The Wrath of God

[jasonc]

the jews have been saved and are being saved. define isreal.

is isreal a land or a people.

the jews say a people the land need be for them to even be. the god they believe is with them wherever they are. the problem is that jesus already rules. he never lost his throne. when sin and crimes are punished. whom does the punishing for that crime if they didn't repent? jesus. he always did. when did the lord say he lost the nations and said satan had souls? satan never had anything god hasn't allowed

per your view the saved Hebrews now, will be better off as I can go to see jesus , I can talk to him
in the mr of yours if he isn't a levite he cant be as close. unless you want to argue that the law is equal in allowing the man to enter into the presence of god, which it isn't. notice the priests what they have to do? atone a lot. if they fail what happens? the people fall. theres no way that cant happen.

isiah 11 also mentions ammon, where is that nation? gone and well if they existed the modern jew is commanded not to meddle with them. so their isn't saved jews from that time until now. do you know that for sure that god worked miracles in secret and saved a lot of jews throughout church history. I do believe that despite our sin he does.

futurist look for physical land and with borders to define what isreal is. the Hebrew say that isn't the case as we have never ceased to be. im no less a Hebrew to them if I do the torah in America or in isreal, or Russia. the heretz isreal is blessed yes, but well the jews say that the dead jew returns to heaven by going over isreal. the land was blessed by god but not that they see that they cease to exist without a land. so if a jew is saved in America he doesn't count?

romans 1o and 9 mention no land but people. my pastor a hardcore futurist says that.

 

[agua.]

Sorry Jason I'm having trouble understanding what your saying and I'm a bit skeptical about you understanding my position especially when you seem to suggest it supports preferential treatment to the Jew. Thanks for your input Brother.

 

[jasonc]

Sorry Jason I'm having trouble understanding what your saying and I'm a bit skeptical about you understanding my position especially when you seem to suggest it supports preferential treatment to the Jew. Thanks for your input Brother.

the jews take it as such. most futurists do as well. its in there read Ezekiel 40-48

no uncircumcised goy in the flesh or the heart can enter the Holy of Holies. so he would have to become what a Hebrew!

so you cant define what isreal is?

isreal per most jews
a person born of the lineage of Abraham and practices judiasm
a convert to judiasm
a man who was born of the lineage and not a practice of judiasm
the land is called eretz isreal not just isreal all the time.
Jacob the patriarch
a Christian jew who denies the faith and will be recycled in sheol until he renounces jesus.

And the chamber whose prospect is toward the north is for the priests, the keepers of the charge of the altar: these are the sons of Zadok among the sons of Levi, which come near to the Lord to minister unto him.
Then said he unto me, The north chambers and the south chambers, which are before the separate place, they be holy chambers, where the priests that approach unto the Lord shall eat the most holy things: there shall they lay the most holy things, and the meat offering, and the sin offering, and the trespass offering; for the place is holy.

14 When the priests enter therein, then shall they not go out of the holy place into the utter court, but there they shall lay their garments wherein they minister; for they are holy; and shall put on other garments, and shall approach to those things which are for the people.
Then said he unto me, The north chambers and the south chambers, which are before the separate place, they be holy chambers, where the priests that approach unto the Lord shall eat the most holy things: there shall they lay the most holy things, and the meat offering, and the sin offering, and the trespass offering; for the place is holy.

14 When the priests enter therein, then shall they not go out of the holy place into the utter court, but there they shall lay their garments wherein they minister; for they are holy; and shall put on other garments, and shall approach to those things which are for the people.
Then said he unto me, The north chambers and the south chambers, which are before the separate place, they be holy chambers, where the priests that approach unto the Lord shall eat the most holy things: there shall they lay the most holy things, and the meat offering, and the sin offering, and the trespass offering; for the place is holy.

14 When the priests enter therein, then shall they not go out of the holy place into the utter court, but there they shall lay their garments wherein they minister; for they are holy; and shall put on other garments, and shall approach to those things which are for the people.
And, behold, the glory of the God of Israel came from the way of the east: and his voice was like a noise of many waters: and the earth shined with his glory.

I have taken several verses and shown them like that just randomnly where it mentions thing you say taker literally

I shall only say something about that last one

The glory of the God of Israel came from the way of the east - This was the chariot of cherubim, wheels, etc., which he saw at the river Chebar. And this glory, coming from the east, is going to enter into the eastern gate of the temple, and thence to shine out upon the whole earth. Is there not a mystery here? All knowledge, all religion, and all arts and sciences, have traveled, according to the course of the sun, From East To West! From that quarter the Divine glory at first came; and thence the rays of Divine light continue to diffuse themselves over the face of the earth. From thence came the Bible, and through that the new covenant. From thence came the prophets, the apostles, and the first missionaries, that brought the knowledge of God to Europe, to the isles of the sea, and to the west first, and afterwards to these northern regions.

that is from adam Clarke. when I read that I saw the glory of the lord and thought its the shekinah cloud when its the the torah itself!

while that is a vision of jesus but its never called jesus in bodily form. we don't call jesus on the earth the Glory of God.