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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
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Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
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How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
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Bible Study WELCOME TO AN IN DEPTH STUDY OF MATTHEW'S GOSPEL.
- Thread starter Chopper
- Start date
th1b.taylor
Member
Very good commentary, Reba. For the life of me I cannot, to this day, understand one reading the scriptures and not connecting the dots, therein.
I do realize the acceptable sin inside the Church Membership but it does appall me that wer have gotten there. I so often point folks to John 1:1-5 that I'm not sure it doesn't bore people but there is such a key therein. The Ten Commandments, so often tossed into File 13, are the Ten Commandments of Jesus and as you point out, if we are to believe Jesus to be the example we are to strive for, we must never forget how important all the commands of Jesus are to all of us.
th1b.taylor
Member
Interesting Chopper, I have never downloaded Gil into my e-Sword nor into one of my Linux study programs but he seems to make sense.
Deborah13
Member
I won't promise to do that but I will consider it. Remember you promised to help with that.
My time is rather erratic these days now that Jake is home schooled. The teacher online is great but keeping the monkey focused and working is another issue.
2 But I can't complain it's lots of fun, too.
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Chopper
Member
Yea, that's something to think about! I'm afraid that some folk believe there is a difference between God's Commands and Jesus'. Dumb! Dumb! Anyway,
Chopper
Member
Deb13 and I like John Gill very much. He seems to be very accurate and writes so I can understand.
Chopper
Member
I won't promise to do that but I will consider it. Remember you promised to help with that.
My time is rather erratic these days now that Jake is home schooled. The teacher online is great but keeping the monkey focused and working is another issue.
I'm so glad that you're home schooling. My Daughter home schooled her 5 children. They turned out great, and they all are in college....I you go ahead with that thread, I promise to help, even when you can't post because of being busy, I jump in and help. I believe your ides of a thread about said decline will be a great one. If only our President would get involved.
Deborah13
Member
Well, I don't throw any of the Bible in File 13. Neither do I claim to follow the 10 or even try to follow them. I don't observe the 7th day Sabbath, neither do I observe all the feast days as laid out by God through the mediator of the 10, Moses. So I know I do not follow the tables of the covenant given at Mt Sinai. If I tried to tell a Jew or even a Messianic that I do they would either call me a liar or tell me I just don't know what I am talking about. Been there done that.
th1b.taylor
Member
Deb,
You pointed that at me with the quote but I do pray that is not your intention, I have accused you of nothing but by inference yoyu accuse me?
Deborah13
Member
I am not accusing you of anything. I am simply stating my point of view. If we were sitting in the same room together I would state my opinion just the same and I would look you start in the eye when I did that. A Bible study conversation is like that, is it not? If you see something in my statement that you have an opinion about I can assure you that I will not be offended. As long as you don't tell me I'm a heretic or say that I am not a follower of our Lord.
So no accusation against you is intended. I hope you can understand that.
you mean the 613 laws of moses. all of them were given by god to him.not just the ten.
th1b.taylor
Member
When Jesus live here He set the example, the model, we are to follow and though some have and always will debate the usefulness of any of the Jewish Bible, the facts are plain, it is Jesus we are to strive to become like, that we might live a successful life and when we study the four gospel accounts we find that the life of Jesus was so modeled after the Laws and the customs of the Jewish people that even the removal of his fore-skin was done on the proper day, in the proper manner.
Again, if we read John 1:1-3 we see that Jesus has always been and everything we see, He created. Jesus told us, and I agree, that if we love Him we will obey His Commands. The coveted Ten Commandments and, honestly, the other 603 examples of how to implement the Ten, are the Commands of my LORD. These commands were never meant to save a single person.
When Adam sinned, mankind, like it or not, inherited the sinful nature of our forefather and mom. God/Jesus never expected anyone to live a perfect life, He above any other knew we can not because of our inheritance. But, and there is that monster three letter word, but, if we are to ever attempt to follow Jesus we must learn from our teachers and the Ten, molded down to the Two in the Gospel accounts, are our teacher of what is sin. Without that knowledge we can never glorify God.
