The Sabbath day was made for man, not man for the Sabbath

[JLB]

Romans 3:31
Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

1 John 2:4
If someone claims, “I know God,” but doesn’t obey God’s commandments, that person is a liar and is not living in the truth.

He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:4


His commandments refer to Jesus, as we are under His law.

Bear one another’s burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. Galatians 6:2

Jesus is Mediator of the New Covenant as Moses was under the old.

The children of Israel were under the law of Moses, with Moses as mediator.

We as Christians are under the law of Christ, with Jesus Christ as our Mediator and High Priest.

The children of Israel were under the Levitical priesthood.

Christians are a part of the priesthood according to the order of Melchizedek.


I hope you will be open to what the scriptures teach us in the New Covenant.


Being under Christ in the New Covenant and obeying His Commandments is more strict than that of the law of Moses.


Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace? Hebrews 10:28-29


JLB

 

[eddif]

Now you have gone where few go.

There are at lea two rests.
Hebrews 4

Mississippi redneck
eddif

I suppose the two rests have to be listed:
These require thought.
1. The rest at creation of Genesis.

2. The rest after the work Jesus did on earth. His work of creating eternal life for those who believe the Gospel. His rest.
Mississippi redneck
eddif

 

[Humblepie]

Psalms 119:142
142 Thy righteousness is an everlasting righteousness, and thy law is the truth.

John 8:32
32 and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”

John 17:17
17 Sanctify them in the truth; your word is truth.

Matt 7:21-24
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

1 John 2:21
21 I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth.

1 John 2:7
7 Brethren, I write no new commandment unto you, but an old commandment which ye had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning.

1 John 2:6
6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.

John 8:44-47
44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.

46 Which of you convinceth me of sin? And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me?

47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.


John 8:39
39 They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham.

 

[Humblepie]

Psalms 119:126
126 It is time for thee, Lord, to work: for they have made void thy law.


Psalms 119:160
160 Thy word is true from the beginning: and every one of thy righteous judgments endureth for ever.

Psalms 119:44
44 So shall I keep thy law continually for ever and ever.

Psalms 119:118
118 Thou hast trodden down all them that err from thy statutes: for their deceit is falsehood.

 

[JLB]

John 8:39
39 They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham.

Beautiful scripture.

Most Christian’s don’t understand that we have been made part of the Abrahamic Covenant in Christ.

The New Covenant is actually the “Renewed” Abrahamic Covenant.

Abraham was successful in obeying the commands and laws of the LORD 430 years before the law of Moses was added.

And I will make your descendants multiply as the stars of heaven; I will give to your descendants all these lands; and in your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed; because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.” Genesis 26:4-5

These are the laws and commandments that we who are in Christ are to obey; Commandments and laws that are received by faith.


This is a good topic to discuss. Are you up for it?

 

[Humblepie]

Some 1700 years before the law of Moses was written on stone, Noah knew the difference between clean and unclean animals.
He also made a sacrifice to God using clean animals.



Genesis 7:2-3
2 Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and his female: and of beasts that are not clean by two, the male and his female.

3 Of fowls also of the air by sevens, the male and the female; to keep seed alive upon the face of all the earth.


His sacrifice some 1700 years before the written law.

Genesis 8:20
20 And Noah builded an altar unto the Lord; and took of every clean beast, and of every clean fowl, and offered burnt offerings on the altar.


Job lived somewhere between Noah and Moses. Maybe 800 years before the Law was given to Moses.

Job 1:5
5 And it was so, when the days of their feasting were gone about, that Job sent and sanctified them, and rose up early in the morning, and offered burnt offerings according to the number of them all: for Job said, It may be that my sons have sinned, and cursed God in their hearts. Thus did Job continually.


430 years Before the Law of Moses .

Genesis 22:7
7 And Isaac spake unto Abraham his father, and said, My father: and he said, Here am I, my son. And he said, Behold the fire and the wood: but where is the lamb for a burnt offering?


These happened before there was a Nation of Israel or a written Law.

 

[Humblepie]

Gods eternal law.
It's why jews can't believe Christians theology.


