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What would you do

wondering said:
Hi Dirtfarmer,
I've thought of Romans 13:1-5 many times.
If the laws of the land do not agree with the laws of God, I'd have to say that the laws of God must be obeyed first.

Hitler did think he was God. So serving him was akin to serving a god.

If one was a soldier in his regime, he would not have had a choice not to follow the commands of his superior. How one would deal with such a situation, I do not know. I could say what I THINK I would have done, but I really will never know since I was not faced with that choice.

If I were a truck driver, however, and had the choice to quit --- then I would. No doubt about it.

I must say that I was rather horrified to read of the Milgram Experiment which civilwarbuff posted.

WHY would the teacher flip the switch? I don't think I could. I say think, because I truly feel we don't know what we would do in any situation until we were actually faced with it.
Click to expand...

The testee wasn't harmed...He was an actor. The actual test subject was the guy pushing the button.
What was appalling was how few refused to administer the shocks.

And when the day comes that Christians are vilified like the Jews were...Guess what?
 
JohnDB said:
The testee wasn't harmed...He was an actor. The actual test subject was the guy pushing the button.
What was appalling was how few refused to administer the shocks.

And when the day comes that Christians are vilified like the Jews were...Guess what?
Click to expand...
Yes, John.
I understand this.
That's why I was so horrified.
I would not have pushed the button. Of this I am certain.
The teacher wasn't even faced with death! So why do what the authority wanted?
I don't understand.

Many Christians could fall away from fear. The first Christians were so brave. I have to say that I don't know if I could be that brave.
 
wondering said:
Yes, John.
I understand this.
That's why I was so horrified.
I would not have pushed the button. Of this I am certain.
The teacher wasn't even faced with death! So why do what the authority wanted?
I don't understand.

Many Christians could fall away from fear. The first Christians were so brave. I have to say that I don't know if I could be that brave.
Click to expand...
Yeah,
Well I'm about to find out this summer.
I'm heading to a place where being a Christian is illegal. I could get accused of evangelism. I refuse to capitulate. It could get ugly or I may skate through. Dunno. Don't matter. Basically I view it as running and jumping off a cliff. I may fall or I may fly. God's choice.
 
dirtfarmer said:
hello abide, dirtfarmer here

I look at the question differently, I guess. Was the soldiers that killed each other right or correct in engaging in war that the leaders of their country declared? Or do the civil authorities have the right to inflick death to people who commit certain crimes against the populace? It is my belief that those that are elected to positions of authority in governments are so commissioned by God to carry out the laws of "the land" and will have much more to answer for.

Romans 13:1-5, " Let every soul be subject unto the higher power, for there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. Whosoever therefore resisteth the power resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation. For the rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same: For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid: for he beareth not the sword of God in vain: For he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil. Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake."

In Daniel 3 and "the 3 Hebrew children", which Eugene has mentioned, is about worship of another god. There is no ruler that has the power to constraint any one to worship anyone or any thing, other that the God that rules over his creation. Was Shindler wrong in his helping those that he did, I don't think so, because he was following his conscience, neither do I think that the truck driver that delivered people to the concentration camps was guilty. He was obeying a higher authority. Did the subjects of Nebuchadnezzar suffer the same fate as he, for seven years?

It is my belief that we should obey "the law of the land" if it doesn't require us to bow down and worship a god other that the true God.
Click to expand...
Unless a civil law crosses over the law or will of God, we are to be obedient to those civil laws.
 
JohnDB said:
Yeah,
Well I'm about to find out this summer.
I'm heading to a place where being a Christian is illegal. I could get accused of evangelism. I refuse to capitulate. It could get ugly or I may skate through. Dunno. Don't matter. Basically I view it as running and jumping off a cliff. I may fall or I may fly. God's choice.
Click to expand...
You're to be commended.
Those who do this type of work are truly brave persons working for the cause of Christ.

I'd like to say that some on these threads do not like to hear talk of works.
They say God does not ask us to do works.

I feel this is an insult to those who dedicate their lives to work, literally, for God.
 
wondering said:
You're to be commended.
Those who do this type of work are truly brave persons working for the cause of Christ.

I'd like to say that some on these threads do not like to hear talk of works.
They say God does not ask us to do works.

I feel this is an insult to those who dedicate their lives to work, literally, for God.
Click to expand...
I'm no where near the level of service that I'd like to be... Don't think that I can. There are so many that have done so much more and endured a lot of hardships for the cause of Christ. I'm a nobody by far comparison. But I can't sit and do nothing either. I am simply grateful for what God has done for me.

If someone bakes you a nice birthday cake. (When no one else would or could) so you say "Thanks" and let it rot on the counter and barely acknowledge the gift in the future? NO!
Most are really appreciative and always sing the giver's praises.

So...God has done a lot for me. Anything and everything for Him. No reservations or hold backs. I wish I could do more. He matters...I don't. I'm still not perfect...Far from it but He doesn't seem to mind. I think that He is nuts for wanting the likes of me...But again, who am I to argue? I tend to think I am a schmuck and not grateful enough. Maybe one day I can remove that stain...But it ain't going to be any time soon.
 
JohnDB said:
I'm no where near the level of service that I'd like to be... Don't think that I can. There are so many that have done so much more and endured a lot of hardships for the cause of Christ. I'm a nobody by far comparison. But I can't sit and do nothing either. I am simply grateful for what God has done for me.

If someone bakes you a nice birthday cake. (When no one else would or could) so you say "Thanks" and let it rot on the counter and barely acknowledge the gift in the future? NO!
Most are really appreciative and always sing the giver's praises.

So...God has done a lot for me. Anything and everything for Him. No reservations or hold backs. I wish I could do more. He matters...I don't. I'm still not perfect...Far from it but He doesn't seem to mind. I think that He is nuts for wanting the likes of me...But again, who am I to argue? I tend to think I am a schmuck and not grateful enough. Maybe one day I can remove that stain...But it ain't going to be any time soon.
Click to expand...
John,
Let me assure you that 98% has done less than you.
They say that only 2% of any church's population does all the work.

As far as stains...
What stain?
I don't see any stains.

God bless you.
 
reba said:
where would we be without Paul's works
Click to expand...
Reba,
I never even thought of this.
This also goes for all the Apostles --- and the early Christians who risked their lives and died for their love for God.
 
Last edited:
Oh, precious is the flow
That makes me white as snow
No other fount I know
Nothing but the blood of Jesus
Nothing but the blood of Jesus
 
wondering said:
John,
Let me assure you that 98% has done less than you.
They say that only 2% of any church's population does all the work.

As far as stains...
What stain?
I don't see any stains.

God bless you.
Click to expand...
To whom much is given much is required...
There is no rest for the wicked.
 
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