The Perverted Gospel!

[donadams]

Yes the new birth.

Natural birth and spiritual birth.

That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
John 3:6

Jesus is using earthly things (Natural birth) to teach Nicodemus heavenly (spiritual birth) things.

If I have told you earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things? John 3:12

Born of flesh = earthly things

Born of the Spirit = heavenly things

not the spirit alone!

“Faith alone” Questions

where does ez 36: 25:27 Say “faith alone”?

where does scripture says we have died with Christ by “faith alone”?

Where does it say we are sealed by faith alone?

Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

where does scripture say we are members of Christ and his church by “faith alone”?

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

where does scripture says we put on Christ by “faith alone”?

Faith alone?

1 Timothy 1:14
And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.
(Sound like faith alone?)
(Why a great amount of grace, don’t we just each need a tiny bit?)

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Where does scripture say our sins are washed away by “faith alone”?

Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

where does scripture say we are saved or justified by “faith alone”?

1 pet 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!

The only reference in scripture to “faith alone” is James 2:24 NOT BY “FAITH ALONE”?

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

How can you enter by your own if it must be ministered to you? Baptism is done unto you, “not do it yourself by faith alone”

Ministered by the apostolic church!

2 Corinthians 8:19
And not that only, but who was also chosen of the churches to travel with us with this grace, which is administered by us to the glory of the same Lord, and declaration of your ready mind:

Jn 3:5 born again by faith alone?

Where is “Accept Christ as your personal lord & savior” is found in scripture?

They did not go preaching this line but went immediately to the river and baptized Jn 3:22

Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Eph 4:5 one baptism

Why don’t it say one teeny tiny little act of “faith alone”???

When we first believed we are saved?

Romans 13:11
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.

How can salvation be nearer than when we first believed if you’re saved by believing?

1 pet 1:9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

Matt 24:13 endures to the end Shall be saved.

How can salvation happen when we first believed if it’s the end?

If salvation is by “faith alone” then faith would be the greatest!
1 cor 13:13 charity is the greatest!

Even all faith much less “faith alone” without charity avails nothing!
1 cor 13:2

 

[JLB]

not the spirit alone!

“Faith alone” Questions

where does ez 36: 25:27 Say “faith alone”?

where does scripture says we have died with Christ by “faith alone”?

Where does it say we are sealed by faith alone?

Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

where does scripture say we are members of Christ and his church by “faith alone”?

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

where does scripture says we put on Christ by “faith alone”?

Faith alone?

1 Timothy 1:14
And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.
(Sound like faith alone?)
(Why a great amount of grace, don’t we just each need a tiny bit?)

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Where does scripture say our sins are washed away by “faith alone”?

Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

where does scripture say we are saved or justified by “faith alone”?

1 pet 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!

The only reference in scripture to “faith alone” is James 2:24 NOT BY “FAITH ALONE”?

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

How can you enter by your own if it must be ministered to you? Baptism is done unto you, “not do it yourself by faith alone”

Ministered by the apostolic church!

2 Corinthians 8:19
And not that only, but who was also chosen of the churches to travel with us with this grace, which is administered by us to the glory of the same Lord, and declaration of your ready mind:

Jn 3:5 born again by faith alone?

Where is “Accept Christ as your personal lord & savior” is found in scripture?

They did not go preaching this line but went immediately to the river and baptized Jn 3:22

Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Eph 4:5 one baptism

Why don’t it say one teeny tiny little act of “faith alone”???

When we first believed we are saved?

Romans 13:11
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.

How can salvation be nearer than when we first believed if you’re saved by believing?

1 pet 1:9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

Matt 24:13 endures to the end Shall be saved.

How can salvation happen when we first believed if it’s the end?

If salvation is by “faith alone” then faith would be the greatest!
1 cor 13:13 charity is the greatest!

Even all faith much less “faith alone” without charity avails nothing!
1 cor 13:2

I don’t believe in faith alone because I understand the principle of faith.

Please don’t both bother hurling “faith alone” obscenities at me.


Here is what I posted…

Natural birth and spiritual birth.

That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
John 3:6

Jesus is using earthly things (Natural birth) to teach Nicodemus heavenly (spiritual birth) things.

