The Issue Is...

[Sparkey]

This is The Lounge? Okay, devil's advocate, here I come. That's not not usually my first statement but it suites for this...

OFFICER FRIENDLY ISN'T
I thought it would be okay to have higher than minimum standards for the rule enforcement guys. Anybody who took the position of authority should be beyond reproach as far as anger control, or rather, out-of-control outbursts of flesh? What's wrong with double standards when it means that I don't have to worry about the goon squad when I get called to my son's elementary school? He's 30 years old now. This is old history. Old, but true.

My son was still in time out. I had just arrived.
Me (in the classroom): "Is this a police action?"
They: "No, sir. This is not a police action."
Me (now curious): "Is this a police response?"
They: "No, sir. This is not a police response."
They had previously explained that they responded to the call from the Principal.

There were two cops when I went to fetch my little angle from the Special Education 5th Grade Jail room... he had been imprisoned! It was just for the time that it took me to get there but really? One of the copy was the best gung-ho gitty-up, just got out of training and just finished my 100 pullups and 1,000 situps, sir! Who should I beat most buff member of the goon squad that I had ever seen.​

Me: (clearly acting as if I am only slightly amused and very curious) "Is this a police presence?"
They: "Yes. This is a police presence."

Me: "Whew." (almost under my breath) "I'm glad we got that settled." (almost, but not quite)
Me (Normal conversation tone): "Do I have permission to go in and speak to my son? I don't want you guys talking to or touching him unless we, he and I, are not able to manage."
They: "Yes. You may get your son."
Me: "You will not touch my son?"
They: "We have no plan to touch your son, sir."

If you want to play devil's advocate to my devil's advocate? Go ahead. I still think it's perfectly fine and acceptable to hold certain positions to higher standards than minimum. In other words, the rules that apply to criminals should not necessarily apply to citizens in the exact same way. The rules that apply to police need not be only the rules that apply to citizens either. They can be more stringent. I think they should be much more stringent. That should come part and parcel with the job. End of rant.

 

[th1b.taylor]

I have, over the years, led a couple of Witches to the foot of the cross, one of them in Heaven about a month after my spending from eleven til six in the morning leading that one to the cross over the Internet and them in England. If people heard the testimonies of those folks and some of the Musicians I've worked with, they would not be so cavalier about serving God. I've known two that invoked the presence of demons and it scared the living you know what out of them, being in the same place with pure evil. One of them used a demon to murder a man and when it really ocurred, the next day she ran straight to me for help learning the truth.

Too many folks think spiritual matters are a joke.

 

[Sparkey]

Too many folks think spiritual matters are a joke.

One stereotype is only as bad as another. Saying this is "entitlement" is just erroneous. Police Violence is not a joke either.

But ask me if I would want to offer more or less GRACE to an officer and see what I might say then. I'm the guy who would consider voting for automatic death penalty for any serious harm to an officer. And there would be no chance of appeal and no chance to do nothing but get to trial and if guilty get to the hangman. Over and out. DHC == Don't Hurt Cops. That is exactly where I would start if I campaigned on

As for the Officer? I don't know how to think about it realistically. It's a very serious issue but if the Captain of the Police had a way of treating it well and ensuring their responsibilities and all the while saying, "No real worries, I got this," under his/her breath? I'm okay with that too. I'm not big on making it difficult for officers to do their already difficult jobs. But police violence? No tolerance is the proper amount of tolerance as far as I can say. I think that no over-reactions of the flesh that result in violence by the men/women in blue should be overlooked. No. Not one bit, not one whit. It will end. That's all.

 

[Sparkey]

I was told by my oldest's guidance counselor that requiring a part-time job in order to drive bordered on child abuse, because the teen's only responsibility was to gaining an education.

WOW. That's just as scary. Teachers and counselors are overstepping their boundaries too. It's not just police staff. But then, nobody said it was. And I know you have a special affection for police. So do I. My closest relative in the force is my step-brother and he just retired from State Patrol. We're very proud of him.

But talk about issues with authority. Right? They (in this case, teachers) don't seem to think they have any authority issues. But what part of the privileged class ever does? But I still think that police violence tops the charts. Teachers over-reaching all their reasonable boundaries too. Maybe cops are just a close second? One has responsibilities to adults (and to their children) being the Police. The Other has responsibilities to children (and their parents) being the Teachers.

Conclusion: Fleshly reactions from either group is bad.

 

[th1b.taylor]

Both of you make valid points and I wish there were a clear path to perfection, a perfection we, humans, could establish right now. But that is not the case and until Jesus returns it is our duty to obey the laws man has written and the only, possible, out is when those statutes violate God's Law. And that is a point I am very slow to preach/teach that out because it is so easy to violate every principal in the scriptures walking that close to the line.

But until we, the small number of followers of God, return, in truth, to our first love we will never lead anyone toward sanity. And, sadly, the pretenders fill the pews every Sunday Morning and they flood the Church each Easter and Christmas Service. And until that is corrected I see no hope. The leading example, in my mind, of the problem is Matthew 7:1 being used as a Key Verse to shut the mouths of the Faithful. This verse is even heard being misused inside God's House.