Deut 7:9
9 Know therefore that the Lord thy God, he is God, the faithful God, which keepeth covenant and mercy with them that love him and keep his commandments to a thousand generations;

Lev 23:14
14 And ye shall eat neither bread, nor parched corn, nor green ears, until the selfsame day that ye have brought an offering unto your God: it shall be a statute for ever throughout your generations in all your dwellings.

Lev 23:21
21 And ye shall proclaim on the selfsame day, that it may be an holy convocation unto you: ye shall do no servile work therein: it shall be a statute for ever in all your dwellings throughout your generations.


Lev 3:17
17 It shall be a perpetual statute for your generations throughout all your dwellings, that ye eat neither fat nor blood.


Exodus 12:14
14 “This day is to be a memorial for you, and you must celebrate it as a festival to the Lord. You are to celebrate it throughout your generations as a permanent statute.


Exodus 12:24
24 “Keep this command permanently as a statute for you and your descendants.


Joshua 1:8
8 This Book of the Law shall not depart from your mouth, but you[c] shall meditate in it day and night, that you may observe to do according to all that is written in it. For then you will make your way prosperous, and then you will have good success.

 

[Humblepie]

This is what God told the israelites, and they obey to this day.

Paul was able to convert those that uphold this rule and were zealous for the law, not because he taught against the law of moses, but because he showed them through OT scripture that Jesus is the Messiah, and that He did not come to destroy the Law or change the customs they were commanded to follow.

So today's Christians must be mistaken in their interpretation of what Paul is actually teaching.

The Deuteronomy Test for Israel.


Deuteronomy 13
“If there arises among you a prophet or a dreamer of dreams, and he gives you a sign or a wonder, 2 and the sign or the wonder comes to pass, of which he spoke to you, saying, ‘Let us go after other gods’—which you have not known—‘and let us serve them,’ 3 you shall not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams, for the Lord your God is testing you to know whether you love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul. 4 You shall walk[a] after the Lord your God and fear Him, and keep His commandments and obey His voice; you shall serve Him and hold fast to Him. 5 But that prophet or that dreamer of dreams shall be put to death, because he has spoken in order to turn you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt and redeemed you from the house of bondage, to entice you from the way in which the Lord your God commanded you to walk. So you shall put away the evil from your midst.

6 “If your brother, the son of your mother, your son or your daughter, the wife [c]of your bosom, or your friend who is as your own soul, secretly entices you, saying, ‘Let us go and serve other gods,’ which you have not known, neither you nor your fathers, 7 of the gods of the people which are all around you, near to you or far off from you, from one end of the earth to the other end of the earth, 8 you shall not [d]consent to him or listen to him, nor shall your eye pity him, nor shall you spare him or conceal him; 9 but you shall surely kill him; your hand shall be first against him to put him to death, and afterward the hand of all the people. 10 And you shall stone him with stones until he dies, because he sought to entice you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage. 11 So all Israel shall hear and fear, and not again do such wickedness as this among you.

12 “If you hear someone in one of your cities, which the Lord your God gives you to dwell in, saying, 13 [e]‘Corrupt men have gone out from among you and enticed the inhabitants of their city, saying, “Let us go and serve other gods” ’—which you have not known— 14 then you shall inquire, search out, and ask diligently. And if it is indeed true and certain that such an [f]abomination was committed among you, 15 you shall surely strike the inhabitants of that city with the edge of the sword, utterly destroying it, all that is in it and its livestock—with the edge of the sword. 16 And you shall gather all its plunder into the middle of the street, and [g]completely burn with fire the city and all its plunder, for the Lord your God. It shall be a [h]heap forever; it shall not be built again. 17 So none of the accursed things shall remain in your hand, that the Lord may turn from the fierceness of His anger and show you mercy, have compassion on you and multiply you, just as He swore to your fathers, 18 because you have listened to the voice of the Lord your God, to keep all His commandments which I command you today, to do what is right in the eyes of the Lord your God.

 

[Humblepie]

The Deuteronomy test is why they stoned Stephen,

Let's see what Acts says about Stephen's stoning and if it was justified.

Acts 6:11-14
11 Then they suborned men, which said, We have heard him speak blasphemous words against Moses, and against God.

