Things I know; things I don't know; things I know but a little.

[Scotth1960]

Of course it's a denomination, Scott. No, Jesus did not "found" the Orthodox Church. He set up His Church, which is His Body - no denomination! Denominations have caused division, the Body is divided because of them.

Dear Rockie, Actually, His Body is not divided (Mat. 16:18, Epheisans). People just have false perceptions of what is "His Church", and that is where man-made denominations come in, unfortunately. There was only one Church for 1054 years. After that, Christ's prayer in John 17 was still yet to be fulfilled, and we all regret the divisions between / among us. I know I do. I wish all could agree on what truth is (John 16:13). In Erie Scott

 

[Jake]

Dear Rockie, Of course, the Bible is supreme authority for all Christians. Why is it,
then, that all Christians don't agree on every detail of what it all means? Just asking, not necessarily expecting a final answer here. Scott

Because we have people who lead people away from God by trying to get them to read everyone else's opinion and not leading them towards God's Word.

 

[Scotth1960]

Because we have people who lead people away from God by trying to get them to read everyone else's opinion and not leading them towards God's Word.

Of course, Rockie! That is my point exactly. But which version of God's Word will people understand? There are many Bibles, but only one Jesus Christ. We should just point people to Jesus Christ, and the Bible question will eventually be solved by the Holy Spirit. Scott

 

[jasoncran]

Because we have people who lead people away from God by trying to get them to read everyone else's opinion and not leading them towards God's Word.

i am curious on your opinion of commentaries,as often many say thus saith the spirit yet read the bible and dont mention the fact that they get that from a man's commentary.

ie some end times doctrine or other hard and time consuming reasearched bible verses.

 

[Jake]

Dear Rockie, Actually, His Body is not divided (Mat. 16:18, Epheisans). People just have false perceptions of what is "His Church", and that is where man-made denominations come in, unfortunately. There was only one Church for 1054 years. After that, Christ's prayer in John 17 was still yet to be fulfilled, and we all regret the divisions between / among us. I know I do. I wish all could agree on what truth is (John 16:13). In Erie Scott

No, we have not attained that unity (yet).

Ephisians4: 11for the perfecting of the saints, unto the work of ministering, unto the building up of the body of Christ:
13 till we all attain unto the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a fullgrown man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

 

[Scotth1960]

who said i am a calvinist, just stating that he wasnt all wrong.

do you believe that God is sovereign?

that when you came to the lord, it seemed the right time and that the draw was so strong that you couldnt fight it.
yes i could have said no but that was the only option i tried just about everything i could think of and i found that i wasnt better. i was still what i didnt like about me.

Dear jasoncran, God is Sovereign. That is basic Christian doctrine. Where

Calvinism errs is it makes God the cause of everything. It over extends His

sovereignty to the cause of evil. Evil was caused by satan, and came into

the world through Adam and Eve when they ate from the tree of knowledge

of good and evil. People are born in a deficient state, mortal, and with knowledge

of good and evil. Therefore, they eventually sin. It is not God's fault. But

Calvinism disagrees, and makes God a cause of something other than goodness.

God can only work to promote Himself, not to promote rebellion against Himself.

It seems that Calvinism disagrees, and has God predestining evil. Not at all.

God is not the cause of spiritual darkness, but only of The Uncreated Light. In

Erie PA Scott

 

[Jake]

Of course, Rockie! That is my point exactly. But which version of God's Word will people understand? There are many Bibles, but only one Jesus Christ. We should just point people to Jesus Christ, and the Bible question will eventually be solved by the Holy Spirit. Scott

Yes, but you gave a list of books OTHER than the Word and they ALL have different opinions.

I already gave you scripture, the teacher MUST be called by God. Eph 4:11, they will not teach false doctrine. There is ONE truth and we can know what that truth is, all of it. God said the Holy Spirit will lead us into ALL truth - NOT PARTIAL.

 

[Jake]

i am curious on your opinion of commentaries,as often many say thus saith the spirit yet read the bible and dont mention the fact that they get that from a man's commentary.

ie some end times doctrine or other hard and time consuming reasearched bible verses.

The Bibles I use do not have commentaries, many Bibles were written to support denominational views.

 

[jasoncran]

Dear jasoncran, God is Sovereign. That is basic Christian doctrine. Where

Calvinism errs is it makes God the cause of everything. It over extends His

sovereignty to the cause of evil. Evil was caused by satan, and came into

the world through Adam and Eve when they ate from the tree of knowledge

of good and evil. People are born in a deficient state, mortal, and with knowledge

of good and evil. Therefore, they eventually sin. It is not God's fault. But

Calvinism disagrees, and makes God a cause of something other than goodness.

