What did Jesus tell us to do, and are we doing it?

[john darling]

I'm creating this thread as a result of an ongoing discussion about doing the works of God. In that discussion it seemed there was no disagreement about the need to obey Jesus so it got me wondering if there should be more to the discussion. Like, if we agree that it's necessary to obey, then the next step seems to be to discuss what it is that we are meant to obey.

In luke 6:46 Jesus asks, "Why do you call me 'Lord, Lord' but do not obey me"? I don't want to set an unecessarily negative tone to the discussion by starting with this teaching. I bring it up because it sets a context. Jesus' teachings were radical, life changing and extreme. In many cases he felt a need to give his teachings in the form of a command, probably because he knew that we would be slow to just naturally recognize the need to apply his teachings. When it comes to change we often react in fear, anger, or generally find some way to avoid it.

I'm also talking about teachings which express general spiritual guidelines. God may tell 5 different Christains to preach in 5 different ways, but he still expects them to preach. He may tell them to go to 5 different places, but he still expects them to go etc. These are teachings which represent the foundation of the values of the Kingdom of Heaven. They apply to anyone who would follow Jesus. God may lead us to express them in different ways, but untimately they do need to be obeyed.

I'll post a list of example teachings which are given as commands (i.e. Jesus expected us to do them). What do you all think about this list? Is there any teaching in particular which anyone feels up to discussing?

1. Obey my commandments - John 14:15, John 14:21, John 14:23; 2 John 6

2. Love God and others - John 15:12, Matthew 22:37-40

3. Go and preach to all the world - Mark 16:15, Matthew 28:19

4. Don't delay, do it now - John 4:35, John 9:4, John 12:35

5. Take nothing for your journey - Luke 9:3, Luke 10:4

6. Don't work for food - John 6:27, Matthew 6:24-33, Luke 12:29

7. Work for me & my kingdom - Matthew 11:28-30, Luke 12:31

8. Sell all that you own - Luke 11:41, Luke 12:33, Luke 18:22

9. Don't store things that you're not using - Matthew 6:19

10. Don't charge for what you do - Matthew 10:8

11. Give to God what belongs to God - Luke 20:25, Matthew 22:21

12. Don't waste time on argumentative people - Matthew 7:6

13. Invite the poor to eat with you - Luke 14:12-14

14. Give to anyone who asks - Luke 6:30, Mark 6:37

15. If you pray, fast, or give, do it secretly - Matthew 6:1-11

16. Don't use vain repetitions when praying - Matthew 6:7

17. Don't advertise healings - Matthew 9:30, Matthew 12:16

18. Take the lowest position in meetings - Luke 14:8-10

19. Don't be called Father, Mister, etc. - Matthew 23:9-10

20. Beware of hypocrisy and greed - Luke 12:1, 15

21. Take up your cross and follow me - Mark 8:34

22. Live in me, and live in my love - John 15:4, 9

23. Eat whatever people give you - Luke 10:7

24. Rejoice when you are persecuted - Luke 6:23

25. Move to another city if persecuted - Matthew 10:23

26. Love, bless, and pray for your enemies - Luke 6:27-29

27. Do to others as you'd have them do to you - Luke 6:31

28. Be agreeable with your adversaries - Luke 12:58, Matthew 5:25

29. Forgive others - Mark 11:25-26, Matthew 6:12, Luke 6:37

30. Cut off your hand if it offends you - Mark 9:43

31. Don't be afraid of people - Luke 12:4-5

32. Let the dead bury the dead - Matthew 8:22

33. Rebuke a brother if he sins - Luke 17:3, Matthew 18:15-17

34. When you judge, do it fairly - John 7:24

35. You must be born again- John 3:3, Luke 18:17, Mark 10:15

36. Don't make promises for any reason - Matthew 5:34-37

37. Don't sell things in God's house - John 2:16

38. Don't forbid others to preach Christ - Luke 9:50

39. Teach all nations to obey these rules - Matthew 28:20

40. When you have done all these things, say, "We have only done that which was our duty to do." - Luke 17:10

 

[childeye]

I realize your intention is to exhort one another to walk in Christ. In all honesty, I don't think I can accomplish all of these things just by putting them on my day calendar. In my view, all of these thing have to be orchestrated by the Holy Spirit. We have only one thing to do therefore, and it is to follow His lead. Hearing God's voice is therefore more important to me. If I am inattentive, I may think I'm doing God's will, and yet I am only following my own agenda without any anointing. Do you think that is possible?
1 John 2:27
But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.
Matthew 7:22-24King James Version (KJV)
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

 

[john darling]

Hearing God's voice is therefore more important to me

Sorry, I don't understand what you mean. More important than what? The context is that I am talking about obeying Jesus' teachings. You say that hearing God's voice is "more important". To me it looks like you are saying that hearing from God is more important than obeying Jesus. Can you please clarify?

