The theology of "soul sleep" any truth?

[Brother Mike]

I understand it, but I don't really believe it to be a true statement. Can you give me the reasons why you know this to be true especially in light of scripture that shows readers that God and Jesus appealed to people's intellect, the fact that scripture says to seek out wisdom, and in light of things like Jesus saying "CONSIDER (give thought to) the lilies of the field........"?

Matt 6 Jesus was speaking about comparing the lilies of the field, dose not God cloth the field in lilies? What does that have to do with God making sure I have cloths or other needs? The chapter of Matt 6 was about the operation of the Kingdom of God. It takes a bit past natural understanding to grasp the full implication. Who as a believe operates in the Kingdom of God?

The Kingdom of God is to be received like a child. (Mark 10) So things may appear to be foolish to those of us who are hard core intellectual bible students. Things of the Spirit don't always make sense with what we know about natural things.

So I see lots of post, but I see where a believe can have more than what they can figure out in scriptures on their own. The missing part would be filled with the Holy Spirit and with power.

That is the difference between leaving a sinner some Jesus tract to tell them about the dangers of Hell as Opposed to let me lay my hands on your kid so they will be healed.

Some I see here don't cherish the Word, they cherish their traditions and religion. The plan of God is a far concept to them. Others I see cherish the Word but missing this powerful witness because nobody has taken the time to tell them there is far more to just being born again.

However that is something we have to seek and believe for once, instead of hoping to find it with intellect. This is where faith comes in, and not what we can figure out on our own. I only want the best for people, and you can tell who wants a religious life and fill a church pew every Sunday and who wants to lay it all down to do the plan of God with all the tools possible that God has for them.

Like my Amish friend, they don't believe in tongues, or any of that stuff. She loved God but she got frustrated by only being able to just tell people about Jesus and give some scriptures. She went to her room and just said God if this tongues thing is real if there is more I want it..............

That is all it took

If I did not know there was more for you, I would not even bother or bother if I felt you were like most the rest.

Blessings
Mike.

 

[Sparkey]

Some I see here don't cherish the Word, they cherish their traditions and religion.

A farmer ponders a field. A woman also, ponders that same field. Both are drawn to sell all they have and to surrender what remains of themselves in order to purchase that field which contains a pearl of great price. The man with the dirt under his fingernails may ponder the field for his own profit. That Psalms 31 woman? Who is also mentioned in the Song? She too may ponder and together both she and he shall work for the glory of God.

Who is to say, which is the farmer and which is the one for whom it remains to be seen is that woman? Both sell all. Both the servant and the friend may join together and edify, edify, edify.

Even as I am drawn toward the quiet contemplation of the field, and even as I ponder how I, being one who says, Do NOT look upon me, for I am dark, not lovely, I also know that I too am cautioned about what seat I take to regard the procession made known by Him who is both the author and the finisher, because the first shall be last and the last shall be seen first. What kind of embarrassment would I save myself even as I hope to attain prominence, if I were to follow closely to the advice given by the One who knowns and has revealed all such mysteries. No, it is good for me to be seated in the back, and to be spared the indignity of being asked to give my seat to another. For it is God, by His Spirit utterly apart from all sin, who is no respecter of person who shall reward according to every thought, hidden or announced, every word, spoken or not, every action, seen or unseen and every beat of the heart, in me and in others, for His purpose, his plan and for His glory.

With this some faith we do join and are joined, together and pray with that prayer, mentioned so recently by me but a helpmeet of one whom I seek to grow agape with, our prayer to hers, first spoken by another, set for the founding stones of the foundation of our faith and brotherly love:

Ephesians 3:20 (KJV) ~ Unto Him that is able He is to do exceedingly abundantly above all that we can ask or think.

Bigger than all my problems, bigger than all my fears,

God is bigger than any mountain I can, or cannot, see,

Bigger than all my questions, bigger than anything,

God is bigger than any mountain I can, or cannot, see.

Magnify God. In our hearts, in our thoughts and in our prayers. Sanctify Him that we too may be found utterly holy, adorned by the whiteness of His robe, seen and known to be epistles and letters, inscribed into our hearts, read and known of men, written by God. Extol him that writeth upon the heavens by His Name! By His, name, Jesus. Written upon us. Our names carved individually upon the very palms of God, the God of Majesty, the God of all heaven and all earth, enthroned in his rightful place. Join with me as I call to have Him enthroned also in my heart, as I strive, with you, to have Him seen seated with me, even as He has given me dominion, so also it is my duty to give to him all dominion and all glory as we prepare to cast our crown to that one, that only one called Worthy, worthy, worthy is the Lamb of God.

