Bible Study Yahweh's Loving Instruction Thru The Torah.

[Chopper]

Hello (Shalom) my friends, I think we need to discuss the Torah. If I'm right, in coming against the popular notion that the Torah and the Commands of Moses are done away with when Grace came into being thru Christ Jesus, The loving instruction of the Elohim (Trinity) all the "Called Out One's" are missing out on the needed instruction of how to defeat Satan and his minions in our daily lives.

John 14:15 "If ye love me, keep my commandments." The Paleo Hebrew says, "If you love Me, you shall guard My Commands."....Strong's Concordance....
tēreō
tay-reh'-o
From τηρός teros (a watch; perhaps akin to G2334); to guard (from loss or injury, properly by keeping the eye upon

Someone will say "Moses' Law is obsolete now that Jesus Christ (Yahshua Ha` Mashiah) came and completed the Law." Now, that's correct, my friends (qodeshim). What I'd like to point out is a forgotten truth about Yashua is, where did Moses get the Law? Right!! Moses received the Law from Jesus (Yahshua)

The Old Testament (1st Covenant) and the New Testament (Renewed Covenant) were both written by inspiration thru Moses & the Apostles by the Author Yahshua ha` Mashiah. So, both Covenants were, in reality, written by Jesus, using different men. So, what's the difference?

The difference is how does a person received righteousness. In the 1st Covenant, righteousness came by adhering to the Law. Righteousness came to the Jew by "works" of their own. The problem was, no one could live up to all the Laws.

Yahshua came to fulfill the Law, which He did! And righteousness comes thru Him to all who are "called out ones" Who are drawn by the Holy Spirit (Ruah ha` Qodesh) to believe and trust in the Son of Yahweh. That person becomes righteous, only by receiving the righteousness of Jesus (Yahshua), not by works of the Law.

So, do we just cast away the Old Testament, NO!! Jesus wrote the Old Testament as well as the New. The first 5 Books of the O.T. are called the Torah. Remember, Jesus wrote the Torah. Why did He write those Books? Jesus (Yahshua) wrote what His Abba Father wanted. Abba Father gave forth "loving instruction" to His children to live responsibly to Him & our neighbors, and here's a big one, how to escape the traps of Satan & his minions.

If you've read this far, Bravo!! Thank you for putting up with what's been burning in my heart to instruct those who love Yahshua and who want to stay on the "narrow & straight path"

Within the Torah, there is so much godly instruction that helps us to stay on that narrow path that leads to LIFE. Yahshua is the Way, Truth, and Life. I have studied the Torah many times, and each time, Yahshua has revealed new wonderful instruction to me that draws me ever so close to my Abba Father's heart and His call to why He chose me to be His bond Servant to the sheep of His pasture.

Lastly, I hope my using of the Paleo Hebrew names and words don't irritate or confuse. There are so many modern western mind set names which derive from pagan origin that I'm trying to use and teach. Once I know that a name for our Elohim has a pagan origin, I'm responsible to use the names that YHWH used when He wrote on the tablets and gave them to Moses. they are the most ancient words known to mankind.

Thank you my friends, I love you all, and value you folk for who you really are, precious Saints that Abba Father and His Son paid the ultimate price on the cross to make you His.

 

[barelohim]

Matt 5::
21 Ye have heard that it was said to them of old time, Thou shalt not murder; and whosoever shall murder shall be in danger of the judgment:
22 but I say unto you, that every one who is angry with his brother shall be in danger of the judgment; and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council; and whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of the hell of fire.

27 Ye have heard that it was said, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
28 but I say unto you, that every one that looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

Again, ye have heard that it was said to them of old time, Thou shalt not forswear thyself, but shalt perform unto the Lord thine oaths:
34 but I say unto you, swear not at all; neither by the heaven, for it is the throne of God;
35 nor by the earth, for it is the footstool of his feet; nor by Jerusalem, for it is the city of the great King

38 Ye have heard that it was said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:
39 but I say unto you, resist not him that is evil: but whosoever smiteth thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.

43 Ye have heard that it was said, Thou shalt love thy neighbor, and hate thine enemy:
44 but I say unto you, love your enemies, and pray for them that persecute you;

I think one can understand the OT spoke in the "literal,: while the NT takes the "spiritual context..".

 

[jasonc]

Uhm,stating the importance of the torah and the Name of God.Does anyone see that ?

 

[Chopper]

Uhm,stating the importance of the torah and the Name of God.Does anyone see that ?

What's your point?

 

[barelohim]

What's your point?

Uh Chopper, we are the sons and daughters of the Lord Jesus. Now why would our father command us to do His bidding?