Folks have, since the first time I taught the Ten Commandments were, as Paul pointed out, our Teacher of Sin, have tried to slam the table with I am not bound by or I do not live under, the Ten Commandments. This is, as we said when I played High School Basketball, trash talk. It has nothing to do, in this case with what I was teaching. I do not live under my First Grade Teacher but at the same time I live on and by the principals she taught me. The same is true of the other seen grades I managed to live through. Teacher are to instruct, nothi8ng more and so it is with the Ten Commandments.
Again, if we read John 1:1-3 we see that Jesus has always been and everything we see, He created. Jesus told us, and I agree, that if we love Him we will obey His Commands. The coveted Ten Commandments and, honestly, the other 603 examples of how to implement the Ten, are the Commands of my LORD. These commands were never meant to save a single person.
When Adam sinned, mankind, like it or not, inherited the sinful nature of our forefather and mom. God/Jesus never expected anyone to live a perfect life, He above any other knew we can not because of our inheritance. But, and there is that monster three letter word, but, if we are to ever attempt to follow Jesus we must learn from our teachers and the Ten, molded down to the Two in the Gospel accounts, are our teacher of what is sin. Without that knowledge we can never glorify God.
Folks have, since the first time I taught the Ten Commandments were, as Paul pointed out, our Teacher of Sin, have tried to slam the table with I am not bound by or I do not live under, the Ten Commandments. This is, as we said when I played High School Basketball, trash talk. It has nothing to do, in this case with what I was teaching. I do not live under my First Grade Teacher but at the same time I live on and by the principals she taught me. The same is true of the other seen grades I managed to live through. Teacher are to instruct, nothi8ng more and so it is with the Ten Commandments.
Deborah13
Member
Yes, all 613 were given to Moses by God and he was the mediator of all of them. I was thinking of these particular of scriptures and those like them.
YLT
Deu_4:13 and He declareth to you His covenant, which He hath commanded you to do, the Ten Matters, and He writeth them upon two tables of stone.
Deu_9:9 `In my going up into the mount to receive the tables of stone (tables of the covenant which Jehovah hath made with you), and I abide in the mount forty days and forty nights; bread I have not eaten, and water I have not drunk;
Deu_9:15 `And I turn, and come down from the mount, and the mount is burning with fire, and the two tables of the covenant on my two hands,
Sorry about the name of God being spelled incorrectly and therefore pronounced incorrectly, those Germans did that. :neutral
Mat 5:21 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
Mat 5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
Seems to me Jesus is getting into the spirit of the law.... getting into matters of our hearts...
Mat 5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
Seems to me Jesus is getting into the spirit of the law.... getting into matters of our hearts...
Deborah13
Member
"......But, even so, even though Jesus was a better example of law, He was purer, clearer, more dynamic manifestation and embodiment of the law of God, a better pattern to follow, that didn't help either...because we can't follow His life. We can't live the way He lived. To have a perfect example may make the law more clear, but that only makes us more guilty. Right? You know, those Jews living under the Old Testament law, they tolerated the law. They didn't try to obliterate the law. They adjusted it. They tweaked it. They changed it. They altered it. They amended it. They added to it. Took away from it. Massaged it. Manipulated it, and got it into a comfortable zone. And then they credited themselves for keeping it. Right? This was the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees.
And then Jesus came along and just obliterated their comfort zone. "Do you think you're keeping the law? You're not. If you're gonna enter into God's Kingdom, you're gonna have to have a righteousness that exceeds the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees...You're gonna have to be as perfect as God in Heaven is perfect, and I'm gonna redefine your idea of perfect. It's not about not killing, it's about not hating also. It's not about not committing adultery, it's about not thinking about it." And He went on from there. And He was more intimidating. They could tolerate and tweak the written law. They couldn't tolerate and tweak Jesus, so they killed Him. Too intimidating. Too confrontive......"
http://www.gty.org/resources/sermons/80-286/written-on-the-heart
This quote is from a sermon by John MacArthur
And then Jesus came along and just obliterated their comfort zone. "Do you think you're keeping the law? You're not. If you're gonna enter into God's Kingdom, you're gonna have to have a righteousness that exceeds the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees...You're gonna have to be as perfect as God in Heaven is perfect, and I'm gonna redefine your idea of perfect. It's not about not killing, it's about not hating also. It's not about not committing adultery, it's about not thinking about it." And He went on from there. And He was more intimidating. They could tolerate and tweak the written law. They couldn't tolerate and tweak Jesus, so they killed Him. Too intimidating. Too confrontive......"
http://www.gty.org/resources/sermons/80-286/written-on-the-heart
This quote is from a sermon by John MacArthur
Chopper
Member
Day 42 Friday 10/24/14 Matthew 5:21,22 Murder & Hell Fire.