 

[JLB]

If the story of the rich man and Lazarus is a true story, then how do you explain the following problems?

• Lazarus didn't go to God or to Jesus, but to the Abraham
• The rich man requested permission to go back from Abraham, not from God
• The rich man was able to see Lazarus and speak to Abraham, as if they were the only ones there. Where were all the millions of others who had died before then?
• If we are all judged and sent to Heaven or Hell as soon as we die, why the need for a final Judgment in the future?

As for "soul sleep", there are a number of verses that support the idea.

For the grave cannot praise thee, death can not celebrate thee: they that go down into the pit cannot hope for thy truth. (Is. 38:18 KJV)

For in death there is no remembrance of thee: in the grave who shall give thee thanks? (Ps. 6:5 KJV)

Behold, I show you a mystery: We shall not all sleep; but we shall all be changed (I Cor. 15:51 KJV)

​

There are a many other verses that say that we sleep or that the dead cannot praise or thank God. The only two I can remember that people say "prove" that we don't sleep are the story of Lazarus and the rich man and the fact that Jesus told the thief on the cross next to him "Truly, I say to you, today you will be with me in Paradise". Well, that's how most versions translate it. Some say it should be "Truly, I say to you today, you will be with me in Paradise". (Look closely and see if you can tell the difference.)

The TOG

​

Very very good job.

What do you find very, very good about what was said.

Could you explain?


JLB

 

[adam332]

I apologize if this subject has already been discussed....A very good friend who is a Christian poet and song writer believes in "soul sleep". Baptist theology is found in 2 Corinthians 5:6-8. Away from the body, at home with the Lord. (ESV) I don't think I've ever heard any soul sleep theology. A lot of Christians have wondered about this and 2 Cor. 5:6-8 has been my position. What about "soul sleep"?

Hear are passages that talk about the dead sleeping.

Psa 13:3 Consider [and] hear me, O LORD my God: lighten mine eyes, lest I sleep the [SLEEP of] DEATH;

Job 14:12 So man lieth down, and riseth not: till the heavens [be] no more, they shall not awake, nor be raised out of their SLEEP.

Job 17:13 If I wait, the GRAVE [is] mine house: I have made my BED in the darkness.

Job 17:16 They shall go down to the bars of the pit, when [our] REST together [is] in the DUST.

Dan 12:2 And many of them that SLEEP IN THE DUST of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame [and] everlasting contempt.

Mat 9:24 He said unto them, Give place: for the maid is NOT DEAD, BUT SLEEPETH. And they laughed him to scorn.

Also See Rest-(rests, resting, rested, resteth, etc...)- 7verses
Job 17:16, Psa. 16:9, Hab. 3:16, John 11:13, Acts 2:26, Rev. 6:11, Rev. 14:13.

Sleep-(sleeps, slept, sleeping, sleepeth, sleepest, asleep, etc...)- 63verses
Deu. 31:16, 2 Sam. 7:12, 1 Kings 1:21, 1 Kings 2:10, 1 Kings 11:21, 1 Kings 11:43, 1 Kings 14:20, 1 Kings 14:31, 1 Kings 15:8, 1 Kings 15:24, 1 Kings 16:6, 1 Kings 16:28, 1 Kings 22:40, 1 Kings 22:50, 2 Kings 8:24, 2 Kings 10:35, 2 Kings 13:9, 2 Kings 13:13, 2 Kings 14:16, 2 Kings 14:22, 2 Kings 14:29, 2 Kings 15:7, 2 Kings 15:22, 2 Kings 15:38, 2 Kings 16:20, 2 Kings 20:21, 2 Kings 21:18, 2 Kings 24:6, 2 Chr. 9:31, 2 Chr. 12:16, 2 Chr. 14:1, 2 Chr. 16:13, 2 Chr. 21:1, 2 Chr. 26:2, 2 Chr. 26:23, 2 Chr. 27:9, 2 Chr. 28:27, 2 Chr. 32:33, 2 Chr. 33:20, Job 7:21, Job 14:12, Psa. 13:3, Psa. 76:6, Psa. 90:5, Dan. 12:2, Mat. 9:24, Mat. 27:52, Mark 5:39, Luke 8:52, John 11:11-13, Acts 7:60, Acts 13:36, 1 Cor. 5:20, 1Cor. 15:6, 1Cor. 15:18, 1 Cor. 15:51, Eph. 5:14, 1 Thes. 4:13-15, 2Pet 3:4.