Wouldn't He know, that we know His authority over us as His children, and ask us to do the things He requires? Seems to me that you don't see Him as such a Father, Brother, Husband, Protector, Healer, etc, etc,.

" Why do you say that you love Me, and do not do as I have asked?"

 

[jasonc]

What's your point?

thou shall not take thy Lord's name in Vain. usually to avoid that Jews and the ancient ones wouldn't say the Name nor let alone write it. its why we have the Name Adonai, which is simply Hebrew for Lord. its not the Name given to Moses by God.

 

[Douglas Summers]

Hello (Shalom) my friends, I think we need to discuss the Torah. If I'm right, in coming against the popular notion that the Torah and the Commands of Moses are done away with when Grace came into being thru Christ Jesus,

The Law of Moses was a system including the sacrifices. The sacrifice are no longer practiced because Christ has fulfilled their type in actuality. But God never did away with the Ten Commandments, what He did was become the eternal sacrifice for us for the Commandments that condemned us. We do not do away with the Law, (But uphold the Law) (Rom. 3:31) letting it do what it was intended to do, and that was to condemn sin in sinful man, and in turn, send us to Christ. What Christ did, was to take us out from under the penalty of the Law (death) and put us under Law of God's grace in Jesus Christ (life) Giving us a New Covenant. (The Book of Hebrews)

 

[ezrider]

What Christ did, was to take us out from under the penalty of the Law (death) and put us under Law of God's grace in Jesus Christ (life) Giving us a New Covenant.

I would like to challenge your thought here a little. Jesus did not save us from the penalty of death. The grace we find in the Lord provides us the faith to accept our penalty of death in Christ, so that we might go onto a living Spirit. In Christ, we must learn to die to the law. The only way to do that is to accept our guilty before the law in every way. Jesus did not come to save us from the penalty of death. He saves us from the penalty of the second death.


As to the OP, how can the words of the book continue to provide instruction when the words of the book declare that the words of the book are sealed?

Who is blind as my servant, and as deaf as my messenger?

He who hath and ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith........

If we think we have eyes that see, then what is it that we see?

 

[Corn Pop]

I think I found Yeshuas real name.

"And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God."

2

 

[Douglas Summers]

I would like to challenge your thought here a little. Jesus did not save us from the penalty of death. The grace we find in the Lord provides us the faith to accept our penalty of death in Christ, so that we might go onto a living Spirit. In Christ, we must learn to die to the law. The only way to do that is to accept our guilty before the law in every way. Jesus did not come to save us from the penalty of death. He saves us from the penalty of the second death.
I think I know what you are saying ezrider, but why complicate it when the simplicity is in Christ (2 Cor. 11:3)


As to the OP, how can the words of the book continue to provide instruction when the words of the book declare that the words of the book are sealed? It is only sealed to the curious and idle. (Not the servants of God) Only Christ can break the seals, which is befitting of His Deity. (Revelation Chapter 5)

Who is blind as my servant, and as deaf as my messenger? I would add a few more of these ???? I don't understand the phrase?

He who hath and ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith........The new man has better hearing and eye sight than the old man (The renewing of the mind. (Romans 12:1-2)

If we think we have eyes that see, then what is it that we see?

As for me, I see several things: I see The Father in Jesus The Christ. The beauty and wonderment of creation, scarred and defaced by man, and I see hope in the promises of God in Jesus and a time of eternal peace coming soon.

 

[Chopper]

Uh Chopper, we are the sons and daughters of the Lord Jesus. Now why would our father command us to do His bidding?

Wouldn't He know, that we know His authority over us as His children, and ask us to do the things He requires? Seems to me that you don't see Him as such a Father, Brother, Husband, Protector, Healer, etc, etc,.

" Why do you say that you love Me, and do not do as I have asked?"

All that Elohim asks us to do in the Torah is to keep us on the narrow path which few ever find it and walk on it.

 

[th1b.taylor]

All that Elohim asks us to do in the Torah is to keep us on the narrow path which few ever find it and walk on it.

And actually that is no more difficult than what He asked of Adam.

 

[Chopper]

I would like to challenge your thought here a little. Jesus did not save us from the penalty of death. The grace we find in the Lord provides us the faith to accept our penalty of death in Christ, so that we might go onto a living Spirit. In Christ, we must learn to die to the law. The only way to do that is to accept our guilty before the law in every way. Jesus did not come to save us from the penalty of death. He saves us from the penalty of the second death.


As to the OP, how can the words of the book continue to provide instruction when the words of the book declare that the words of the book are sealed?

Who is blind as my servant, and as deaf as my messenger?

He who hath and ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith........

If we think we have eyes that see, then what is it that we see?

ez my friend. One question, when are the words of the book sealed? And are you referring to the Torah?