Matthew 5:21 "Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment."
What the Law said and how the Rabbinical teachers interpreted them, were two different matters. Jesus' focus at this point is to teach the Truth. I think, in this case of murder, kill, Jesus is only interested in the motive of the person committing the crime.
The sixth Commandment, "thou shalt not kill." apparently was not good enough for the Sanhedrin, they felt it necessary to interpret it. They added, "and whosoever....judgment". Jesus says in V.22 "but I say unto you". The "but" is in reference to what the Sanhedrin had taught and added to the sixth Command. Jesus, being the Author of the Commandments, gives the true interpretation.
IMO, Jesus is saying that if anyone is angry enough to kill another human, his judgment would be the same as if he did it. Our Lord sees our heart.I am reminded how important is my thinking. I see Romans 12:2 "And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God." So, "this world" is how I thought until I was Born Again. In this world, I was used to being angry enough to inflict bodily harm to another individual. BUT, now that I am born again, I must study verses like we are studying so that I no longer think like the world, but my mind is continually being "renewed".
Matthew 5:22 "But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire."
Raca - This is a Syriac word, expressive of great contempt. It comes from a verb signifying to be empty, vain; and hence, as a word of contempt, denotes senseless, stupid, shallow-brains. Jesus teaches here that to use such words is a violation of the spirit of the sixth commandment, and if indulged, may lead to a more open and dreadful infraction of that law. Children should learn that to use such words is highly offensive to God, for we must give an account for every idle word which we speak in the day of judgment, Matthew 12:36. (Albert Barnes, e-Sword). Words like raca, come from a mind that could kill.
Fool -
μωρός
mōros
mo-ros'
Probably form the base of G3466; dull or stupid (as if shut up), that is, heedless, (morally) blockhead, (apparently) absurd: - fool (-ish, X -ishness).
Oh my! I am convicted of what is in my mind concerning others. I do need to be more careful how much I need to put down any thought of using this kind of attitude toward my Brothers and Sisters. This also reminds me to be very careful how I respond to someone here who post in a thread and who disagree with me, what do I first think? "why that dumb, dumb, are they stupid or what?" THAT CAN NO LONGER BE OUR THINKING!
Matthew 5:21 "Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment."
What the Law said and how the Rabbinical teachers interpreted them, were two different matters. Jesus' focus at this point is to teach the Truth. I think, in this case of murder, kill, Jesus is only interested in the motive of the person committing the crime.
The sixth Commandment, "thou shalt not kill." apparently was not good enough for the Sanhedrin, they felt it necessary to interpret it. They added, "and whosoever....judgment". Jesus says in V.22 "but I say unto you". The "but" is in reference to what the Sanhedrin had taught and added to the sixth Command. Jesus, being the Author of the Commandments, gives the true interpretation.
IMO, Jesus is saying that if anyone is angry enough to kill another human, his judgment would be the same as if he did it. Our Lord sees our heart.I am reminded how important is my thinking. I see Romans 12:2 "And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God." So, "this world" is how I thought until I was Born Again. In this world, I was used to being angry enough to inflict bodily harm to another individual. BUT, now that I am born again, I must study verses like we are studying so that I no longer think like the world, but my mind is continually being "renewed".
Matthew 5:22 "But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire."
Raca - This is a Syriac word, expressive of great contempt. It comes from a verb signifying to be empty, vain; and hence, as a word of contempt, denotes senseless, stupid, shallow-brains. Jesus teaches here that to use such words is a violation of the spirit of the sixth commandment, and if indulged, may lead to a more open and dreadful infraction of that law. Children should learn that to use such words is highly offensive to God, for we must give an account for every idle word which we speak in the day of judgment, Matthew 12:36. (Albert Barnes, e-Sword). Words like raca, come from a mind that could kill.