If I have told you earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things? John 3:12

Born of flesh = earthly things

Born of the Spirit = heavenly things



Please pick out a statement I made and tell me why you disagree with it?

 

[onlysaved]

Jesus is mediator in regards to the atonement / redemption but his apostolic church administers His grace / merits.

2 thes 2:5-6

5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

NOPE!!!
the apostolic church died with the death of the last of Jesus's 12 apostles. The relationship we have now is direct with God through the person of Jesus .No middle men whatsoever.

 

[donadams]

I don’t believe in faith alone because I understand the principle of faith.

Please don’t both bother hurling “faith alone” obscenities at me.


Here is what I posted…

Natural birth and spiritual birth.

That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
John 3:6

Jesus is using earthly things (Natural birth) to teach Nicodemus heavenly (spiritual birth) things.

If I have told you earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things? John 3:12

Born of flesh = earthly things

Born of the Spirit = heavenly things



Please pick out a statement I made and tell me why you disagree with it?

ok no offense!

jn 3:5
Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

how does being born naturally have anything to do with the kingdom?

how do we enter the kingdom?

thks

 

[JLB]

how does being born naturally have anything to do with the kingdom?

As my posts said, natural birth is the earthly thing that Jesus uses to teach Nicodemus heavenly things.


Do you understand the cultural mindset (stronghold) that prevented most Jews from receiving the message of the kingdom?

I have stated this several times?


Most Jews had a mindset that prevented them from receiving the truth so they could become free.


They believed because they were the natural offspring of Abraham, they were already saved (blessed); elected for salvation.


Then Jesus said to those Jews who believed Him, “If you abide in My word, you are My disciples indeed. And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”
They answered Him, “We are Abraham’s descendants, and have never been in bondage to anyone. How can You say, ‘You will be made free’?” John 8:31-32

IOW’s they rejected Jesus’s message because it called them to repent, and be saved.

 

[donadams]

NOPE!!!
the apostolic church died with the death of the last of Jesus's 12 apostles. The relationship we have now is direct with God through the person of Jesus .No middle men whatsoever.

Jn 20:21-23 the apostles have the same power and authority as Christ!

the apostles continue until Christ returns matt 28:19-20
acts 1:8
more apostles
Acts 1:26
acts 11:22

thks

 

[onlysaved]

Jn 20:21-23 the apostles have the same power and authority as Christ!

the apostles continue until Christ returns matt 28:19-20
acts 1:8
more apostles
Acts 1:26
acts 11:22

thks

Now that's twisting the scriptures.

"If you confess your sins HE is faithful and just to forgive your sins and purify you from all unrighteousness.

No middle man needed..

Ahh the great commission.. that's for all believers not just the apostles.

While we're at it.. if there was a leader of the church in Jerusalem it was James... not Peter.

When Jesus died the veil at the temple was torn from top to bottom this veil was what separated the regular Hebrews from having direct access to God.. God Himself completely destroyed that separation we now have direct access to God. No more power hungry middle men..

"
And he came and preached peace to you who were far off and peace to those who were near.
18 For through him we both have access in one Spirit to the Father.
19 So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God,
Every believer has direct access to God.

 

[donadams]

Now that's twisting the scriptures.

"If you confess your sins HE is faithful and just to forgive your sins and purify you from all unrighteousness.

No middle man needed..

Ahh the great commission.. that's for all believers not just the apostles.

While we're at it.. if there was a leader of the church in Jerusalem it was James... not Peter.

When Jesus died the veil at the temple was torn from top to bottom this veil was what separated the regular Hebrews from having direct access to God.. God Himself completely destroyed that separation we now have direct access to God. No more power hungry middle men..

"
And he came and preached peace to you who were far off and peace to those who were near.
18 For through him we both have access in one Spirit to the Father.
19 So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God,
Every believer has direct access to God.

only those who are baptized members of Christ can confess and receive absolution Jn 20;23

Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained.

2 Corinthians 5:18
And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation

no middle man

Christ acting thru his priests vicariously

try getting married without God's minister!

fundamentalist brainwashing is not the christian faith!

 

[donadams]

Now that's twisting the scriptures.

"If you confess your sins HE is faithful and just to forgive your sins and purify you from all unrighteousness.

