[_ Old Earth _] Where Does the Intelligence Come From?

[cupid dave]

My instinct was the 49's would win the superbowl

Also, we don't "arrive at birth". We "arrive" at conception (Biblically and scientifically). Funny how truth meshes both.

Nah...
That was your Intuition...

I meant that we "arrive" at the door of Reality when we are spanked on the bottom.

 

[chessman]

But Instinct tell us that something is teaching us things about the real world before we arrive at birth into it.

Then how come I had such a hard time passing World History?

 

[cupid dave]

Then how come I had such a hard time passing World History?

My intuition tells me that you cram before a test, hence have a cursory understanding of the subject, tend to go Blank during the test, and fail to remember the actual facts later on.

But, your Unconscious mind watches you doing this, and remembers the kind of fellow you are.
That mental facility tends NOT to "speak" to you while you are in your present Conscious State-of-Mind, but may be sending you subliminal messages in dreams and also communicating with numerous and various "Tells" to other people's' Unconsciousness things about you while you interact with them.

I believe many things we Unconsciously get to know about come to us through that facility AFTER we are born, too.

The Collective Unconscious mind, the sum of all the individual Unconscious minds on the planet, those minds that are active in the generation as a whole,... they "talk" to one another, not only by using subtle "Tells" when we are in contact with one another, but by the clairvoyance of direct "wireless" communications as evidenced in Electroencephalogy.

 

[Adam]

You guys are saying "In the absence of scientific explanation it is wishful thinking."

But Instinct tell us that something is teaching us things about the real world before we arrive at birth into it.

Now you are engaged in both wishful thinking and circular logic.

 

[Arch Angle]

as a point of fact he is not usingcircular logic.

Most of what animals know is "wired" in before birth. if you don'tknow the truth of this statement, then you shouldn't be commenting on it.

The question isn't "is it wired in?", it is how much is wired in.Look around, much of what we do is wired in.

Can you offer evidence that "nothing is wired in before birth?"

 

[cupid dave]

as a point of fact he is not usingcircular logic.

Most of what animals know is "wired" in before birth. if you don'tknow the truth of this statement, then you shouldn't be commenting on it.

The question isn't "is it wired in?", it is how much is wired in.Look around, much of what we do is wired in.

Can you offer evidence that "nothing is wired in before birth?"

Yeah.

And the point is that, when we split from the Ape with the 24 chromosome, by that Act-of-God that fused two together, and we evolved as the first man, one of 22 now extinct species that followed, all with only 23 Chromosomes, something wired us all differently.

Was the wire job the result of God's spirit or His Natural Laws, such that the Law of Probability merely chanced for this new wirering?
Or is that the evidence asked for, that change in the DNA which coud account for this wiring that enlarger and extended the duration of our Human Consciousness?

Is this a sound hypothesis, in an example of the Directed Evolution orchestrated by our own Unconscious mind at work behind the scenes???

 

[Adam]

Yeah.

And the point is that, when we split from the Ape with the 24 chromosome, by that Act-of-God that fused two together, and we evolved as the first man, one of 22 now extinct species that followed, all with only 23 Chromosomes, something wired us all differently.

None of those claims are true.

We didn't split from apes. We ARE apes.
A telemore fusion does not create a new species.
There are not 22 species of man.


Why do you keep claiming these as facts when it has been shown many different ways that your claims are not true?

 

[Sparkey]

The concept behind the Chromosome count is interesting (maybe). Let's look:
Wiki: List of organisms by chromosome count

 

[cupid dave]

I'm still not certain if these are genuine questions or rhetoric. I don't mind trying to give answers to them, but if that isn't the purpose then it would not be appropriate.

Yeah...

The title was "where does intelligence come from."

De facto of the definition for intelligence it comes from the mind.
It is a concept that requires some duration of consciousness and can be measured by how effectively it recognizes the truth about the reality wiyhin which is exists.

Wecan support this by IQ Tests which measure the validity (truthfulness) of responses to external stimulus or even dirst question posed to high animals and humans.

If one can accept this, for the sake of hearing my argument about where it comes from, then I would continue to define what I believe is the human "Urim and Thummim" at work as a pattern of thinking which leads one to image the truth inside one's mind.

 

[Adam]

Intelligence is in reference to one's ability to learn, not to the validity of one's "knowledge base."

Guilliford's cube is bunk science, btw.

 

[cupid dave]

The concept behind the Chromosome count is interesting (maybe). Let's look:
Wiki: List of organisms by chromosome count

Hmmm...

No life form was listed with 23 chromosomes, and the apes with 24 pairs were ommitted too.
What do you see in that grab bag list as important here?

Also, the more interesting list would contain ony examples where two chromosomes of one species mutated by an Act-of-God, naturally, and created a new species with one less chromosomes in number.
That would be interesting and informative.

 

[Sparkey]

The concept behind the Chromosome count is interesting (maybe). Let's look:
Wiki: List of organisms by chromosome count

Hmmm...

No life form was listed with 23 chromosomes, and the apes with 24 pairs were ommitted too.
What do you see in that grab bag list as important here?

What do I see there? Important or not, there is no direct correlation that may be made, or at minimum that I can find, between the number of diploid chromosomes and the categories set up by students who study life and its origins (biologists), said categories being sometimes called "species".