Awake(wake, waketh, wakest, waken, wakened, etc...)
Psa. 17:15, Isa. 26:19, Isa.51:9, Isa. 52:1, 1Cor. 15:34, 1Thes. 5:10.

 

[JLB]

Mat 9:24 He said unto them, Give place: for the maid is NOT DEAD, BUT SLEEPETH. And they laughed him to scorn.

23 When Jesus came into the ruler's house, and saw the flute players and the noisy crowd wailing, 24 He said to them, "Make room, for the girl is not dead, but sleeping." And they ridiculed Him. 25 But when the crowd was put outside, He went in and took her by the hand, and the girl arose. Matthew 9:23-24


In this scripture, Jesus raised this girl from the dead ["sleep"]. She was never buried in the ground ["dust"].

Jesus gives us the truth by saying, God is the God of the living and not the dead.

19 "There was a certain rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and fared sumptuously every day. 20 But there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, full of sores, who was laid at his gate, 21 desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table. Moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. 22 So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham's bosom. The rich man also died and was buried. 23 And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. 24 Then he cried and said, 'Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.' 25 But Abraham said, 'Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented. 26 And besides all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed, so that those who want to pass from here to you cannot, nor can those from there pass to us.' 27 Then he said, 'I beg you therefore, father, that you would send him to my father's house, 28 for I have five brothers, that he may testify to them, lest they also come to this place of torment.' 29 Abraham said to him, 'They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.' 30 And he said, 'No, father Abraham; but if one goes to them from the dead, they will repent.' 31 But he said to him, 'If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead.' " Luke 16:19-31


Notice that everyone's name that Jesus mentioned in this story was considered to be "living".

But the rich man's name was not mentioned, as he was in hell.


JLB

 

[adam332]

Mat 9:24 He said unto them, Give place: for the maid is NOT DEAD, BUT SLEEPETH. And they laughed him to scorn.

23 When Jesus came into the ruler's house, and saw the flute players and the noisy crowd wailing, 24 He said to them, "Make room, for the girl is not dead, but sleeping." And they ridiculed Him. 25 But when the crowd was put outside, He went in and took her by the hand, and the girl arose. Matthew 9:23-24

In this scripture, Jesus raised this girl from the dead ["sleep"]. She was never buried in the ground ["dust"].

Jesus gives us the truth by saying, God is the God of the living and not the dead.

Notice that everyone's name that Jesus mentioned in this story was considered to be "living".

But the rich man's name was not mentioned, as he was in hell.

Hey JLB.
I'm not exactly sure what her burial or non-burial has to do with the subject. Perhaps I'm missing something, just let me know what significance that is supposed to mean.

I think his name was not mentioned because he represented a vast group, in that prophetic parable about the second coming.

 

[JLB]

I'm not exactly sure what her burial or non-burial has to do with the subject. Perhaps I'm missing something, just let me know what significance that is supposed to mean.

The name of this thread is about "soul sleep", which for the most part means when a person dies and buried there soul is in a dormant "sleep" state, rather than being in heaven or hell.

People can be raised from the dead after being dead for three days or more.

The main point being a person being, what does a person experience after they are dead and buried.

As Daniel says -

And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, Some to everlasting life, Some to shame and everlasting contempt. Daniel 12:2


Paul teaches us -

8 We are confident, yes, well pleased rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord. 2 Corinthians 5:8

Jesus teaches about the afterlife in Luke 16.


Thanks for your input, and welcome to the Forum Brother.


JLB

 

[adam332]

The name of this thread is about "soul sleep", which for the most part means when a person dies and buried there soul is in a dormant "sleep" state, rather than being in heaven or hell.

I agree, except I have no reason to believe that being "buried" changes that.

People can be raised from the dead after being dead for three days or more. The main point being a person being, what does a person experience after they are dead and buried. And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, Some to everlasting life, Some to shame and everlasting contempt. Daniel 12:2

Ok. You say the main point is what they experience after being dead & buried for 3 days or more. You use a quote from Daniel about the 2 resurrections of both righteous and wicked. Are you implying that its not possible to resurrect people who die in the ocean or those not buried in the ground but who were cremated? Sorry but I don't know exactly what you are trying to relay or ask.