No middle man needed..

Ahh the great commission.. that's for all believers not just the apostles.

While we're at it.. if there was a leader of the church in Jerusalem it was James... not Peter.

When Jesus died the veil at the temple was torn from top to bottom this veil was what separated the regular Hebrews from having direct access to God.. God Himself completely destroyed that separation we now have direct access to God. No more power hungry middle men..

"
And he came and preached peace to you who were far off and peace to those who were near.
18 For through him we both have access in one Spirit to the Father.
19 So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God,
Every believer has direct access to God.

peter is the leader of the universal church
the prime minister holds the keys of jurisdictional authority under the king over the other ministers
Isa 22:21-22 matt 16:17-19
matt 23:1 successors

 

[donadams]

Now that's twisting the scriptures.

"If you confess your sins HE is faithful and just to forgive your sins and purify you from all unrighteousness.

No middle man needed..

Ahh the great commission.. that's for all believers not just the apostles.

While we're at it.. if there was a leader of the church in Jerusalem it was James... not Peter.

When Jesus died the veil at the temple was torn from top to bottom this veil was what separated the regular Hebrews from having direct access to God.. God Himself completely destroyed that separation we now have direct access to God. No more power hungry middle men..

"
And he came and preached peace to you who were far off and peace to those who were near.
18 For through him we both have access in one Spirit to the Father.
19 So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God,
Every believer has direct access to God.

bible mentions Peter 196 times more than all the apostles together

 

[donadams]

Now that's twisting the scriptures.

"If you confess your sins HE is faithful and just to forgive your sins and purify you from all unrighteousness.

No middle man needed..

Ahh the great commission.. that's for all believers not just the apostles.

While we're at it.. if there was a leader of the church in Jerusalem it was James... not Peter.

When Jesus died the veil at the temple was torn from top to bottom this veil was what separated the regular Hebrews from having direct access to God.. God Himself completely destroyed that separation we now have direct access to God. No more power hungry middle men..

"
And he came and preached peace to you who were far off and peace to those who were near.
18 For through him we both have access in one Spirit to the Father.
19 So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God,
Every believer has direct access to God.

how it is twisting scripture?

matt 28:19 teach all nations
acts 1:8 to the ends of the earth, impossible without successors

 

[donadams]

Now that's twisting the scriptures.

"If you confess your sins HE is faithful and just to forgive your sins and purify you from all unrighteousness.

No middle man needed..

Ahh the great commission.. that's for all believers not just the apostles.

While we're at it.. if there was a leader of the church in Jerusalem it was James... not Peter.

When Jesus died the veil at the temple was torn from top to bottom this veil was what separated the regular Hebrews from having direct access to God.. God Himself completely destroyed that separation we now have direct access to God. No more power hungry middle men..

"
And he came and preached peace to you who were far off and peace to those who were near.
18 For through him we both have access in one Spirit to the Father.
19 So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God,
Every believer has direct access to God.

the holy of holies represented heaven the veil represented that fact that with the fall of adam heaven was closed, not some fantasy about God's ministers

God always establishes peace and order by obedience to the fathers

and we must obey them for they care for our souls
heb 13:7-17

 

[JLB]

only those who are baptized members of Christ can confess and receive absolution Jn 20;23

I see you are back to just stating your opinion and tagging your opinion with a scripture reference and adding words that don’t appear in scripture.

And when He had said this, He breathed on them, and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained.” John 20:22-23

All who are in Christ are priests who have the Holy Spirit.

 

[JLB]

God always establishes peace and order by obedience to the fathers

and we must obey them for they care for our souls
heb 13:7-17

Remember those who rule over you, who have spoken the word of God to you, whose faith follow, considering the outcome of their conduct. Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever. Do not be carried about with various and strange doctrines. For it is good that the heart be established by grace, not with foods which have not profited those who have been occupied with them.
We have an altar from which those who serve the tabernacle have no right to eat. For the bodies of those animals, whose blood is brought into the sanctuary by the high priest for sin, are burned outside the camp. Therefore Jesus also, that He might sanctify the people with His own blood, suffered outside the gate. Therefore let us go forth to Him, outside the camp, bearing His reproach. For here we have no continuing city, but we seek the one to come. Therefore by Him let us continually offer the sacrifice of praise to God, that is, the fruit of our lips, giving thanks to His name. But do not forget to do good and to share, for with such sacrifices God is well pleased.
Hebrews 13:7-16


No mention of obedience to the “fathers”.


