Bible Study WELCOME TO AN IN DEPTH STUDY OF MATTHEW'S GOSPEL.

[Mike]

Waaaaaait a minute. I thought this was supposed to start tomorrow, and it was only being introduced today. You all have gone scriptural on me already!

Willie, watch this thread, but don't watch me. I'll only dumb you down. I've seen some of your work since I've got back into the swing of things. Great stuff! I know we'll see eye-to-eye on many of the finer points.

So, have we started? Am I on the clock? My brother, Matthew...

 

[jasonc]

im to blame.besides we should look at the names of the kings there. some are sinners and were judged and others weren't. this lists which line to the Lord and from whom? mary or joseph?

 

[TOG]

I don't like called the ot, old, its not OLD. its the bible.

I agree. I prefer the term "Hebrew Scriptures". That's why I said Christians usually call it the Old Testament.

The TOG​

 

[TOG]

im to blame.besides we should look at the names of the kings there. some are sinners and were judged and others weren't. this lists which line to the Lord and from whom? mary or joseph?

Ah... Yes... Matthew....

You'd think there's not much to say about a genealogy, but there are a few interesting things in this one. Usually, whenever a story begins with a genealogy, it is to show the nobility of the main character of the story. While this genealogy does show that Jesus is descended from the line of David, it doesn't bypass the "less desirable" elements in his family tree, as many genealogies do. It includes foreigners (Ruth was a Mobaitess), murderers (King David murdered Uriah to get Bathsheba), idolaters (Manasseh "did what was evil in the sight of the LORD" (II Kings 21) and re-introduced idol worship), and many others. I don't know whether it's what Matthew had in mind, but to me, that shows that Jesus is everybody's "kinsman redeemer", not just the Jews, but also Gentiles and even the worst of sinners.

Does anyone here have any idea why the number 14 was so important to Matthew?

The TOG​

 

[Chopper]

I don't like called the ot, old, its not OLD. its the bible.

 

[Willie T]

In genealogies, I often find it fascinating to see that one famous person might have been, oh say, the grandson of another well known person. I often didn't associate the family relationships, and the influences certain people probably had on their children and grandchildren often living in the same tents with them. Ya know, telling them the old stories, and showing them where past events occurred, and such things.

My grandmother taught me so much more than my mother ever did. (I had no association with my father or grandfather.)

 

[jasonc]

In genealogies, I often find it fascinating to find that one famous person might have been the, oh say, the grandson of another well known person. I often didn't associate the family relationships, and the influences certain people probably had on their children and grandchildren often living in the same tents with them. Ya know, telling them the old stories, and showing them where past events occurred, and such things.

off topic, that isn't
just found in jewish culture. my town lost a founder of the city. if you knew my town, sexton would be assiocated with a lot of the building and aura of the town and its charm. yet his story is passed orally. most natives know the name of the man waldo and son ralph sexton orally.

 

[Chopper]

Ah... Yes... Matthew....

You'd think there's not much to say about a genealogy, but there are a few interesting things in this one. Usually, whenever a story begins with a genealogy, it is to show the nobility of the main character of the story. While this genealogy does show that Jesus is descended from the line of David, it doesn't bypass the "less desirable" elements in his family tree, as many genealogies do. It includes foreigners (Ruth was a Mobaitess), murderers (King David murdered Uriah to get Bathsheba), idolaters (Manasseh "did what was evil in the sight of the LORD" (II Kings 21) and re-introduced idol worship), and many others. I don't know whether it's what Matthew had in mind, but to me, that shows that Jesus is everybody's "kinsman redeemer", not just the Jews, but also Gentiles and even the worst of sinners.

Does anyone here have any idea why the number 14 was so important to Matthew?

The TOG​

From what I understand, Matthew structures the genealogy to count fourteen generations from each major section, according to the Jewish practice of gematria, the giving of a numeric value to the consonants in a word. example: David, D + V + D = 14, and David is the fourteenth name on the list.

 

[jasonc]

From what I understand, Matthew structures the genealogy to count fourteen generations from each major section, according to the Jewish practice of gematria, the giving of a numeric value to the consonants in a word. example: David, D + V + D = 14, and David is the fourteenth name on the list.

which gemetria? I have ran into to types. the one I have in a book for Christians and the other used by the Chassidics. btw that is an Ashkenazi word in spelling.

 

[Chopper]

Wow! Thank you so much, all of you who have already started posting. I'm as excited as you are to dig into Matthew's Gospel. I'm going to try and go very slowly thru these verses. If I jump over a text that you see as important, please stop me so we can discuss what you see as important.