Paul teaches us -
8 We are confident, yes, well pleased rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord. 2 Corinthians 5:8

People can be raised from the dead after being dead for three days or more.

Ok. You say the main point is what they experience after being dead & buried for 3 days or more.

Well Paul is constantly misconstrued in that passage. He never says what proponents insinuate that passage to mean. Paul is saying that he would rather face death of his earthly body and be before God and face judgement today.

Jesus teaches about the afterlife in Luke 16.

Actually he does in a sense. That is a prophetic parable that teaches us about the second coming. Same as he plainly does is many prophetic parables.

Thanks for your input, and welcome to the Forum Brother.

Thank you so much for the welcome, very kind.

 

[JLB]

Ok. You say the main point is what they experience after being dead & buried for 3 days or more. You use a quote from Daniel about the 2 resurrections of both righteous and wicked.

2 And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, Some to everlasting life, Some to shame and everlasting contempt. 3 Those who are wise shall shine Like the brightness of the firmament, And those who turn many to righteousness Like the stars forever and ever. Daniel 12:2-3

Daniel uses the phrase "sleep" here in this passage to refer to those who are dead.

Paul uses this same language to describe those who are dead, in his letter to the Thessalonian Church.

13 But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope.

14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.

Paul teaches us here that the body is dead [asleep], yet God will bring with Him "those' who sleep, with Him.

The saints who have died will return with Jesus when He returns, for they are in heaven.

as seen here in Revelation -
8 And to her it was granted to be arrayed in fine linen, clean and bright, for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints.,

11 Now I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse. And He who sat on him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and makes war. 12 His eyes were like a flame of fire, and on His head were many crowns. He had a name written that no one knew except Himself. 13 He was clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God. 14 And the armies in heaven, clothed in fine linen, white and clean, followed Him on white horses. Revelation 19:8,11-14


These that come with the Lord when he returns are the saints who are in heaven. Their bodies are dead [asleep] in the earth, yet their spirit man [soul] is in heaven with the Lord, just as Paul wrote "to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord".

just as we see here in Revelation 6 -

9 When He opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held. 10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, "How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?" 11 Then a white robe was given to each of them; and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer, until both the number of their fellow servants and their brethren, who would be killed as they were, was completed. Revelation 6:9-11

and again -

9 After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands, 10 and crying out with a loud voice, saying, "Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!" 13 Then one of the elders answered, saying to me, "Who are these arrayed in white robes, and where did they come from?" 14 And I said to him, "Sir, you know." So he said to me, "These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. Revelation 7:9-10,13-14

Many souls who have died and are in heaven, even though their bodies are dead [asleep].


13 But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus. 15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore comfort one another with these words. 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18




51 Behold, I tell you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed-- 52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, 51 Behold, I tell you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed-- 52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality and we shall be changed.1 Corinthians 15:51-53

... the dead will be raised incorruptible,

Do you think the body is dead and will be raised, or do you think that a persons soul is dead and will be raised?


JLB

 

[By Grace]

Hear are passages that talk about the dead sleeping.

Psa 13:3 Consider [and] hear me, O LORD my God: lighten mine eyes, lest I sleep the [SLEEP of] DEATH;

Job 14:12 So man lieth down, and riseth not: till the heavens [be] no more, they shall not awake, nor be raised out of their SLEEP.

Job 17:13 If I wait, the GRAVE [is] mine house: I have made my BED in the darkness.

Job 17:16 They shall go down to the bars of the pit, when [our] REST together [is] in the DUST.

Dan 12:2 And many of them that SLEEP IN THE DUST of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame [and] everlasting contempt.

Mat 9:24 He said unto them, Give place: for the maid is NOT DEAD, BUT SLEEPETH. And they laughed him to scorn.

Also See Rest-(rests, resting, rested, resteth, etc...)- 7verses
Job 17:16, Psa. 16:9, Hab. 3:16, John 11:13, Acts 2:26, Rev. 6:11, Rev. 14:13.