The writer is encouraging them to share and to do good to those who lead them.

 

[donadams]

Now that's twisting the scriptures.

"If you confess your sins HE is faithful and just to forgive your sins and purify you from all unrighteousness.

No middle man needed..

Ahh the great commission.. that's for all believers not just the apostles.

While we're at it.. if there was a leader of the church in Jerusalem it was James... not Peter.

When Jesus died the veil at the temple was torn from top to bottom this veil was what separated the regular Hebrews from having direct access to God.. God Himself completely destroyed that separation we now have direct access to God. No more power hungry middle men..

"
And he came and preached peace to you who were far off and peace to those who were near.
18 For through him we both have access in one Spirit to the Father.
19 So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God,
Every believer has direct access to God.

2 John 1:12
Having many things to write unto you, I would not write with paper and ink: but I trust to come unto you, andspeak face to face, that our joy may be full.

scripture alone? nope!

we know the holy spirit by the authority of the apostles

1 John 4:6
We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, andthe spirit of error.

 

[donadams]

I see you are back to just stating your opinion and tagging your opinion with a scripture reference and adding words that don’t appear in scripture.

And when He had said this, He breathed on them, and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained.” John 20:22-23

All who are in Christ are priests who have the Holy Spirit.

there are different kinds of priests

Christ who is high priest over His ministerial priesthood who have authority to govern the church, teach & sanctify all men and forgive sins

and the royal priesthood of the faithful, not ministerial not able to forgive sins

 

[donadams]

Remember those who rule over you, who have spoken the word of God to you, whose faith follow, considering the outcome of their conduct. Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever. Do not be carried about with various and strange doctrines. For it is good that the heart be established by grace, not with foods which have not profited those who have been occupied with them.
We have an altar from which those who serve the tabernacle have no right to eat. For the bodies of those animals, whose blood is brought into the sanctuary by the high priest for sin, are burned outside the camp. Therefore Jesus also, that He might sanctify the people with His own blood, suffered outside the gate. Therefore let us go forth to Him, outside the camp, bearing His reproach. For here we have no continuing city, but we seek the one to come. Therefore by Him let us continually offer the sacrifice of praise to God, that is, the fruit of our lips, giving thanks to His name. But do not forget to do good and to share, for with such sacrifices God is well pleased.
Hebrews 13:7-16


No mention of obedience to the “fathers”.


The writer is encouraging them to share and to do good to those who lead them.

13:7 rule over you!

13:17 Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they care for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you.

Jn 21:17 Jesus saith unto him, Feed my sheep.

my 16:17-19
17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

1 Corinthians 4:15
For though ye have ten thousand instructers in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.

 

[JLB]

there are different kinds of priests

Christ who is high priest over His ministerial priesthood who have authority to govern the church, teach & sanctify all men and forgive sins

and the royal priesthood of the faithful, not ministerial not able to forgive sins

Christians are priests.

We are part of a royal priesthood.

But you are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, His own special people, that you may proclaim the praises of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light; 1 Peter 2:9


We don’t “go to priests” to have a priest forgive our sins.

We are priests and can confess our sins and be cleansed.

We can confess our sins one to another because we are priests.

And the prayer of faith will save the sick, and the Lord will raise him up. And if he has committed sins, he will be forgiven. Confess your trespasses to one another, and pray for one another, that you may be healed. The effective, fervent prayer of a righteous man avails much. James 5:15-16

 

[JLB]

13:7 rule over you!

13:17 Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they care for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you.

Remember those who led you, who spoke the word of God to you; and considering the result of their conduct, imitate their faith. Hebrews 13:7

 

[onlysaved]

only those who are baptized members of Christ can confess and receive absolution Jn 20;23

Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained.

2 Corinthians 5:18
And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation

no middle man

Christ acting thru his priests vicariously

try getting married without God's minister!

fundamentalist brainwashing is not the christian faith!

Goodbye false teacher.