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The perfect 'man'?

I

Imagican

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Is it possible for a person to become perfect? If so, what would this perfection be?
 
If your definition of "perfect" means "sinless," then no, it is not possible for a person to become perfect.

As long as we are in these earthly bodies we will continue to sin, but by the grace of God we can be redeemed from those sins.

Proverbs 20: 9 - Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin?

1 John 1: 8 - "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us."
 
Human Beings, save Jesus Christ, can never be perfect while on the earth. The only exception would be if God drags him to perfection but I doubt He is going to do that.

1 John 6:44 (King James Version) No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Someday, Humans will be perfect when we are conformed to the image of Christ, who is the Image of God.

1 John 3:2 (King James Version) Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he[God] shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.


All of Creation will become One with God and then God will be "All in All"

1 Corinthians 15:28 (King James Version) And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
 
The flesh does not the man make.

If one has accepted Christ into their hearts, doesn't that person become more than mere flesh?
 
Imagican said:
The flesh does not the man make.

If one has accepted Christ into their hearts, doesn't that person become more than mere flesh?
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I've seen this question before on another forum and it's a loaded one unless you include some definitions. In addition to AxeUnlimited's comment about what you mean by perfect, we also need to know how you define "person".
 
Ok, nice observation.

By person, I refer to those that accept Christ as their Savior.

And by 'perfect', I refer to any aspect of man or his relationship with the Father through His Son.

Let's up the ante a little. Is there, anywhere in scripture, a reference to a 'perfect man'?
 
AxeUnlimited said:
If your definition of "perfect" means "sinless," then no, it is not possible for a person to become perfect.

As long as we are in these earthly bodies we will continue to sin, but by the grace of God we can be redeemed from those sins.

Proverbs 20: 9 - Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin?

1 John 1: 8 - "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us."
Click to expand...

By that definition I actually would have to differ from you. Do you not believe that God forgives sin and forgets it so that it is no more. If that is the case at least at the second of repentance then one must in fact be perfect by your definition of perfect.

Now if the definition included conpequsence, ie. the tendancy toward sin being gone, I would agree.
 
Good job Thess. Let's step it up a notch though.

Let us ask, what would be perfection? Sinlessness? Or perhaps something else? If God is 'perfect'. How could we become 'perfect'. What is it that seperates us from the Creator other than His ability to create? What sets Him apart from us?
 
"Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly
father is perfect." Matthew 5:48 NRSV

The Bible confirms the thought of perfection and quotes Jesus as saying "Ye are perfect just as your Father in heaven is perfect.†The soul is the starting point for this perfection.
The mere reading of the Bible does not make us a Christian, and the direct experience of the soul can't be realized by the mere hearing of words or by reasoning alone. The Bible has to be read with an open mind to gain the indirect knowledge about the soul and then we have to act to bring that knowledge into ourselves in an actual experience. The indirect experience described in the Bible can inspirer us to gain the direct perception of God consciousness within ourselves so we strive to be perfect.
 
Good one Soma!

Now that the method has been established, what is it 'specifically' that we are to strive for in order to achieve this 'perfection'? What makes God 'perfect' and what attribute would we 'need' to emulate in order to exhibit this 'perfection'?
 
That is why we were sent Jesus Christ and that is why we follow him. Good luck on your journey.
 
Imagican said:
Good one Soma!

Now that the method has been established, what is it 'specifically' that we are to strive for in order to achieve this 'perfection'? What makes God 'perfect' and what attribute would we 'need' to emulate in order to exhibit this 'perfection'?
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Perfection comes about through sanctification by God's grace cleansing our soul by the power of the Holy Spirit.
 
Are you sure Thess? Or are these simply the gifts offered by our Father in order to accomplish 'perfection'? Perhaps this 'sanctification by God's grace cleansing our soul by the power of the Holy Spirit' is but 'a step' in the direction of our 'perfection'?

So, once again, what makes God 'perfect' or 'good'? What is it that, if we could achieve it, would make us 'like that image' that we were created of/in?
What is it that God has to perfection, that we, who were 'Created in His Image', lack so far?
 
We won't be able to give you the perfect answer until we become perfect so we will have to take one step at a time.
 
Oh but there is an answer to my inquiries. And it's really a quite simple one. Just think about it a 'little' bit and I'm sure it will come to you. What IS God that we lack?
 
Purify ourselves by obeying the truth and sincere love of our neighbor. Love one another with a pure heart because blessed are the pure of heart for they shall see God.
 
Soma, A+!!

That's what I'm looking for. A little 'love'.

Exactly right. The difference between man and God is His LOVE. Something that we are capable of attaining, yet very elusive indeed. And in essence, the major difference between Father and children.

I offer that what Christ came for was to offer the 'perfect' example of 'this love'. What He came for was to 'teach' us of this love. That there is NO 'other' way to reach the Father than through an offering of the 'same' love that He IS.

And our purpose is to 'somehow' learn and find a way to 'become' this same love.

Once found, inherited, and emulated, we too can become 'perfect'.

It certainly takes an effort, but one well worth the rewards. One that eliminates the 'me' and accentuates the 'other'. One that offers little personal reward or edification but much in the 'eyes of God'.

This 'love' is; what it's ALL about.

So, now that I've made my 'claim'. Is there anyone out there that can offer scripture that either confirms or denies what I've offered?
 
Purification and perfection comes from the inside out not the outside in. There is nothing that WE can do that will purify us. It's Christ that does the perfecting in us and through us.
 
Merry Menagerie said:
Purification and perfection comes from the inside out not the outside in. There is nothing that WE can do that will purify us. It's Christ that does the perfecting in us and through us.
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Again it's so refreshing to see posts from true born again Christians instead of legalists who haven't a clue what's on their insides. Good post, Merry. :D
 
Merry Menagerie said:
Purification and perfection comes from the inside out not the outside in. There is nothing that WE can do that will purify us. It's Christ that does the perfecting in us and through us.
Click to expand...

We can 'learn' my dear Merry. If we couldn't we wouldn't have been given the Word. We can learn by 'understanding' the words spoken by Christ. We can learn by 'understanding' the example set for us by the Son. We can also learn by emulation.

Yes, it is something that we CANNOT do on our own. But we can certainly 'aide' God in His changing of 'who' and 'what' we are. God WILL NOT change that which we insist upon holding on to. We must ALLOW God to change us by showing Him that we are willing. If you do not believe this, then there is much within the individual that will NEVER change. And the changes to which I refer ARE changes of the 'inside'. Once the changes take place on the inside, their outward appearance will become apparent.

And I am still waiting for anyone to offer scripture that either contradicts or confirms what I have offered.
 
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