 

[Ph8th]

Brother I think 19 should read call no man father and don't have others address you as master.......# 17 made me pause I do not think we are not to profess and give testimony of Gods miracles, healings or blessinga He bestows (God does nothing in secret). I think Jesus s request was due to His issues with the people at that time.
At first glance these stuck out

peter

 

[childeye]

Sorry, I don't understand what you mean. More important than what? The context is that I am talking about obeying Jesus' teachings. You say that hearing God's voice is "more important". To me it looks like you are saying that hearing from God is more important than obeying Jesus. Can you please clarify?

Mark 1:8.
My point is that God's voice, is the voice of the Holy Spirit within us, which is why I posted this scripture, 1 John 2:27. He is our Truth through which we are led in Christ. In my walk, I try to hear what Christ would have me do on a moment by moment basis. I don't look into scripture to see what I should be doing every second of my life. I follow his voice. John 10:4.

 

[john darling]

My point is that God's voice, is the voice of the Holy Spirit within us, which is why I posted this scripture, 1 John 2:27. He is our Truth through which we are led in Christ.

I'm still not sure how you are applying all this to obedience to the teachings of Jesus which I listed above. Are you saying God's spirit does not lead you to obey those teachings? Please try to be very clear so there is no misunderstanding. What do you think of the commands of Jesus which I've listed?

 

[john darling]

Brother I think 19 should read call no man father and don't have others address you as master

Hi Ph8th. Thanks for your response. "Mister" is another form of "master" just like "Sir" is another form of "sire", which means "father".

# 17 made me pause I do not think we are not to profess and give testimony of Gods miracles, healings or blessinga He bestows (God does nothing in secret). I think Jesus s request was due to His issues with the people at that time.

Can you quote the reference to God not doing anything in secret? I think there may be some context to that teaching which is different to what Jesus said about not advertising healings. Aside from that, I think the teaching should be taken as a general rule, that there is a temptation to see the miracle rather than God. The fact that so many people disobeyed Jesus' instruction on this shows that he gave the instruction for good reason.

He also said, "an adulterous generation seeks a sign" (Matthew 16:4). Jesus wasn't shy about performing miracles, but he did insist they be done on his terms. Based on the abuses I've seen regarding miracles, I'd say Jesus knew exactly what he was talking about when he said that we should not advertise such miracles. We should pray for them and we should appreciate them, but we should not advertise them. There's something about advertising miracles which seems to distract people away from real faith.

 

[Ph8th]

In 19 matt 23:9 It States call no man father not Don't be called father.
17 I stand corrected Jesus said He spoke in public and not in secret..........So if it so that we are not to "advertise" What is testimony if not telling the world Of God in your life and by example. Didn't paul give testimony of being struck down being blind and being healed? Is it wrong for me to share healing I received from God? Isn't this our place in the world to be a light shinning in the darkness?
Revelation 12:11 (NASB)
11 And they overcame him because of the blood of the Lamb and because of the word of their testimony, and they did not love their life even [a]when faced with death.

 

[childeye]

I'm still not sure how you are applying all this to obedience to the teachings of Jesus which I listed above. Are you saying God's spirit does not lead you to obey those teachings?

Of course I'm not. Do you really think I'm saying that the Holy Spirit teaches something other than Christ? The Holy Spirit and Christ are of one accord, and not discord. I'm saying Jesus lives in me through the Holy Spirit, and I follow his voice in me, in my self. John 10:4. Psalm 23:4.

Please try to be very clear so there is no misunderstanding. What do you think of the commands of Jesus which I've listed?

I told you. I think there's a lot there. To be forthright, are you looking for some answer that says I don't delight in them? If you're testing the spirits here, that's cool. I do know scripture and the Holy Spirit do agree, if that is what you wish to hear.