Until we, Christians, begin to repair the Biblical Ignorance by holding every Professing Christian's feet to the fire and, actually, leading them through a one to three year "Through The Bible Study," we will never be in full compliance with the Great Commission. Imagine such a condition that everyone in the Church knew some of what the LORD actually had seen recorded in His Word. Why, people in Sunday School Classes would have real questions and valid, Spirit led, statements of God's intent and that could, easily, generate as full of an understanding of the message of God as ever there has been.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

No, that is revisionist ideology and that is not pronounced I-de-ol-o-gee, in this case the prefered enunciation is id- de- ol- o- gee. Any humanbeing that has read the scriptures knows that disobedience can and will send them to Hell. Rules are not made to be broken except one wishes to spend Eternity in the Lake of Fire with Satan and the boys.

I disagree.
Rules are made to be broken.
God gave the Law knowing that we would break it because we are law breakers.
Thus, we need a Savior because we all break the rules.
You have broken the rules on this forum as much as anyone.
I don't need to tell you that, you know it.

If everyone kept the rules, there would be no need for rules.
But what follows the rules?
A penalty.
And we are all guilty because we all break the rules because that is what we do.

So don't give me none of this eternal hell fire and satan and his boys because you're right there with me.

 

[Edward]

Both of you make valid points and I wish there were a clear path to perfection, a perfection we, humans, could establish right now. But that is not the case and until Jesus returns it is our duty to obey the laws man has written and the only, possible, out is when those statutes violate God's Law. And that is a point I am very slow to preach/teach that out because it is so easy to violate every principal in the scriptures walking that close to the line.

But until we, the small number of followers of God, return, in truth, to our first love we will never lead anyone toward sanity. And, sadly, the pretenders fill the pews every Sunday Morning and they flood the Church each Easter and Christmas Service. And until that is corrected I see no hope. The leading example, in my mind, of the problem is Matthew 7:1 being used as a Key Verse to shut the mouths of the Faithful. This verse is even heard being misused inside God's House.

Until we, Christians, begin to repair the Biblical Ignorance by holding every Professing Christian's feet to the fire and, actually, leading them through a one to three year "Through The Bible Study," we will never be in full compliance with the Great Commission. Imagine such a condition that everyone in the Church knew some of what the LORD actually had seen recorded in His Word. Why, people in Sunday School Classes would have real questions and valid, Spirit led, statements of God's intent and that could, easily, generate as full of an understanding of the message of God as ever there has been.

This is the crux of it and it comes back to parenting. Our children must be taught responsibility, accountability, respect, honor, trustworthiness, caring, integrity, honesty.
BTW, honesty is playing by the rules. Rules were not made to be broken, rules were made to be kept.

Before there was law, sin could not be imputed onto man. God had to give us the law so that we had no excuse, and then God could keep records.

Story: When my two sons were little, I made effort to raise them right and discipline them. But the ideology of don't traumatize your children by trying to discipline them physically was well rooted in my wife's heart and we did not see eye to eye about spare the rod spoil the child. She won and I wasn't allowed to take 'em to the woodshed. Consequently, I had to seek other methods of discipline and teaching them to do right. I got it, copy "respect" and it's definition out of the dictionary. I bet my sons literally copied respect 50K times while growing up out of the dictionary. To this day they can not define respect if asked.

I failed at parenting. I now realize that some things are more important than keeping the peace.

 

[Edward]

Personal responsibility & integrity are critical for the youngsters to learn. One of the worst realities of our present generation of young ones which do not know these things is that picture in the first post: Some of them have went and got jobs as police officers.

 

[th1b.taylor]

I disagree.
Rules are made to be broken.
God gave the Law knowing that we would break it because we are law breakers.
Thus, we need a Savior because we all break the rules.
You have broken the rules on this forum as much as anyone.
I don't need to tell you that, you know it.

If everyone kept the rules, there would be no need for rules.
But what follows the rules?
A penalty.
And we are all guilty because we all break the rules because that is what we do.

So don't give me none of this eternal hell fire and satan and his boys because you're right there with me.

No, your view is slanted. God knew man would be unable to obey the Law and thus give us knowledge of the reason we required Grace. Intentional disobedience is sin and God leads no man into sin. Remember Mal. 3:6a for God has never and God will never change and God, in Habakuk 1:13, is to pure to look on sin, let alone intentionally cause it.

The world is filled with people that intentionally break the rules, no matter who made them but they are not being obedient (John 14:23) places themselves in danger of the Great White Throne Judgement and that judgement is for the lost, only.

 

[Corn Pop]

I disagree.
Rules are made to be broken.
God gave the Law knowing that we would break it because we are law breakers.
Thus, we need a Savior because we all break the rules.
You have broken the rules on this forum as much as anyone.
I don't need to tell you that, you know it.

If everyone kept the rules, there would be no need for rules.
But what follows the rules?
A penalty.
And we are all guilty because we all break the rules because that is what we do.

So don't give me none of this eternal hell fire and satan and his boys because you're right there with me.

Not me. I have never gone over 50. I drive with two hands on the wheel at 49.

 

[th1b.taylor]

Not me. I have never gone over 50. I drive with two hands on the wheel at 49. Lol. Im not like my nana who got a ticket for driving at 56 in a 50.

And I believe you have just defined what Rollo is attempting to speak to. But one, following God, must never confuse intentional sin with accidental sin. We all are prone to slip... LOL, even Dan! But God's grace has always covered that leaving the concerning subject matter in the Sand Lot of Intentional Sin.