laid it upon both their shoulders, and went backward and covered the nakedness of their father; and their faces were backward, and they saw not their father's nakedness. And Noah awoke from his wine, and knew what his younger son had done unto him."
Solomon was accused not only of having a large harem but also of worshiping their false gods (I Kings 11:9-10): "And the Lord was angry with Solomon ... And had commanded him concerning this thing, that he should not go after other gods: but he kept not that which the Lord commanded."
Aaron, as a Prophet who had accompanied his brother Moses to go to Pharaoh, was accused of having fashioned the golden calf for the Israelites to worship (Exodus 32:4): "And he [Aaron] received them [golden earrings] at their hand, and fashioned it with a graving tool, after he had made it a golden calf: and they said, These be thy gods, O Israel, which brought thee up out of the land of Egypt."
You will read of the incest of Prophet Lot with his two daughters (Genesis 19:36): "Thus were both the daughters of Lot with child by their father:"
You will read of a Prophet who was married to two sisters at the same time (Genesis 29:28): "And Jacob did so, and fulfilled her week: and he [Laban] gave him Rachel his daughter to wife also."
And another Prophet accused of adultery (II Samuel 11:4-5): "And David sent messengers, and took her [the wife of Uriah]; and she came in unto him, and he lay with her; for she was purified from her uncleanness; and she returned unto her house. And the woman conceived, and sent and told David, and said, I am with child."
My question is: How could David then be accepted in the genealogy of Jesus when it started with a person who committed adultery? Allah forbid it! Is this not in contradiction with what is mentioned in Deuteronomy 23:2: "A bastard shall not enter into the congregation of the Lord; even to his tenth generation shall he not enter into the congregation of the Lord:"
Another allegation of incest along with rape by Ammon the son of David on his half-sister Tamar (II Samuel 13:14): "How be it he [Ammon] would not hearken unto her voice: but being stronger than she [Tamar], forced her, and lay with her."
Still another multiple rape, by Absalom on David's concubines, was told in II Samuel 16:33: "So they spread Absalom a tent upon the top of the house, and Absalom went in unto his father's concubines in the sight of all Israel." (I can't believe that anybody in the world could do this, not even the barbarian.)
Another incest, by Judah and Tamar his daughter-in-law: Judah on his way to Timnath to shear his sheep saw Tamar; he thought her to be a harlot because she had her face covered (Genesis 38:18): ". . . And he [Judah] gave his [signet, bracelet and staff] her, and came in unto her and she conceived by him.
Although Jews and Muslims are archenemies, no Muslim would dare to write a book and stamp any Israelite Prophet like Judah, David, Jesus, etc. (Allah's blessings and peace be upon all of them forever and ever) with rape, adultery, incest or prostitution.
All Prophets were sent by Allah for the guidance of mankind. Do you think that God had sent the wrong people for guidance?

 

[Sinthesis]

Why does he believe Jews and Muslims are archenemies?

 

[Ryan]

If you wanted to write an autobiography on a group of people, it's clear the Bible is a scathing account, at times, of a group of people who sinned over and over again against the one true God, Yahweh is his name, not allah. If other religious groups really wanted to open up their history books, you would find similar sins against the one true God. My God has me pray for my enemies and their salvation, their god has them pray for my destruction. If anything, the OT is all about God's love, patience and mercy with a rebellious people people at times. Open up my history book, and I am equally ashamed of my past. But praise be to Jesus who has saved me from my sins and loves all mankind enough that he wishes none would perish, including muslims.

 

[JCitoL]

yes, the history in the Bible is edifying, for (as much as) exactly such is its purpose, otherwise there would hardly be such books as Samuel, Kings, Chronicles, etc., but the ancient people of God are not guilty before humankind, because just such was their destiny in those days/times, e.g. Moses, who, when for the first time received the tables with the 10 Commandments of the Covenant, he did not have a time to read them all, because during his down from the mountain He saw that the other israelites made and worship(-ped) an idol, and because this angered him, he somehow threw out the tables and they were broken in pieces, but this happened quite instinctive and unpremeditated, and that is why he did not succeed to read the written on the tables, because thereupon he gave them a command every man to slay his brother/companion/neighbour, and in the same day there fell killed three thousand men, and this only because the tables were incidentally/unfortunately broken, but the fault was not in Moses, he just threw out them in his instinctive/unpremeditated anger, then satan had very great inner/domestic power in the Heaven and for that reason the situation was so complex in those days/times

(for reference read Exodus 32 chapter)

Blessings

 

[Aloysium]

i don't know what the point of your post is . . .

you ask:

Do you think that God had sent the wrong people for guidance?

you are talking about the God of Abraham . . . you know . . . Allah . . . you are asking if Allah sent the wrong ppl . . . does this sound as ridiculous to you as it does me?

there's a strong suspicion on my part that you are trolling . . . you make some insulting comments advising us that someone else said it . . . here, you are saying it . . . what is your point?

 

[jmt356]

Why does he believe Jews and Muslims are archenemies?

The following Quranic verses may shed light on why Dr. Baagil calls Jews and Muslims archenemies:
- “Thou wilt certainly find the most violent of people in enmity against the believers to be the Jews and the idolaters†(5:82);
- “For the iniquity of the Jews We made unlawful for them certain [foods] good and wholesome which had been lawful for them;- in that they hindered many from Allah's Way. That they took usury, though they were forbidden; and that they devoured men's substance wrongfully;- we have prepared for those among them who reject faith a grievous punishment†(4:160-161).

If you wanted to write an autobiography on a group of people, it's clear the Bible is a scathing account, at times, of a group of people who sinned over and over again against the one true God, Yahweh is his name, not allah. If other religious groups really wanted to open up their history books, you would find similar sins against the one true God. My God has me pray for my enemies and their salvation, their god has them pray for my destruction. If anything, the OT is all about God's love, patience and mercy with a rebellious people people at times. Open up my history book, and I am equally ashamed of my past. But praise be to Jesus who has saved me from my sins and loves all mankind enough that he wishes none would perish, including muslims.

But why would God choose very sinful men as His prophets? For example, King Saul engaged in idolatry and King David in murder and adultery.

Wouldn’t God choose upright and righteous men or women? There are some prophets whose sins are not depicted in the Bible (e.g., Samuel, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel and Daniel). To my knowledge, these are generally righteous men. I also know of many righteous Christians who are not guilty of idolatry, murder and adultery. It would make more sense to me if God used these individuals rather than very sinful men as His prophets. Prophets should in my view be more than just mouth; they should live holy and exemplary lives.

i don't know what the point of your post is . . .

you ask:
you are talking about the God of Abraham . . . you know . . . Allah . . . you are asking if Allah sent the wrong ppl . . . does this sound as ridiculous to you as it does me?
there's a strong suspicion on my part that you are trolling . . . you make some insulting comments advising us that someone else said it . . . here, you are saying it . . . what is your point?

The point of my post is to solicit Christians’ comments to Dr. Baagil’s book. I am not asking whether Allah sent the wrong people. Dr. Baagil’s book deals with the Christian / Hebrew scriptures. Therefore, when Dr. Baagil writes, “Do you think that God had sent the wrong people for guidance?,†he is speaking specifically of Yahweh (Muslims believe Allah sent sinless men to be prophets). Therefore, my question is: why would God use men who engage in idolatry, murder, adultery, etc., to be prophets, when there are many righteous people who can be used instead?

Regarding your “strong suspicion on my part that you are trolling . . . you make some insulting comments advising us that someone else said it . . . here, you are saying it,†I am not saying it. That entire above excerpt is from Dr. Baagil’s book Muslim Christian Dialogue.