 

[Brother Mike]

Hi Ph8th. Thanks for your response. "Mister" is another form of "master" just like "Sir" is another form of "sire", which means "father".



Can you quote the reference to God not doing anything in secret? I think there may be some context to that teaching which is different to what Jesus said about not advertising healings. Aside from that, I think the teaching should be taken as a general rule, that there is a temptation to see the miracle rather than God. The fact that so many people disobeyed Jesus' instruction on this shows that he gave the instruction for good reason.

He also said, "an adulterous generation seeks a sign" (Matthew 16:4). Jesus wasn't shy about performing miracles, but he did insist they be done on his terms. Based on the abuses I've seen regarding miracles, I'd say Jesus knew exactly what he was talking about when he said that we should not advertise such miracles. We should pray for them and we should appreciate them, but we should not advertise them. There's something about advertising miracles which seems to distract people away from real faith.

Not only did you get some of them wrong "Like take nothing for your Journey" You left out most of everything in the great commission.

And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
(Mar 16:15-18)

You lay hands on the sick? Cast out devils? Speak in new tongues? or you just posting what you are able to believe?

Healing made known:

Jesus did not say, don't advertise Healing. In fact in some places he told them to go tell, and in once case told them to go show themselves to the priest. You don't take one thing, and skip 5 other scriptures. There are reason he said what He said, and in both cases it's this.

Then the Pharisees went out, and held a council against him, how they might destroy him. But when Jesus knew it, he withdrew himself from thence: and great multitudes followed him, and he healed them all; And charged them that they should not make him known:
(Mat 12:14-16)

He asked them not to make him known since he left the area, not a word about not making the fact they were healed, and in both cases He is attempting not to stir up issues with the Pharisee's which are mentioned in both places.

Why did you post this? A bit more care in study would have be very helpful. Some of your points are good, but you leave out some major ones like getting people healed and set free, and to make it worse, it was right under go preach the gospel to every creature.

Mike.

 

[Abigail123]

I'm still not sure how you are applying all this to obedience to the teachings of Jesus which I listed above. Are you saying God's spirit does not lead you to obey those teachings? Please try to be very clear so there is no misunderstanding. What do you think of the commands of Jesus which I've listed?

Not to speak for childeye because I'm not exactly sure if he means the same as I do, but what is important is that we read the Word of God, it points us to Christ and in that we follow Him. We listen for his voice and we obey in that. It's not a check off list, it's a relationship that grows and develops over time and in this relationship, our will becomes more and more like the Father's and out of this comes our Fruit in obedience, actions, behaviors, etc.

A student becomes as their Teacher.

 

[childeye]

Not to speak for childeye because I'm not exactly sure if he means the same as I do, but what is important is that we read the Word of God, it points us to Christ and in that we follow Him. We listen for his voice and we obey in that. It's not a check off list, it's a relationship that grows and develops over time and in this relationship, our will becomes more and more like the Father's and out of this comes our Fruit in obedience, actions, behaviors, etc.

A student becomes as their Teacher.

For what it's worth, I think this is excellent., succinct.

 

[Free]

I'm creating this thread as a result of an ongoing discussion about doing the works of God. In that discussion it seemed there was no disagreement about the need to obey Jesus so it got me wondering if there should be more to the discussion. Like, if we agree that it's necessary to obey, then the next step seems to be to discuss what it is that we are meant to obey.

In luke 6:46 Jesus asks, "Why do you call me 'Lord, Lord' but do not obey me"? I don't want to set an unecessarily negative tone to the discussion by starting with this teaching. I bring it up because it sets a context. Jesus' teachings were radical, life changing and extreme. In many cases he felt a need to give his teachings in the form of a command, probably because he knew that we would be slow to just naturally recognize the need to apply his teachings. When it comes to change we often react in fear, anger, or generally find some way to avoid it.

I'm also talking about teachings which express general spiritual guidelines. God may tell 5 different Christains to preach in 5 different ways, but he still expects them to preach. He may tell them to go to 5 different places, but he still expects them to go etc. These are teachings which represent the foundation of the values of the Kingdom of Heaven. They apply to anyone who would follow Jesus. God may lead us to express them in different ways, but untimately they do need to be obeyed.

I'll post a list of example teachings which are given as commands (i.e. Jesus expected us to do them). What do you all think about this list? Is there any teaching in particular which anyone feels up to discussing?