God can only work to promote Himself, not to promote rebellion against Himself.

It seems that Calvinism disagrees, and has God predestining evil. Not at all.

God is not the cause of spiritual darkness, but only of The Uncreated Light. In

Erie PA Scott

well you misdunderstand basic calvinism but that is for those open calvinism thread.

one god lets men stay reprobate and they dont change till he reveals himself
two when he does reveal himself the man then changes as he has no choice

my problem with that its that limited atonement part that god selectivally calls men.

he calls all but few does he choose. thus why he would call all to repent and then only choose a few if they dont have a will?

that is a problem for calvinism.

i do believe in the idea of totaly depravity as i have seen it first hand in war.

 

[Scotth1960]

Yes, but you gave a list of books OTHER than the Word and they ALL have different opinions.

I already gave you scripture, the teacher MUST be called by God. Eph 4:11, they will not teach false doctrine. There is ONE truth and we can know what that truth is, all of it. God said the Holy Spirit will lead us into ALL truth - NOT PARTIAL.

Dear Rockie, All truth in regard John 16:13 should also reference related verses in John's Gospel, John 14:26 and John 15:26. And all truth will lead to Christ (John 15:27). In Erie PA Scott Harrington

 

[jasoncran]

The Bibles I use do not have commentaries, many Bibles were written to support denominational views.

i am unsure what pastor you have or you are one.

most pastors read the bible but also use some commentary or whether or not they are influenced by one or another

i was went to a church that thought as you do and yet they believe in the pre-trib rapture

hmm lol. that was from a man who took the kjv bible and looked for that and based his idea of end times in that scofield bible as a commentary.


i am a pre-tribber for the time being but i am not ignorant of who came up with it.

 

[Scotth1960]

you may engage my argument on infant baptism elsewhere.

i have no desire to join the local greek orthodox, as they seem to greek inclusive there.

why do i percieve that. well what else would one say when they do a greek feast every yr, and teach on greek food and culture on said day?

Dear jasoncran, I perceive what you were saying about irresistible grace was

good. No Christian would try to resist Christ's grace. But that does not mean

God forces Himself on us. His grace is freely received, not irresistible forced upon

us, as Calvinism suggests. That was what I was trying to say. The TULIP is an

attempt at logic that fails the test of sound Christian doctrine. Calvinism is a


scheme of rationalistic men, nothing more. It isn't the Gospel, God's simple Gospel

in Jesus Christ (John 3:16). In Erie PA Scott Harrington

PS I found the same thing about the Greek Orthodox; they use too much

Greek to gain members. The Russian Orthodox church here uses English or almost

99 percent English. So they prosper.

 

[jasoncran]

Dear jasoncran, I perceive what you were saying about irresistible grace was

good. No Christian would try to resist Christ's grace. But that does not mean

God forces Himself on us. His grace is freely received, not irresistible forced upon

us, as Calvinism suggests. That was what I was trying to say. The TULIP is an

attempt at logic that fails the test of sound Christian doctrine. Calvinism is a


scheme of rationalistic men, nothing more. It isn't the Gospel, God's simple Gospel

in Jesus Christ (John 3:16). In Erie PA Scott Harrington

PS I found the same thing about the Greek Orthodox; they use too much

Greek to gain members. The Russian Orthodox church here uses English or almost

99 percent English. So they prosper.

gravity is irrestable even though we try. who says that he was wrong on that way (as i put it)

it was strong that i choose not to resist as it was an addiction , the lord wouldnt leave me alone till i repented

i heard him in my hand pleading me to repent for days before i actually did it.

whose to say that he didnt work that first so that i would give in.

heres how i see it.

God knows the future and what decision we will make, yet allows us to make them but set things up so that when we make them we are already set up and doing those things he desires.

all without negativing freewill,

he knows what decision we will make before we make it

case in point

he knows what we need before we ask him.

 

[Jake]

i am unsure what pastor you have or you are one.

most pastors read the bible but also use some commentary or whether or not they are influenced by one or another

i was went to a church that thought as you do and yet they believe in the pre-trib rapture

hmm lol. that was from a man who took the kjv bible and looked for that and based his idea of end times in that scofield bible as a commentary.


i am a pre-tribber for the time being but i am not ignorant of who came up with it.

I am not a pastor, haha, I am a high school student.
A little surprised you are a pre-tribber, but for another thread, right?