 

[chessman]

Note how this article (below) shows evidence of decline in human intelligence (not increase) due to foods, chemicals and gene mutations. But there's no real evidence for an increase due to purely materialistic means via gene mutations and NS above what might have an incremental ability to survive a new environment. Like skin color or minor physical effects. But the "brains" to build cellphones? Plus, even if there was a materialistic method, where are the hominids that could build at least the telegraph? There's good evidence that the homo Saipan Saipan arrived with or intelligence. We developed new tools and new technologies using our God given intelligence.

http://naturalsociety.com/leading-geneticist-human-intelligence-slowly-declining/

 

[cupid dave]

Note how this article (below) shows evidence of decline in human intelligence (not increase) due to foods, chemicals and gene mutations. But there's no real evidence for an increase due to purely materialistic means via gene mutations and NS above what might have an incremental ability to survive a new environment. Like skin color or minor physical effects. But the "brains" to build cellphones? Plus, even if there was a materialistic method, where are the hominids that could build at least the telegraph? There's good evidence that the homo Saipan Saipan arrived with or intelligence. We developed new tools and new technologies using our God given intelligence.

http://naturalsociety.com/leading-geneticist-human-intelligence-slowly-declining/

I believe in each of the 22 begats, men arrived with great intelligence that their ancestors.

I believe that God is still working that increase in our intelliegence because he is not done with us he creates new creatures in "god", or the Force of his evermore unfolding next frames of Reality.

 

[cupid dave]

What do I see there? Important or not, there is no direct correlation that may be made, or at minimum that I can find, between the number of diploid chromosomes and the categories set up by students who study life and its origins (biologists), said categories being sometimes called "species".

But what you didn;t see, because it isn;t there, is that the life forms with the same numerical numbers of Chromosomes do NOT have the same kind of Chromosomes.

In Ape and Humans, the same kind of chromosomes are present in rhem both, and the match is as close as 95% one-to-one, with only a difference in numbers, 24 inthe former and 23 in the latter.

What is also unnoticed at first, is that actually Humans do have 24 chromosomes, but two if them are stuck together at the middle which forms a set of very bigger chromosomes made from twice the DNA that would have gone into a 24th set.

 

[Adam]

In Ape and Humans, the same kind of chromosomes are present in rhem both, and the match is as close as 95% one-to-one, with only a difference in numbers, 24 inthe former and 23 in the latter.

What is also unnoticed at first, is that actually Humans do have 24 chromosomes, but two if them are stuck together at the middle which forms a set of very bigger chromosomes made from twice the DNA that would have gone into a 24th set.

No, that is incorrect

 

[Sparkey]

Yeah.

And the point is that, when we split from the Ape with the 24 chromosome, by that Act-of-God that fused two together, and we evolved as the first man, one of 22 now extinct species that followed, all with only 23 Chromosomes, something wired us all differently.

But what you didn;t see, because it isn;t there, is that the life forms with the same numerical numbers of Chromosomes do NOT have the same kind of Chromosomes.

In Ape and Humans, the same kind of chromosomes are present in rhem both, and the match is as close as 95% one-to-one, with only a difference in numbers, 24 inthe former and 23 in the latter.

What is also unnoticed at first, is that actually Humans do have 24 chromosomes, but two if them are stuck together at the middle which forms a set of very bigger chromosomes made from twice the DNA that would have gone into a 24th set.

I'm not going down a conversation about what has not been seen. Pardon, but I don't follow you. If God formed the 'adam (human) from the 'adamah (soil/dust)," means or is equal to, 'God fused us with-or-from apes' then all is lost here. Language may no longer be relied upon to communicate essential messages. Isn't this thread about the origin of intelligence?

 

[cupid dave]

If God formed the 'adam (human) from the 'adamah (soil/dust)," means, or is equal to, 'God fused us with-or-from apes' then all is lost here.

How so?

First, it is clear that the first man was an Act-of-God.
Like Jesus, man did not have a human father according to this statement that man is formed from "the dust of the earth."

Second, the "dust of the Earth" suggests atoms and the arena of the chemistry of conception.
I see nothing lost and a hole world of religion gained by understanding this bible report to inform us of a gnetic chemistry which produced a new species which only God made.

 

[Sparkey]

The opposite of "taking at face value" is to look for a hidden meaning or ulterior motives. Are they lying? Is this a trick? "Face value" means that there is nothing more than meets the eye and digging deeper isn't likely to reveal anything interesting.

To take something at face value is the believe that what the person is saying is truth and rather than looking for the hidden meaning...

Quotes by MrHen and Chitown143 in thread found at: English Language and Usage Forum

You seem to be saying that because "something interesting" might have been found (by you or others), this Scripture can not be taken at face value. I disagree with your assessment and am not satisfied with it. It doesn't fit. Soil or dust is clearly inanimate. The two concepts are in direct opposition to each other.

 

[cupid dave]

Intelligence comes from the accumulation of knowledge which has been gathered while under the State of Fear wherein during that now long pause before the free willed decision to either Fight or Flee, the external conditions of Reality have been observed in some depth.

Bad decisions tend to eliminate lower intellectually capable people which over time expresses a Direct Evolution wherein Intelligence about the Facts-of-Life increase.

Since the information input from the external world comes to us by means of the seven major senses, it makes sense that a Pattern to our decision making becomes rather fixed.
In fact, modern psychology has developed theories of Intelligence which explain that we think in seven multiple-intelligences.

But amendments to that initial theory have suggested that there remains another kind of Intelligence that is most likely rooted in the Unconscious mind which is expressed as Emotional Intelligence, sometimes also cal Natural Intelligence: