When does a believer receive eternal life?

[gr8grace3]

Those who keep making that false charge are referred to in the OT:
Ezek 12:2
"Son of man, you are living among a rebellious people. They have eyes to see but do not see and ears to hear but do not hear, for they are a rebellious people."

I agree. And the rebellious people are not out sinning all they want..........they are quitting sin and living clean lives and COUNTING on their good life.........and measure their salvation and ALL others salvation from their subjective 'curve.'

FreeGrace.......you got it going on and what a blessing we have here for your diligent study.

 

[Edward]

No this is not a works based salvation.

Are we not supposed to...build up our treasures in heaven? Are we not to try to take on the mind of Christ and walk as He did (does)?

Show me the scripture which we are to occupy...on our couch doing nothing...ok?

How about Isaiah 60:1

Is that not talking to us?

 

[th1b.taylor]

ok but what if i lean toward mid trib never the less not sure how this ties in to the o.p i just read my Bible/scriptures try do best i can with out man telling me what i should believe

That is all any any of us can do in these bodies after we wasted our youth trying to break our backs or to kill ourselves. I'll make a deal if you're willing. Regardless, Pre, Mid or Posttrib, I will wave to you as we ascend upward if you don't get upset and try to convert me. It is really not a Salvic Matter anyway, we just need to be ready to go every morning to go and remain that way all day. Oh, and don't forget to pray that we ar not Raptured in our Jamies. That would feel so awkward.

 

[gr8grace3]

No this is not a works based salvation.

Are we not supposed to...build up our treasures in heaven? Are we not to try to take on the mind of Christ and walk as He did (does)?

Show me the scripture which we are to occupy...on our couch doing nothing...ok?

How about Isaiah 60:1

Is that not talking to us?

If we sit on our couch and do nothing, we do not build up our treasures in heaven and do not grow in His grace and knowledge........so we will be LEAST in His kingdom, Rather than GREAT in His kingdom.

But all believers are going to be IN His Kingdom.John 10:28.

So when do we perish?John 10:28 says NEVER. I take Him at His Word.

 

[gr8grace3]

No this is not a works based salvation.

If we believe that salvation can be lost...............it is works based.

The only works based salvation that works.............Is a complete and utter trust in the Lord Jesus Christ's finished WORK on His Cross.

John 6:47~~New American Standard Bible
"Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes has eternal life.

 

[reba]

2 Samuel 12:1 So Yahweh sent Nathan to David, and he came to him and said, “Two men were in a certain city; one was rich and the other was poor. ​

Romans 8:26 And likewise also, the Spirit helps us in our weakness, for we do not know how to pray as one ought, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us with unexpressed groanings.​

Sounds like God intercedes for those are genuine believers who when we heard the word of truth, the gospel of our salvation, in whom also when we believed were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, who is the down payment of our inheritance, until the redemption of the possession, to the praise of his glory.

We all seem to read into scripture what we want to hear back... We dont know if David could have rejected Nathan. We dont know what would have happened had he.. all views are speculation except for what is written..We only know David acknowledged his sin..

 

[Edward]

If we sit on our couch and do nothing, we do not build up our treasures in heaven and do not grow in His grace and knowledge........so we will be LEAST in His kingdom, Rather than GREAT in His kingdom.

But all believers are going to be IN His Kingdom.John 10:28.

So when do we perish?John 10:28 says NEVER. I take Him at His Word.

Exactly. Arise, shine! Go forth and do something for the Kingdom...build up our treasures in heaven. Not everyone will get a mansion. Some will get greater rewards than others. I'm no Elijah, but I don't want to be the plumber up there either, Lol.

It talks about branches bearing no fruit being cast aside to be burned. It talks about if one does not put his talents to good use, that even what you have will be taken from you. FreeGrace seems so angry and accusing a lot of people of callig=ng Jesus a liar and bearing false witness against him and so forth...it makes me wonder exactly what he's trying to say?

It's like, oh you don't have to do any works, in fact you better not or you're into a works based salvation (which no one ever said)...so...what is he trying to say?

 

[Edward]

If we believe that salvation can be lost...............it is works based.

The only works based salvation that works.............Is a complete and utter trust in the Lord Jesus Christ's finished WORK on His Cross.

John 6:47~~New American Standard Bible
"Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes has eternal life.

Substantiate your first line there, please. Any scriptures? Or how do you come to that conclusion?

 

[Edward]

If we believe that salvation can be lost...............it is works based.

The only works based salvation that works.............Is a complete and utter trust in the Lord Jesus Christ's finished WORK on His Cross.

John 6:47~~New American Standard Bible
"Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes has eternal life.

I believe that we can, while abiding in Him...not produce much fruit and still be saved. But those who do not abide in Him, shall be cast aside as a branch to be burned. It all comes down to obeying Him and abiding in Him and doing the things which He says to do...If we turn away from Him, to live our own life...then we have abandoned God and returned to the world (and the vomit thereof)...And he will not commit Himself to us then.

Want an example in scripture of this?

John 2:23-25
23 Now when he was in Jerusalem at the passover, in the feast day, many believed in his name, when they saw the miracles which he did.

24 But Jesus did not commit himself unto them, because he knew all men,

25 And needed not that any should testify of man: for he knew what was in man.../

 

[Edward]

We all seem to read into scripture what we want to hear back... We dont know if David could have rejected Nathan. We dont know what would have happened had he.. all views are speculation except for what is written..We only know David acknowledged his sin..

I don't like reading that stuff about possibly being rejected by the Lord. Oh no...