1. Obey my commandments - John 14:15, John 14:21, John 14:23; 2 John 6

2. Love God and others - John 15:12, Matthew 22:37-40

3. Go and preach to all the world - Mark 16:15, Matthew 28:19

4. Don't delay, do it now - John 4:35, John 9:4, John 12:35

5. Take nothing for your journey - Luke 9:3, Luke 10:4

6. Don't work for food - John 6:27, Matthew 6:24-33, Luke 12:29

7. Work for me & my kingdom - Matthew 11:28-30, Luke 12:31

8. Sell all that you own - Luke 11:41, Luke 12:33, Luke 18:22

9. Don't store things that you're not using - Matthew 6:19

10. Don't charge for what you do - Matthew 10:8

11. Give to God what belongs to God - Luke 20:25, Matthew 22:21

12. Don't waste time on argumentative people - Matthew 7:6

13. Invite the poor to eat with you - Luke 14:12-14

14. Give to anyone who asks - Luke 6:30, Mark 6:37

15. If you pray, fast, or give, do it secretly - Matthew 6:1-11

16. Don't use vain repetitions when praying - Matthew 6:7

17. Don't advertise healings - Matthew 9:30, Matthew 12:16

18. Take the lowest position in meetings - Luke 14:8-10

19. Don't be called Father, Mister, etc. - Matthew 23:9-10

20. Beware of hypocrisy and greed - Luke 12:1, 15

21. Take up your cross and follow me - Mark 8:34

22. Live in me, and live in my love - John 15:4, 9

23. Eat whatever people give you - Luke 10:7

24. Rejoice when you are persecuted - Luke 6:23

25. Move to another city if persecuted - Matthew 10:23

26. Love, bless, and pray for your enemies - Luke 6:27-29

27. Do to others as you'd have them do to you - Luke 6:31

28. Be agreeable with your adversaries - Luke 12:58, Matthew 5:25

29. Forgive others - Mark 11:25-26, Matthew 6:12, Luke 6:37

30. Cut off your hand if it offends you - Mark 9:43

31. Don't be afraid of people - Luke 12:4-5

32. Let the dead bury the dead - Matthew 8:22

33. Rebuke a brother if he sins - Luke 17:3, Matthew 18:15-17

34. When you judge, do it fairly - John 7:24

35. You must be born again- John 3:3, Luke 18:17, Mark 10:15

36. Don't make promises for any reason - Matthew 5:34-37

37. Don't sell things in God's house - John 2:16

38. Don't forbid others to preach Christ - Luke 9:50

39. Teach all nations to obey these rules - Matthew 28:20

40. When you have done all these things, say, "We have only done that which was our duty to do." - Luke 17:10

What do you mean by points 5, 6, 7, 10, 28, and 32?

 

[Free]

Not only did you get some of them wrong "Like take nothing for your Journey" You left out most of everything in the great commission.

And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
(Mar 16:15-18)

You lay hands on the sick? Cast out devils? Speak in new tongues? or you just posting what you are able to believe?

Be careful in using anything in Mark 16:9-20 to support a point as they could very well be late additions to the text.

 

[Brother Mike]

Be careful in using anything in Mark 16:9-20 to support a point as they could very well be late additions to the text.

Thank you for the Heads up. I am aware of this. There are other passages concerning what some consider Trinity scripture they believe where added, and this one goes out by prayer and fasting. Some think the women who committed Adultery in John where Jesus drew in the sand is a added story. If we start removing things on our own, then where do we stop? I am sure you must have thought this also, as some think Paul's writings should be omitted, and James concerning Works should be omitted or at best was not written to us.

If they where added, who would have added them? Rome certainly did not believe in speaking in tongues and laying hands on the sick, and they are guilty for most of our additions.

I am just not comfortable with saying something is not scripture, even if I don't care for what it may imply.

Thank you for the heads up Free.

Mike.

 

[john darling]

I'm saying Jesus lives in me through the Holy Spirit, and I follow his voice in me, in my self. John 10:4. Psalm 23:4.

Ok. Following his voice. That's cool. How are you applying that to the list of teachings I've posted? See, the topic is, "what did Jesus tell us to do with life". We've established that obedience is necessary so now I'd like to talk about what we are meant to obey. I posted that list of teachings to give some examples to get things started.