Sleep-(sleeps, slept, sleeping, sleepeth, sleepest, asleep, etc...)- 63verses
Deu. 31:16, 2 Sam. 7:12, 1 Kings 1:21, 1 Kings 2:10, 1 Kings 11:21, 1 Kings 11:43, 1 Kings 14:20, 1 Kings 14:31, 1 Kings 15:8, 1 Kings 15:24, 1 Kings 16:6, 1 Kings 16:28, 1 Kings 22:40, 1 Kings 22:50, 2 Kings 8:24, 2 Kings 10:35, 2 Kings 13:9, 2 Kings 13:13, 2 Kings 14:16, 2 Kings 14:22, 2 Kings 14:29, 2 Kings 15:7, 2 Kings 15:22, 2 Kings 15:38, 2 Kings 16:20, 2 Kings 20:21, 2 Kings 21:18, 2 Kings 24:6, 2 Chr. 9:31, 2 Chr. 12:16, 2 Chr. 14:1, 2 Chr. 16:13, 2 Chr. 21:1, 2 Chr. 26:2, 2 Chr. 26:23, 2 Chr. 27:9, 2 Chr. 28:27, 2 Chr. 32:33, 2 Chr. 33:20, Job 7:21, Job 14:12, Psa. 13:3, Psa. 76:6, Psa. 90:5, Dan. 12:2, Mat. 9:24, Mat. 27:52, Mark 5:39, Luke 8:52, John 11:11-13, Acts 7:60, Acts 13:36, 1 Cor. 5:20, 1Cor. 15:6, 1Cor. 15:18, 1 Cor. 15:51, Eph. 5:14, 1 Thes. 4:13-15, 2Pet 3:4.

Awake(wake, waketh, wakest, waken, wakened, etc...)
Psa. 17:15, Isa. 26:19, Isa.51:9, Isa. 52:1, 1Cor. 15:34, 1Thes. 5:10.

From what source (s) did this list come?

By posting it as you did, with no source referenced, it appears that this is your own creation. Also it is important to note that there are different degrees of authority of resources. Also when one makes a list of verses such as you did, it is important that the context is looked at, otherwise tou can mistake someone's statement for something that God said in the Bible. Your Job quote is a perfect example of taking something out of context.

FIRST, the most important thing to remember that it is JOB who is speaking here, not God
SECOND it is Job is making a complaint against God, and telling God how good he is, and how "unfair" God is
THIRD it is important to remember that Job is not Paul, the Apostle
FOURTH this is in the "wisdom literature" section, and sometimes these are written as Hebrew poetry. As such, the words here should sometimes be read as poetry.

Here are the verses in their context highlighting in purple the verse you state supports soul sleep:
.

Job 14:8 Though the root thereof wax old in the earth, and the stock thereof die in the ground;
9 Yet through the scent of water it will bud, and bring forth boughs like a plant.
10 But man dieth, and wasteth away: yea, man giveth up the ghost, and where is he?
11 As the waters fail from the sea, and the flood decayeth and drieth up:
12 So man lieth down, and riseth not: till the heavens be no more, they shall not awake, nor be raised out of their sleep.
13 O that thou wouldest hide me in the grave, that thou wouldest keep me secret, until thy wrath be past, that thou wouldest appoint me a set time, and remember me!
14 If a man die, shall he live again? all the days of my appointed time will I wait, till my change come.
15 Thou shalt call, and I will answer thee: thou wilt have a desire to the work of thine hands.
16 For now thou numberest my steps: dost thou not watch over my sin? 17 My transgression is sealed up in a bag, and thou sewest up mine iniquity.
.​

What I read here is NOT a support for soul sleep. Instead, I read the complaint of a man to God about what Job sees is the futility of life. Thus what Job is talking about in verse 12 is the futility of the life and death cycle, all humans go through, and he uses lyeth down: and riseth" "awake" and "sleep" as poetic metaphors for death.

That is also seen in verses 13 and 14 where there are words like grave" and "die" and of course he mentions the possibility of resurrection in verse 14. THAT is amazing because that is the first of the Old Testament written. It predates Moses writing of the the Pentateuch.

 

[Butch5]

13 And the king said to her, "Do not be afraid. What did you see?" And the woman said to Saul, "I saw a spirit ascending out of the earth." 14 So he said to her, "What is his form?" And she said, "An old man is coming up, and he is covered with a mantle." And Saul perceived that it was Samuel, and he stooped with his face to the ground and bowed down. 15 Now Samuel said to Saul, "Why have you disturbed me by bringing me up?" And Saul answered, "I am deeply distressed; for the Philistines make war against me, and God has departed from me and does not answer me anymore, neither by prophets nor by dreams. Therefore I have called you, that you may reveal to me what I should do." 16 Then Samuel said: "Why then do you ask me, seeing the Lord has departed from you and has become your enemy? 1 Samuel 28:13-16

Samuel was in Abraham's Bosom.

