the security of our salvation

[JLB]

Now, your turn:

In the parable of the lost sheep, are all 100 of His sheep found?

They start off found.


Then one wanders away and becomes lost. Which by your own admission means unsaved.


Thank you, for finally admitting OSAS is a false doctrine.




JLB

 

[Senior]

Lisa, you're not mentioning REPENTANCE,
which is the KEY to what we're talking about.
My 2 favorites are: 1 John 1:7-9 and 2 Corinthians 7:8-10.

 

[Senior]

Your idea that salvation can be lost through sin is just plain wrong.

Lisa, what do you think of the verse in my signature?

 

[Senior]

Lisa ...
what do you think of the verse in my signature below?

 

[WIP]

I'm actually more curious how you deal with it. Do you leave the house? I would fall into a constant shame-spiral if I believed that Jesus turned his back on me every time I stumbled.

I think there's a difference between stumbling and falling completely. It's a heart issue. Have I stumbled or have I given up and turned my back on Jesus? I think that is the real question. Jesus knows.

 

[JLB]

I think there's a difference between stumbling and falling completely. It's a heart issue. Have I stumbled or have I given up and turned my back on Jesus? I think that is the real question. Jesus knows.

Yes, another good point.

I think we all have stumbled, been knocked down, been trapped by the enemy, but we get back up, and learn from our mistakes.

We grow wiser.

We learn to stay close to Him; within the length of His rod and staff, learning that it comforts us.


It comforts us because we realize He wants us close to Him.


He loves us.


However, there is a difference in biblical words and modern words that are worded the same.


Stumble

Fall; as in fall away


These biblical words mean something much different than their modern day counterpart.


Which is why when two people are having a discussion, and using the same word, but are opposed to one another, it’s sometimes, that one person see’s the biblical meaning and context of a word while the other person is using the same word in a more modern day application.



This is why I hope we can define some of the biblical words and phrases, as part of our SOF.


Example:


Brother so and so, fell away from church because he starting drinking again.


But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away. Luke 8:13


This passage from Luke appears to mean, a brother was tempted (example; by drinking) and fell away from church.


When in reality, biblically, it means something completely different.




JLB

 

[lisa-in-FL]

Lisa, what do you think of the verse in my signature?

I answered this already in #135

I'm actually more curious how you deal with it. Do you leave the house? I would fall into a constant shame-spiral if I believed that Jesus turned his back on me every time I stumbled.
And if you back up from that verse you'll find a great reminder that we are under grace, and not the law. Jesus Christ fulfilled the law so we don't have to. Does that give us a free pass to sin "God forbid." But that doesn't sever our relationship with Christ.

14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

(this is from the KJV - hope you can read it)

 

[lisa-in-FL]

Lisa, you're not mentioning REPENTANCE,
which is the KEY to what we're talking about.
My 2 favorites are: 1 John 1:7-9 and 2 Corinthians 7:8-10.

Is REPENTANCE in all caps more important than just plain old repentance? Why didn't you bold the text or change the color this time?

No one is ignoring the importance of repentance and no one is saying a believer has no need for repentance. As I said in another post a believer can turn away from what he or she knows but that doesn't mean that our Savior has turned from us. Like the good shepherd he is, he is always looking for those who have gone astray to bring them back. But they are still his.
I say again, the idea that you can lose salvation every time you sin makes no sense and would drive the average person to the brink of insanity. They'd be in constant fear and anxiety over disappointing Christ.
I'm assuming you've heard of GRACE, right?

 

[lisa-in-FL]

Ephesians 1:13-14 King James Version (KJV)
13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

Ephesians 4:30 King James Version (KJV)
30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

2 Corinthians 1:22 King James Version (KJV)
22 Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.

John 14:16 King James Version (KJV)
16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;


Sealed? Sounds pretty permanent to me. The Greek word translated as "earnest" above apparently means "a pledge" - so its like a down payment, a promise. And we have it for ever if we are truly saved.
We are told not to grieve or quench (meaning stifle) the Holy Spirit, but no where (in the NT) is it said that the Holy Spirit will leave a believer.

 

[JLB]

Ephesians 1:13-14 King James Version (KJV)
13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

Ephesians 4:30 King James Version (KJV)
30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

2 Corinthians 1:22 King James Version (KJV)
22 Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.

John 14:16 King James Version (KJV)
16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;


Sealed? Sounds pretty permanent to me. The Greek word translated as "earnest" above apparently means "a pledge" - so its like a down payment, a promise. And we have it for ever if we are truly saved.
We are told not to grieve or quench (meaning stifle) the Holy Spirit, but no where (in the NT) is it said that the Holy Spirit will leave a believer.

Whoever hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. 1 John 3:15


Based on this verse, does a brother who begins to hate his brother still have eternal life remaining in him?



JLB

 

[ezra]

Whoever hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. 1 John 3:15


Based on this verse, does a brother who begins to hate his brother still have eternal life remaining in him?



JLB

i have asked this post to be closed for this very reason lisa is not saying either way .Hopefully mods will close it per my request

 

[lisa-in-FL]

Whoever hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. 1 John 3:15


Based on this verse, does a brother who begins to hate his brother still have eternal life remaining in him?



JLB

I swore I wasn't going to post on this thread again but you keep coming back to this one note even after you've received multiple posts with verses and arguments to the contrary.

Start at the beginning of this chapter and pray for the discernment to see what is really being said here. Its about the work Christ completed out of love for us, how we should use that gift and how to discern those that are Christian in name only from those that are truly children of God. This particular verse is following a reference to Cain "who is of that wicked one".
Sinning, even habitual sin doesn't mean you aren't saved - just ignoring the Spirit (or grieving the Spirit) who will remind you to get it right.
Ever hear a sermon that cuts you to the core because you realize you are guilty of something you didn't even know was a hindrance to your life? That doesn't mean you need to get re-saved - just that the Holy Spirit (and God's Word) is doing what they are meant to do.

 

[Truthfrees]

closed at op request