12 And they stirred up the people, and the elders, and the scribes, and came upon him, and caught him, and brought him to the council,

13 And set up. false. witnesses,


which said, This man ceaseth not to speak blasphemous words against this holy place,


and the law:

14 For we have heard him say, that this

Jesus of Nazareth shall destroy this place,


and. shall change. the customs which Moses delivered us.



Oh so the false witnesses claim the same thing Christians claim today.

Satan's at work my friends.

 

[RandyK]

Some 1700 years before the law of Moses was written on stone, Noah knew the difference between clean and unclean animals.
He also made a sacrifice to God using clean animals.

We also knows what clean and unclean animals are today, without regard for the Law of Moses. Some have vile, unhealthy habits, whereas some have habits that are less dangerous when considering them as a food source.

For example, I consider rats dirty, vile creatures, or "unclean animals." A grass-eating animal that doesn't frequent contaminated places I would consider relatively "clean" with respect to eating them.

It makes sense to kill animals before eating them. Their "sacrifice" is needed. Cooking them is also desirable. The fact we don't drink blood does not require our resorting to the Law of Moses.

To sacrifice, or kill, animals for food can be offered in thanks to God without resort to the Law of Moses where animals were sacrificed in a very specific way. No such specification was mentioned in the case of Noah or Job.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

Could you clarify for us what you specifically mean by “observing” the Sabbath?


Does “observing” the Sabbath mean we can not cook any food, or travel or take a bath, and are required to attend a synagogue on Saturday?

You don't do your "customary work" on Sabbath, which simply means taking a day off from whatever you do on a regular weekday, usually your paid job. Obviously this varies from person to person, one's "customary work" might be a hobby for another, you can't pin it down on specific activities. What's important is to worship God through some meaningful activities that lift your spirit and connect you with him, usually a church or synagogue gathering.

 

[Humblepie]

John 5:45-47
45 Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust.

46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me; for he wrote of me.

47 But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?


Matt 5:17-18
17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Jesus said THINK NOT! (Or don't even think it for a second) that I came to DESTROY the Law.
And Moses said the law is for 1000 Generations.
So once again scripture proves he is right.

47 But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

 

[RandyK]

You don't do your "customary work" on Sabbath, which simply means taking a day off from whatever you do on a regular weekday, usually your paid job. Obviously this varies from person to person, one's "customary work" might be a hobby for another, you can't pin it down on specific activities. What's important is to worship God through some meaningful activities that lift your spirit and connect you with him, usually a church or synagogue gathering.

What? You mean, you get to decide what qualifies as "Sabbath observance?"

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

What? You mean, you get to decide what qualifies as "Sabbath observance?"

What does "keep it holy" mean to you, man?

 

[Humblepie]

Matt 23:1-3
Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,

2 Saying The scribes and the Pharisees sit in

Moses' seat:

3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

 

[RandyK]

What does "keep it holy" mean to you, man?

I don't believe we get to decide what a commandment means. It means what it means. But you take an outmoded commandment like "Keep the Sabbath Day holy" and turn it into, "Do what you feel "rest" means with regard to your occupation." That's weak, brother!

 

[RandyK]

Matt 23:1-3
Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,

2 Saying The scribes and the Pharisees sit in

Moses' seat:

3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

Keep in mind that what Jesus said to those who were under the Law were referred to the Law as the standard for their obedience to God. Once the Law had ceased to be the standard, the veil being torn, the Law was no longer in the picture.

The Law of God, after the Law of Moses failed by Israel and was fulfilled by Christ, defaulted back to God's call for Man to live in His image, after His likeness. And in addition, the example of Christ reflected what living in God's image looked like.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

I don't believe we get to decide what a commandment means. It means what it means. But you take an outmoded commandment like "Keep the Sabbath Day holy" and turn it into, "Do what you feel "rest" means with regard to your occupation." That's weak, brother!

That's not weak, that's what the bible says, sabbath is a rest from your "customary work", which is clearly defined as your occupation which you do in the other six days. What's really weak is being ignorant and taking pride in it.

On the first day you shall have a holy convocation; you shall do no customary work on it. But you shall offer an offering made by fire to the Lord for seven days. The seventh day shall be a holy convocation; you shall do no customary work on it.’ (Lev. 23:7-8)

“Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: (Ex. 20:8-10)

 

[RandyK]

That's not weak, that's what the bible says, sabbath is a rest from your "customary work", which is clearly defined as your occupation which you do in the other six days. What's really weak is being ignorant and taking pride in it.