 

[jasoncran]

I am not a pastor, haha, I am a high school student.
A little surprised you are a pre-tribber, but for another thread, right?[/QUOTE

why? because i know what i know and actually reasearch or listen to another ideas?

on that old church of mine, the founder and wife were sbc baptists and possibly influenced by a pastor who was into commentaries and never mentioned them. we often dont question what we are taught if has a decent logical argument or no other counterargument is presented

that is why i said about that spirit thing.

we cant have a ton of end times interpretations and all be right at the same and say thus saith the lord when we do it.

 

[Jake]

I am not a pastor, haha, I am a high school student.
A little surprised you are a pre-tribber, but for another thread, right?[/QUOTE

why? because i know what i know and actually reasearch or listen to another ideas?

on that old church of mine, the founder and wife were sbc baptists and possibly influenced by a pastor who was into commentaries and never mentioned them. we often dont question what we are taught if has a decent logical argument or no other counterargument is presented

that is why i said about that spirit thing.

we cant have a ton of end times interpretations and all be right at the same and say thus saith the lord when we do it.

Did you see the books Scott mentioned in his OP? That is what this thread about, he is leading people to read his Greek/Russian orthodox beliefs, wanting us to believe in infant baptisms and praying to statues.

I never said I didn't listen to people's interpetations, I keep saying we should listen to people who are TRULY called by God, not some random person who thinks they have been called. If they teach from the Word, then isn't that a good thing?

 

[Scotth1960]

I am not a pastor, haha, I am a high school student.
A little surprised you are a pre-tribber, but for another thread, right?

Dear Rockie, I agree with you that opinions can lead a person away from the Word of God, that is, away from both Christ the Living Word of God incarnate and the Bible the Written Word of God. But I had to learn Church History to refute the pre-tribulation error. I learned that not all Christians believe this. That is a mis-reading of St. Paul (cf. 2 Peter 3, etc.). I learned Matthew 24 speaks against pre-tribulationism. It says "After the tribulation" of those days. My whole point of this was that I didn't just read the NT alone. I read it in company with many Christian authors, and I believe I learned that not all Christians understand the NT in exactly the same ways. There are various opinions and doctrines. We should seek to believe only those which actually agree with the whole NT. I question some of the teachings of Pat Robertson, David
Wilkerson, Jimmy Swaggart, Robert Schuller, and others. In Erie PA Scott Harrington PS As I believe another post has shown, Benny Hinn and Kenneth
Copeland teach some things which sincere Christians should avoid as being in error, very bad error in some cases. But then we all can fall into error, so we should remain humble, anyone can have a bad day and misread the Bible. But God should send a better knowledge of the Scriptures through men who can correct the errors of some teachers.

 

[jasoncran]

Did you see the books Scott mentioned in his OP? That is what this thread about, he is leading people to read his Greek/Russian orthodox beliefs, wanting us to believe in infant baptisms and praying to statues.

I never said I didn't listen to people's interpetations, I keep saying we should listen to people who are TRULY called by God, not some random person who thinks they have been called. If they teach from the Word, then isn't that a good thing?

of course, but i also find that even though one is called not all he or she says is the truth doctrinally.

and often we are so biased its a good thing to look at the other arguments (non-salvinic in nature) of course.

 

[Scotth1960]

of course, but i also find that even though one is called not all he or she says is the truth doctrinally.

and often we are so biased its a good thing to look at the other arguments (non-salvinic in nature) of course.

Dear jasoncran, Here is where you are misinformed (misunderstand). I do not pray to statues. That is a Roman Catholic thing. And Roman Catholicism is not the same belief as the Orthodox Church. Nor do I pray to icons. Nor do the Calvinists who make images of John Calvin, or the Lutherans who make images of Martin Luther, on their Calvinist or Lutheran books. I could find no goo Protestant counterargument against John 15:26. Which is the main reason I believe Orthodoxy is preaching the whole Gospel, not just a partial truth, but all the truth (John 16:13). People who misunderstand the Orthodox Church or the Scriptures of the NT or of the OT, often misunderstand John 15:26 as well. How about you?
Have you read about the issue that split the Church into East and West in 1054 AD? See the Scriptures, don't take my word for it See John 15:26. In Erie PA Scott Harrington PS Even as I do not worship statues, you do not worship the Bible, do you?

 

[Jake]

and often we are so biased its a good thing to look at the other arguments (non-salvinic in nature) of course.

Ok, yes, I see your point now.