 

[ezrider]

ez my friend. One question, when are the words of the book sealed? And are you referring to the Torah?

The words of the book were sealed at the cross. The words of the book being sealed was declared by the Spirit on the day of Pentecost.

And yes, I am referring to the Torah as well. Paul plainly declares it when he states that there remains a vail upon the heart, even unto this day when the words of Moses are read, the vail remains upon their hearts. The words of the book are sealed, and only Christ is worthy to loose the seals thereof.

You speak of the Torah as God's loving instruction, but it would be wise to remember the lessons therein, for the children were fed manna from heaven, but when they gathered more then their portion, the manna rotted and became full of maggots. Such are the words of the book. You can allow the Lord to feed you your portion and be nourished by it, or you can gather it on your own and become poisoned by it.

The words of the book are sealed, yet the foolish virgins think they can find it from those who buy and sell, but as the prophets declare, in those days they shall run to and fro seeking the words of God, but they shall not find it.

The scripture states that the Law was our schoolmaster to lead us to Christ. But once we have come to Christ, we are no longer under the schoolmaster. The Law can only lead one to Christ, from that point on, it is the Spirit of Christ who leads us in Faith; not by the sight of the Law. If the Law is still our instruction, then are we yet under the schoolmaster, and we have not yet come to Christ in Faith.

 

[Chopper]

The Law of Moses was a system including the sacrifices. The sacrifice are no longer practiced because Christ has fulfilled their type in actuality. But God never did away with the Ten Commandments, what He did was become the eternal sacrifice for us for the Commandments that condemned us. We do not do away with the Law, (But uphold the Law) (Rom. 3:31) letting it do what it was intended to do, and that was to condemn sin in sinful man, and in turn, send us to Christ. What Christ did, was to take us out from under the penalty of the Law (death) and put us under Law of God's grace in Jesus Christ (life) Giving us a New Covenant. (The Book of Hebrews)

Thank you for your addition to this thread Douglas, I appreciate that. I believe we all know of the switch from being under the Law as Israel was under to TRY and obtain righteousness but failed. I like this verse to clarify my position....
Galatians 3:24 "Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto the Messiah, that we might be justified by faith.
3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster."

I'm trying to get folk to understand that Elohim's Law, Commandments, Statues & Rules are not all bad, in the sense of falling into the category of all those "schoolmaster" items are done away by our Savior's extended Grace the moment we get saved.

That which is done away with under the, as you put it, "The Law of God's grace" is only all the animal sacrifices that led to a temporary cleansing of Israel's transgressions until Christ Jesus would be crucified, shed His Blood for the permanent removal of their sins.

This is what I'm trying to teach....Other than the animal, bird, and grain sacrifices, Elohim's loving instruction's, listed in Torah are meant to be blessings to those who practice them. So, if we ignore them, thinking that they are done away because of Grace of our Savior, we miss out on a lot of our Saviors gifts and blessings of the Holy Spirit (Ruah ha` Qudesh).

I see two parts to the Torah. The best part is what Jesus (Yahshua), Just a reminder of Who actually caused Moses to write the Torah, loving instructions to help us "pitch our tent with Abba Father, and to have Him pitch His tent with us" (this is an old ancient Hebrew saying that today means, to "abide in Christ Jesus". I wonder if all my friends realize just how important it is to learn and adhere to all Jesus has for us to recognize these lost instructions.

There are the laws of sacrifices, animal etc. etc. for the temporary forgiveness of sins that have been cancelled in the sacrificial death on the cross and the shedding of His Blood, Jesus did away with the day of atonement which occurs with....
Romans 10:9 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Master Yahshua, and shalt believe in thine heart that Elohim hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation." (Word of Yahweh)

Romans 10:9 "because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved." (ESV)

The "Called Out Ones" (Christians) "day of atonement" occurs when they get saved!! and then instead of sacrificing an animal for forgiveness, we turn to....1John 1:9 "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."

Conclusion: Please understand that there are two aspects of the Torah (First five books of the O.T.) written by Jesus. 1. Loving instructions and laws of forgiveness of sins. The latter is done away with, and the loving instructions are kept for our enrichment in blessings. I don't know about you, I need all the blessings I can receive from the Godhead. I, each morning, pitch my tent with Abba Father, and He pitches His tent with me. HalleluuYah, O I praise His Kodesh (holy) Name.

 

[th1b.taylor]

When I read the Torah I see the picture of Jesus, a picture of what we are to strive to become like, Christ.

 

[Chopper]

thou shall not take thy Lord's name in Vain. usually to avoid that Jews and the ancient ones wouldn't say the Name nor let alone write it. its why we have the Name Adonai, which is simply Hebrew for Lord. its not the Name given to Moses by God.