Saul and his sons were there also.

Jesus went down into the heart of the earth to bring out the captives that were preserved there until He was revealed to them in Paradise.

JLB

JBL,

You should look at a more accurate translation. The Masoretic text says she saw "eloheem" (plural) coming up. "Eloheem" is translated gods. Paul said that the gods were demons. 1 Chronicles also says that Saul sought one who had a familiar spirit to inquire of it. He was seeking a demon. we all know that demons deceive. The passage also doesn't say that Samuel actually came up but rather that Saul "perceived" it was Samuel

KJV 1 Chronicles 10:13 So Saul died for his transgression which he committed against the LORD, even against the word of the LORD, which he kept not, and also for asking counsel of one that had a familiar spirit, to enquire of it; (1Ch 10:13 KJV)

 

[Butch5]

I apologize if this subject has already been discussed....A very good friend who is a Christian poet and song writer believes in "soul sleep". Baptist theology is found in 2 Corinthians 5:6-8. Away from the body, at home with the Lord. (ESV) I don't think I've ever heard any soul sleep theology. A lot of Christians have wondered about this and 2 Cor. 5:6-8 has been my position. What about "soul sleep"?

Hi Chopper,

The passage isn't talking about soul sleep. Paul is talking about being absent from corruption and present in incorruption. If you look at the previous verses he is talking about putting on incorruption over corruption. When a person dies they are dead, the next rational thought they have is at the resurrection. When one dies they end the corruptible, in the resurrection the put on incorruption.

 

[JLB]

Hi Chopper,

The passage isn't talking about soul sleep. Paul is talking about being absent from corruption and present in incorruption. If you look at the previous verses he is talking about putting on incorruption over corruption. When a person dies they are dead, the next rational thought they have is at the resurrection. When one dies they end the corruptible, in the resurrection the put on incorruption.

Which clearly has to do with the body.

 

[By Grace]

JBL,

You should look at a more accurate translation. The Masoretic text says she saw "eloheem" (plural) coming up. "Eloheem" is translated gods.

Elohim is ALWAYS a singular noun written as a plural. the plural is used to express the majesty of God, and not the plurality of gods.

Genesis 1:1
בְּרֵאשִׁית בָּרָא אֱלֹהִים אֵת הַשָּׁמַיִם וְאֵת הָאָרֶץ׃

What I colored blue is the word transliterated "Elohim"

Here is more data on that:

אֱלֹהִים (ʾělō·hîm): n.masc.; ≡ Str 430; TWOT 93c—1. LN 12.22 God, i.e., the true God, note: though the form is a grammatical plural, the meaning is singular and many sources think implies a majesty or stateliness (Ge 1:1); 2. LN 12.1–12.42 (pl.) gods, i.e., deities other than the true God, which are falsely worshiped (Dt 5:7; 1Ki 11:5, 33); 3. LN 6.96–6.101 idol, i.e., a worship object made of various materials (Ex 20:23; 34:17; Dt 4:28; 28:36; Da 11:8); 4. LN 37.48–37.95 mighty one, i.e., a person who is strong and capable, and so a leader or prominent one (Ge 23:6); 5. LN 56.20–56.34 judge, i.e., one who presides over a court session, or deals in arbitration (Ex 21:6, 7, 8);

Swanson, J. (1997). Dictionary of Biblical Languages with Semantic Domains : Hebrew (Old Testament).
​

In the Greek passage that Paul wrote, the noun "body" is what is important, and not any modifying adjective such as "spiritual" or "physical". that is the argument that J Gresham Machen used to skewer the liberals in the Presbyterian church during the 1930s. The argument still stands.

 

[The Light]

This thread was meaty....

 

[n2thelight]

Why may I ask would anybody in their right mind even want these flesh bodies back.

 

[JLB]

Why may I ask would anybody in their right mind even want these flesh bodies back.

Your body will be resurrected and changed into a glorious body that will never die like Jesus.




JLB

 

[n2thelight]

Your body will be resurrected and changed into a glorious body that will never die like Jesus.
JLB

 

[for_his_glory]

I sure miss our friend Chopper.