I told you. I think there's a lot there

You say there's a lot there, but that doesn't really tell us what you think of the teachings in the context of obeying them.

 

[john darling]

In 19 matt 23:9 It States call no man father not Don't be called father.

Hi Ph8th. If we are not to call any man father then it logically makes sense that we should also not allow ourselves to be called father. Because we are all brothers and sisters in Christ we shouldn't use these special titles, even if we personally believe we have good intentions. Jesus said don't do it. He compared it to people who exalt themselves and people who humble themselves. The titles are about flattering one another. I know this because I have personal experience with trying to obey this teaching (Matthew 23:11-12). I've found that people almost always become intensely defensive of their right to be called by these special titles, especially parents.

I've also found there is a fair amount of fear and anxiety that comes with trying to obey this teaching. What will my family, friends, or employer think of me if I don't give them the special titles? As a result of these experiments I've discovered that Jesus knew exactly what he was talking about and that he did, indeed, intend for us to obey him.

So if it so that we are not to "advertise" What is testimony if not telling the world Of God in your life and by example. Didn't paul give testimony of being struck down being blind and being healed? Is it wrong for me to share healing I received from God? Isn't this our place in the world to be a light shinning in the darkness?

I think there is a difference between sharing a testitimony and advertising a healing. "Advertising" implies something like selling or promoting for a reason other than faith in God. Again, my personal experience has been that any time churches advertising healings, it's almost always because they want people to attend their church, which, in turn, brings in more tithes and of course popularity. When listening to the message of these churches I hear very little about a need to obey Jesus or even any teaching in general about the disciplines he taught.

Faith in God should not depend on miracles (Matthew 16:4).

 

[john darling]

what is important is that we read the Word of God, it points us to Christ and in that we follow Him. We listen for his voice and we obey in that. It's not a check off list, it's a relationship that grows and develops over time and in this relationship, our will becomes more and more like the Father's and out of this comes our Fruit in obedience, actions, behaviors, etc.

Hi Abigail. Thanks for posting. All of these points I agree with. We should read the word and listen to his voice. Jesus' teachings are not just a check list. Our relationships grow and develop over time. We become more like the father as a result of our fruit in obediece etc.

What I'm asking is, what do you think about obedience to the teachings of Jesus. Like, actually doing them? I posted the list in the OP to give some examples. Do you see anything there which you feel okay about doing? Do you see anything which is particularly challenging? It's not a trick question or anything. We have agreement that obedience is necessary so I'd like to talk about what it is that we are meant to obey and how we are meant to apply those teachings.

 

[john darling]

Not only did you get some of them wrong "Like take nothing for your Journey" You left out most of everything in the great commission.

How did I get the "take nothing for your journey" part wrong? Can you please clarify? Also, the list isn't meant to be comprehensive in that it would include every command of Jesus. It's a short list of what I believe are some of the more practical and relevant teachings. I believe all of Jesus' teachings are important, but for the sake of brevity I only posted 40 of them. I'm fine for you to bring up other teachings which you feel are important.

And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
(Mar 16:15-18)

There's only been one case where I've prayed for someone (along with other believers) to be delivered from what we thought to be some kind of demonic influence and had it work. If I experience another case of someone with such an influence, I'd be fine to lay hands on them and pray. As for healing the sick, I've never experienced a miraculous healing. I'm not saying they don't exist. I'm sure God does heal people. I've just never experiened it as a result of my praying. I have, however, experienced heaps of abuses with miraculous healing; people claiming they've been healed when they really haven't, presuming such a claim shows great faith etc.

Somehow lying about a healing has become a sign of great faith, which is probably why Jesus said not to advertise healings. I speak in tongues. I've never taken up a serpent but then again I can't see that the teaching is a command to tempt danger by handling serpents (Acts 28:3). If I've ever drunk any deadly thing I wouldn't know it since I'm still alive.

 

[john darling]

What do you mean by points 5, 6, 7, 10, 28, and 32?

Hi Free. I didn't give any meaning to those teachings. They are posted as quotes from Jesus. I think what I'm asking for is for other people to view the list and share their own personal conclusions as to what these teachings mean for them. So I hope you don't mind if I ask you, what do you think Jesus meant by points 5, 6, 7, 10, 28, and 32?