There were Laws that YHWH Jesus gave to Moses, and laws that the Rabbi's proclaimed, re-interpreted from those Laws. One has to be careful which are being referred too, Laws or laws.

 

[jasonc]

There were Laws that YHWH Jesus gave to Moses, and laws that the Rabbi's proclaimed, re-interpreted from those Laws. One has to be careful which are being referred too, Laws or laws.

Those predate Jesus. The Word is jn 1.it comes from the Hebrew use of a name thar means and He spoke.it's used wherever the YHWH was used.

 

[Chopper]

The words of the book were sealed at the cross. The words of the book being sealed was declared by the Spirit on the day of Pentecost.

And yes, I am referring to the Torah as well. Paul plainly declares it when he states that there remains a vail upon the heart, even unto this day when the words of Moses are read, the vail remains upon their hearts. The words of the book are sealed, and only Christ is worthy to loose the seals thereof.

You speak of the Torah as God's loving instruction, but it would be wise to remember the lessons therein, for the children were fed manna from heaven, but when they gathered more then their portion, the manna rotted and became full of maggots. Such are the words of the book. You can allow the Lord to feed you your portion and be nourished by it, or you can gather it on your own and become poisoned by it.

The words of the book are sealed, yet the foolish virgins think they can find it from those who buy and sell, but as the prophets declare, in those days they shall run to and fro seeking the words of God, but they shall not find it.

The scripture states that the Law was our schoolmaster to lead us to Christ. But once we have come to Christ, we are no longer under the schoolmaster. The Law can only lead one to Christ, from that point on, it is the Spirit of Christ who leads us in Faith; not by the sight of the Law. If the Law is still our instruction, then are we yet under the schoolmaster, and we have not yet come to Christ in Faith.

I believe you are not separating Israel from today's Believers. The books are shut because of their unbelief but open to all believers in Christ Jesus because Jesus wrote all O.T Books.

 

[ezrider]

I believe you are not separating Israel from today's Believers. The books are shut because of their unbelief but open to all believers in Christ Jesus because Jesus wrote all O.T Books.

Sorry Chopper, but it has nothing to do with separating Israel from today's believers, because most of today's believers have attached themselves to Israel, trying to graft themselves in. The words of the Book being sealed is entirely about walking by Faith, something many confuse with believing in God and the words of the Bible. But the trouble is, they don't really believe the words of the Book; Or rather, they think the words don't apply to them. So they begin to justify unto themselves certain doctrines of men, and from them multiple denominations and beliefs, and yet they all claim that the words of the book are open to them. The words of the book are sealed, and the unwise virgins return to those who would buy and sell, choosing their own delusion.

Yet like you say, the words of the book are shut because of their unbelief. But in the scriptures, what does the Lord say of his children? He say's they are stupid, they are sottish. They are wise to do evil, but to good they have no knowledge. They are WISE to do EVIL. Where does this wisdom for evil come from? The knowledge of good and evil? From the Law? From the instruction of the Torah? You do know that the Lord did give one warning unto Adam?

When Adam ate from the tree of Knowledge, his EYES were OPENED to the knowledge of evil. When we read from the Law, our EYES are OPENED to SIN. Lest you forget, your enemy, the serpent, is more subtle than any beast of the field. For by the fruit of the Law, what do your eyes see? The words of the book are sealed, and yet you say they are open to all believers in Christ. But because you say you have eyes that see, you think not to ask what it is that has been hidden from you.

The words of the book are sealed, and yet we see sin. For the serpent is subtle, for by the fruit of knowledge and by the authority of the law, we sit ourselves in the seat of Moses, we sit ourselves in the seat of Christ judging evil for ourselves. Rising up in condemnation of others because the LAW condemns them, while excusing their own condemnation because they believe themselves forgiven. Thinking themselves to have overcome, criticizing the splinter in another, while remaining blinded to the beam that is in their own eyes. And yet the words or the book are sealed. The words of the book are sealed to keep them from the knowing the Righteousness of the Lord. For the Glory of the Lord can only be revealed through FAITH.

2 Corinthians 3:12-18
Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech: And not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished: But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ. But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart. Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away. Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

Whether it be Israel, modern believers, or those who have intended to graft themselves into Israel, the words of the scripture are plain. The words or the book are sealed, their minds remain blinded, even unto this very day. The evidence being they don't understand the end of that which was abolished.


A though for you to ponder upon. By the knowledge of the LAW, when we point out the SINS in others, or by the knowledge of the LAW when we continue to bring our SINS before the sacrifice of the cross: then who or what are we glorifying? By the knowledge of the LAW and the knowledge SIN, are we glorify the LAW? Or are we glorifying SIN?