 

[JLB]

And King David was already saved when he raped and murdered. And then under conviction, changed his mind about what he did.

How about those who were already saved and ended up thrown straight down to hell alive?

So they and all those with them went down alive into the pit; the earth closed over them, and they perished from among the assembly. Numbers 16:33

OSAS

 

[JLB]

You never answered my question about WHEN one actually receives the gift of eternal life, or what "end of their faith" means. And this is just another waffle.

I have many many times.

You either can't read or just willfully close your eyes to the truth.

Eternal life is given to those on the Day of Judgement when they have been judged according to their deeds.

God, who “will render to each one according to his deeds”:

Here it is again word for word -

eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality;

God, who “will render to each one according to his deeds”: eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—
indignation and wrath. Romans 2:6-8


JLB

 

[JLB]

It seems to me that what Jesus taught about eternal security isn't being believed in your view.

It seems your theology skips that fact that all of us will be judged according to our deeds.

God, who “will render to each one according to his deeds”: Romans 2:6

He will render eternal life to some based on their deeds.

He will render wrath and indignation to those who are self seeking and disobedient.


God, who “will render to each one according to his deeds”: eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath, Romans 2:6-8



JLB

 

[Papa Zoom]

Yeah. Who needs Jesus anyway! We've got our good works to save us. Eternal life based on deeds. Sorry Jesus. Ya didn't have to die after all!

 

[Papa Zoom]

But lets have another round of the same tireless arguments that fill this forum with mostly meaningless and worthless interpretations.

 

[ezra]

That is all any any of us can do in these bodies after we wasted our youth trying to break our backs or to kill ourselves. I'll make a deal if you're willing. Regardless, Pre, Mid or Posttrib, I will wave to you as we ascend upward if you don't get upset and try to convert me. It is really not a Salvic Matter anyway, we just need to be ready to go every morning to go and remain that way all day. Oh, and don't forget to pray that we ar not Raptured in our Jamies. That would feel so awkward.

i have no idea when it will happen

 

[ezra]

But lets have another round of the same tireless arguments that fill this forum with mostly meaningless and worthless interpretations.

the beating of the dead horse

 

[chessman]

We all seem to read into scripture what we want to hear back

I couldn't personally justify making such a claim for what all others seem to do. I think it's better to let the Text speak for itself. Which is why I asked when you thought believers receive eternal life (rather just assuming when you thought we receive eternal life) and what Text you used for your conclusion.

We dont know if David could have rejected Nathan.

We know that it is written that God specifically sent His prophet Nathan to David so that David would repent.

And we know God intercedes for those who are genuine believers who when we heard and believed were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, who is the down payment of our inheritance, until the redemption of the possession, to the praise of his glory.

We dont know what would have happened

We can read how long genuine Christ believers are sealed with His Spirit. Namely, until we are redeemed.

all views are speculation except for what is written.

True for human 'views'.

 

[FreeGrace]

the maintaining is to live the life walk the walk we have law vs grace the law is holy but does not save it only tells us right and wrong.

OK, we agree on this!!

Grace is a wonderful thing. we also have to throw mercy in there

Yes, 2 sides of the same coin!

mercy is asking God to forgive us Grace is the the forgiveness even though we are not worth to be technical jesus never used the words eternal security .he said eternal life.

To be technical, Jesus said those He gives eternal life shall never perish. If that's not about eternal security, I don't know what is.

With that said, He didn't have to say the word "eternal security". The words "shall never perish" ring loud and clear with me. But for some unclear reason, it doesn't even register to some. I cannot understand that.

i have stated many time i lean toward eternal security . i just simply do not believe in living how we want after salvation and saying we are saved.

That basically means (at least to me) that HOW we live after being saved (which means being given eternal life) is what keeps us saved.

its not in the scripture.

What Jesus said about never perishing IS in Scripture. John 10:28. He gave NO CONDITIONS on recipients of eternal life for never perishing.

i have studied this out and my belief is by my study and convictions .

Paul described eternal life as a gift of God in Rom 6:23. Then, in Rom 11:29, he said that God's gifts are irrevocable. Which exactly parallels what Jesus said about recipients in John 10:28.

iow, Jesus is the One who gives the gift of eternal life, per John 10:28. And since this gift is from God, and is therefore irrevocable, once given, recipients shall never perish. That is what Jesus said.

If HOW one lives after being given eternal life determines final destination, then it's really salvation by lifestyle.

Instead of OSAS, it would be better to say "once given eternal life, shall never perish". That is what Jesus said.

 

[FreeGrace]

alright it makes me no never mind { But Scripture does not teach that one who does such things will lose salvation. } i never said lose i said i doubt they was ever saved. once again my finial say a true child of God will come to his senses

Recall that King Saul never did come to his senses. And God killed him. So says 1 Chron 10:
13 Saul died because he was unfaithful to the LORD; he did not keep the word of the LORD and even consulted a medium for guidance,
14 and did not inquire of the LORD. So the LORD put him to death and turned the kingdom over to David son of Jesse.

Yet, what did the dead prophet Samuel, tell Saul in a seance the day before? "Tomorrow, you and your sons will be WITH ME".

Some like to 'splain it away by saying Samuel only meant that Saul would die the next and join Samuel "in the ground". But that is ridiculous, since no prophet of God would ever put emphasis on an empty body in the ground. When Samuel told Saul that Saul would join him the next day, he meant be where Samuel was, in Paradise.

This proves that Saul was saved, though he lived rather poorly.

..even though we been given the power to live it and walk it. we still fail all the more reason for Christ

Amen that!!