Taking pride in what? I think it's "weak" to take a Commandment, which is one of the Ten Commandments, and then modernize it to fit how you wish to "obey it." That's completely arbitrary. Someone else may wish to modernize the Commandment to mean something else.

After all, there was much more to obeying the Sabbath than just resting from an occupation. It was a recognition that human works are tainted, and that God required human work to stop one day out of the week to give the land rest from human sin. That's how I look at it.

It was also to show respect for the entire Law, with all 613 requirements. That's how I look at it. So what's it matter what you think is important? God no longer requires that Israel obey the Sabbath Law because sin has now been legally dealt with through Christ's death and resurrection. Your wishing, arbitrarily, to resurrect an old law and modernize it is purely your jaded view of Christian theology.

On the first day you shall have a holy convocation; you shall do no customary work on it. But you shall offer an offering made by fire to the Lord for seven days. The seventh day shall be a holy convocation; you shall do no customary work on it.’ (Lev. 23:7-8)

So now you wish to "modernize" a "holy convocation" and an "animal sacrifice? You wish to rest from your job. But where is your "holy convocation?" If you're to modernize an assembly of an exclusive group of orthodox Jews, you might want to require a gathering of good Christtians--otherwise, you might not be keeping your version of the Sabbath?

And perhaps you need to make an offering, to replace the sacrifice? Maybe you need to take up an offering. Since the convocation was to last 7 days, perhaps you need to require a "camp meeting?"

“Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: (Ex. 20:8-10)

So you just like the "rest" part? Perhaps we should require that our "leave days" work out to be on Saturdays? Or, does it matter what day it is to you? If it is once a week in the Bible, will once a year work out in my modernized version of it?

So what are you taking pride in? Does resting one day a week for God make you feel spiritual and holy? Does giving up time to serve God when you could be serving yourself make you feel special?

Well, I suppose it should. But if you think it makes you better than those who don't want to give up one day a week for God out of obedience to your "rules," then I think you have misplaced pride.

God doesn't require this of us. What He requires is humility, and to recognize that we are not spiritually-superior because we rest once a week. It is the attitude of the heart that causes us to conform to God and please Him. If you're demanding that all others obey the Sabbath because you think that's important then you need to adjust your attitude.

God didn't make you a prophet to the Church to tell them to obey an outmoded commandment belonging to an outmoded Law that Israel completely failed and Christ fulfilled! I wouldn't take pride in your works, if I were you, because you were saved by grace! Obeying the works of the Law did not save you.

You can fail to be like God even while you devote a day per week to the Lord. It is how you behave each day, Sabbath or not, that can please God--not any particular day you decide to take a rest!

 

[RandyK]

I would remind those who follow what the Law said, that it was good "for a thousand generations," that the Law did have an end point, where all contracts end--when a party to the contract failed. And this particular contract of the Law of Moses failed when Israel not only made a mistake and sinned--sins could be atoned for and corrected. But this contract failed when the vast majority of the people all conspired together to serve another god, or so violated the agreement that it effectively had been abandoned completely.

So the fact the Law intended to cover sin until the end of time did not mean the agreement could not be terminated. The 1st time it was terminated was when Israel went into captivity during the Assyrian and Babylonian invasions.

At that time God retained a part of the agreement with the idea that it could be recovered. The complete abandonment of the Law could be forgiven with sufficient numbers willing to return to it, which happened in the Persian Restoration.

But the Law as a contract failed for all time when Israel, as a nation, rejected Jesus as Messiah. A thousand generations no longer applied. The agreement that would be good as long as the universe stood was fulfilled by Christ because only he was perfect. But it was completely failed by Israel because their sins would always become a problem again, as long as God tolerated sins against Him on earth.

Even now, Israel's rebellion can be mitigated with a new restoration. But next time it will not be under the Law because a new way of fixing sins has come--one that will bring final judgment to those who are resisting. Christ will come to give us new sinless bodies so that the universe will be made new. There will be no need for a Law dealing with sin then!