Fool -
μωρός
mōros
mo-ros'
Probably form the base of G3466; dull or stupid (as if shut up), that is, heedless, (morally) blockhead, (apparently) absurd: - fool (-ish, X -ishness).
Oh my! I am convicted of what is in my mind concerning others. I do need to be more careful how much I need to put down any thought of using this kind of attitude toward my Brothers and Sisters. This also reminds me to be very careful how I respond to someone here who post in a thread and who disagree with me, what do I first think? "why that dumb, dumb, are they stupid or what?" THAT CAN NO LONGER BE OUR THINKING!
ezrider
Member
Chopper,
I would like to share with you and others a slightly different take on these passages. Many people take these scriptures and then simply use them to claim that Jesus equated hating your brother as equal with killing someone, and it has become just another in the long litany of sins that we use to judge others by. But there is more to the instruction of Jesus than to just identify additional sin that you make know it, but rather his instruction asks you to consider the root of the evil, which is hatred. If we can identify and understand what it is about our flesh nature that compels us to hate one another, or what buttons someone may be pushing that causes us us to react in a manner that we do not desire, then the Lord is able to change our hearts so that we may be able to show forth mercy instead of hatred in those situations. A man who is aware of his own weakness, and embraces them so that hatred can no longer consume him should never be in danger of loosing their mind to the point of killing someone.
Now I have another thought that I would like you to consider Chopper. You have confessed that you have harbored ill feelings toward those who would be your brethren, as I can most assuredly say we all have harbored the same sentiments at one time or another. But in your own study and meditation with the Lord, it was the Spirit of the Lord that convicted you in your heart and mind; and because of this you are conscious of this in your spirit, so that the Lord will work to change your heart and mind so instead of hating them for the reasons the flesh would well up in us, we instead can have the compassion and mercy on them that comes from the Spirit instead.
But what I want you to consider and meditate on for a moment: How would you have responded had some individual come up to you and said why do you hate me: You know you are breaking the law of God, you committed a sin and are in danger of the judgement, you are nothing but a hypocrite? How would you receive that kind of judgement from one of your brethren? Would this have caused you to have a change of heart in the same manner as you would when you know that it is the Spirit of the Lord has convicted you? When someone judges another in what they consider to be a sin, they do so after the manner of the flesh, and in response our own flesh become defensive which only serves to harden our hearts. So how can we have a change of heart in these matters if type of judgement given can only hardened our hearts instead?
Through the grace of the Lord, his judgement does not bring wrath that we might harden our hearts, but rather his judgement brings forth instruction that we might learn and grow thereby. As it is written, Good and upright is the Lord; therefor he shall teach sinners in the way.
Chopper
Member
Thank you so much ezrider. I receive your post with a glad heart. I used to be extremely guilty in this area. I don't like to glorify my sin, so I'll just say that "road rage" was a big, dark hole that I used to fall into without giving it much thought until the incident was over. Then I felt terrible. I found in the past that a spontaneous action of another driver, lets say, cutting me off on the freeway, I went into a rage. I can't tell you of the many times I spent on my knees begging God to deliver me from this terrible sin. I can't remember when, but one day I was headed to work, and a lady almost hit the front of my truck as she tried to merge into traffic right in front of me. I simply slowed down to give her room, she waved to thank me, and did that make me feel good. I praised the Lord that He had worked in my life to deliver me. Ever since that day, I have been a much better driver. I even obey speed limits, come to a full stop at stop signs etc. Boy, when God delivered me from road rage, He threw in a bunch of other laws that He wanted me to obey and gave me the desire to obey them with a glad heart. It feels wonderful to know that I am pleasing my Lord instead of grieving Him.
I say all of this to compliment you on your post. What you said is the absolute truth. Thank you so much for the wisdom God has given to you and your willingness to share it.
I say all of this to compliment you on your post. What you said is the absolute truth. Thank you so much for the wisdom God has given to you and your willingness to share it.