Vince said:
Another foundational philosophy of irresistible grace is "I've got five verses and you've got three, so you must be wrong." To be fair, various groups practice this tactic, not just one. The idea is that after you learn the beliefs of your group, you pile up any Scripture you can use to support that belief, regardless of what the verse actually says.
For instance, "No man can come to me unless the Father draw him," COULD mean that God only draws some men, or it COULD mean that God draws all men. But the verse, "And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me" can only mean that Jesus draws all men to HImself.
This philosophy is useful for converting inexperienced Christians into a group. The inexperienced Christian lacks the knowledge and understanding to see that the pile of verses being used do not necessarily teach the philosophy of the group.
Vince,
Are you getting this out of a book? You really haven't been very specific about your rejecting the doctrine of irresistible grace, you are kinda just throwing out generalities about what you view as tactics of those who believe it (of whom I am one). You claim that it is not based on scripture or even misunderstanding of scripture, but that is not correct.
It indeed was not a concept taught by Calvin but rather part of a response to the Arminian Remonstrance (a Counter-Remonstrance). They were formally received at the Synod of Dort (November 13, 1618 to May 9, 1619) and came to be known as the Canon of Dort.
Regarding the assertion that it is not based on scripture, I would provide some which support it well enough to say that it is based on scripture:
Romans 8
And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose. For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the likeness of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified.
John 6:37-39 (King James Version)
All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
John 6:44-45
No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day. It is written in the Prophets: 'They will all be taught by God.' Everyone who listens to the Father and learns from him comes to me.
Now I see there is much anti-Calvinist attitude on this site and that's fine, I don't consider myself a Calvinist, I consider myself a follower of Christ. Yet I tend to believe much of what Reformed Theology teaches because I believe that it is supported in scripture. At the same time, those who oppose some of these doctrines have legitimate counter arguments that are also based on scripture. I think Fransicdesales above said it best that there are some tensions in God's word that are difficult to reconcile at times. Keep in mind that we are looking at things from a limited human perspective—with God all things are possible.
My dissent with what you present is the whole fact of groups. You have already formed a group on this thread—you made a post, some people agreed—You're a group! People study God's word and have for ages. Formulating creeds and doctrines are not bad in of themselves—they are useful tools to help us understand. SCRIPTURE IS ALWAYS THE FINAL WORD of course.
Irresistible grace confirms that God is sovereign. If He calls, He is able to deliver and He will.