So, Reba and I want to welcome you all to our Bible Study. We already value each one who have posted. I would like to welcome my old friend Mike. He and I go back a little and he was so important to me when I first joined CF.net.

OK, "Lets Roll."

Day 1 Sunday 9/14/14 Matthew 1:1-17 Genealogy Of Jesus The Christ.

As I have indicated before, I'm not a fan of genealogies other than to trace someone's lineage that I might be studying at the time. I do find several interesting aspects of these seventeen verses of the genealogy of the Son of God, Jesus. Matthew is writing primarily to the Hebrew people, he uses the number 14 three different times. Matthew does skip a few name perhaps for memorization purposes. During these early times of God's preparing a "people" they were limited in recording events. Fathers had to instruct their son's in these events passed by memorization, and then that son would eventually have a son and so on until writing instruments and parchments could be used to record important events.

Another interesting fact is the genealogy includes five women, Tamar, Rahab, Ruth, Bathsheba, and Mary. Rahab and Ruth were Gentiles, and Tamar, Rahab, and Bathsheba were women of questionable character. This simply means to me that the lineage of Jesus includes men, women, adulterers, prostitutes, hero's and Gentiles. Jesus came to save all kinds of people. I remember Jesus said that He did not come to call the righteous, He came to save sinners. All are born sinners, and need the Savior....Praise God for His unlimited Grace.

 

[Chopper]

which gemetria? I have ran into to types. the one I have in a book for Christians and the other used by the Chassidics. btw that is an Ashkenazi word in spelling.

I'm not sure jasonc, I'm just repeating what I had read long ago. This is where I need your expertise.

 

[Chopper]

Tomorrow's Study: Day 2 Monday 9/15/14 Matthew 1:18 The Conception Of The Savior.

 

[JLB]

I would like to see this verse discussed.



17 So all the generations from Abraham to David are fourteen generations, from David until the captivity in Babylon are fourteen generations, and from the captivity in Babylon until the Christ are fourteen generations.

How many believe the phrase - until the Christ refers to His birth?

How long is a generation.

This is a key scripture in the study of Daniel's 70 weeks, which is the reason I ask.


Thanks, JLB

 

[th1b.taylor]

I don't like called the ot, old, its not OLD. its the bible.

I have been teaching the Old Testament of the Christian Bible to be a misnomer for a couple of decades now and that the only God authored Life Application Commentary on the Bible is misnamed the New testament. So I wish you well getting people to understand the obvious, I've not had much success on that.

 

[Mike]

With this being Matthew's opening statement, I've always seen it as a contectual "case for Christ". Ending quickly in one chapter with the arrival of Jesus, he addresses the notion that you should doubt the historisuty of the miracle birth simply on the basis that miracles do not happen. That's what I see in the opening lineage, anyway.

Here is the lineage of Christ from David to Joseph. Now, keep your hands in the car, and enjoy the ride. Jason, I know you can speak much more to the importance of the lineage to Matthew's target audience. Can you, and/or anyone else expound on that?

 

[jasonc]

With this being Matthew's opening statement, I've always seen it as a contectual "case for Christ". Ending quickly in one chapter with the arrival of Jesus, he addresses the notion that you should doubt the historisuty of the miracle birth simply on the basis that miracles do not happen. That's what I see in the opening lineage, anyway.

Here is the lineage of Christ from David to Joseph. Now, keep your hands in the car, and enjoy the ride. Jason, I know you can speak much more to the importance of the lineage to Matthew's target audience. Can you, and/or anyone else expound on that?

I want to focus on the person and the Lord's use of sinner for his glory and the saints failures. we are woven in a plan for God's glory. have you all listened to Gregg Laurie's interview with Dr. James Dobson. He mentions(Dobson) his dad praying to be used to reach millions, God tells him , by your son it shall be. simply by raising his son he reached millions. we sometimes look for the big way but its the simple and small thing that God wants us to do and uses.

 

[jasonc]

I'm not sure jasonc, I'm just repeating what I had read long ago. This is where I need your expertise.

I will look.

 

[Deborah13]

I will look.

It's numerology. If I remember correctly it is used in Kabblah (sp?) practices.

 

[jasonc]

It's numerology. If I remember correctly it is used in Kabblah (sp?) practices.

gemera predates the kaballah by about 300 or more years. I believe the ramban started that idea as it is today.

 

[Deborah13]

gemera predates the kaballah by about 300 or more years. I believe the ramban started that idea as it is today.

Yes, I think it was originally Babylonian.