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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
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https://christianforums.net/threads/become-a-vessel-of-honor-part-2.112306/
[__ Science __ ] The Chicken or the Egg?
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Barbarian
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Actually, he made jungle fowl first. Genetic and archeological information shows that over time,they evolved into chickens.
I tend to doubt strongly, any archeological information.Actually, he made jungle fowl first. Genetic and archeological information shows that over time,they evolved into chickens.
Bit I can't doubt what the word of God says.
Barbarian
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Doesn't matter. Reality is what it is, regardless of our preferences.
God never said chickens didn't evolve from other birds. Why not just accept His creation as it is?
Think that can happen in 8000 years ?
Doesn't matter. Reality is what it is, regardless of our preferences.
God never said chickens didn't evolve from other birds. Why not just accept His creation as it is?
Barbarian
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Wolves and dogs evolved from a common ancestor in maybe 20,000 years. The apple maggot, Rhagoletis pomonella evolved in less than 400 years. Speciation sometimes happens even sooner. Quickly enough that we sometimes actually observe it happening.
Barbarian
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I know you want to believe that. But the Bible doesn't say that. And since there were once no chickens, and eventually they evolved from species of jungle fowl, the question is moot.
Like i said, semantics.. so you're sole purpose for being here is to put down creationist? Kinda sad don't you think?
Barbarian
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I know you want to believe that. But the Bible doesn't say that. And since there were once no chickens, and eventually they evolved from species of jungle fowl, the question is moot.
Nope. Once, a few thousand years ago, there where humans, but just jungle fowl and no chickens. Then over a period of time, the jungle fowl evolved into the species we call "chickens."
Just pointing out how science is consistent with God's creation. There are lots of creationists who accept God's creation as it is. It's mostly YE creationists who don't accept what God tells us about it.
Well, a little. But you should understand that unless they make an idol of their new doctrines, YE creationists are no less Christian than any others. God doesn't care what we think of evolution; that's not what determines our salvation.
I could care less about the young earth old earth debate.
I believe in the adaptation of species and survival of the fittest but that is as far as evolution goes.
The Bible trumps science by the way. At any point science disagrees with the Bible science is wrong.
Barbarian
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Even many YE creationist organizations admit otherwise:
As creationists, we must frequently remind detractors that we do not deny that species vary, change, and even appear over time...Before the time of Charles Darwin, a false idea had crept into the church—the belief in the “fixity” or “immutability” of species. According to this view, each species was created in precisely the same form that we find it today. The Bible nowhere teaches that species are fixed and unchanging.
Speciation
Speciation, the formation of new species, is not evolution in action. Rather, it demonstrates the incredible variety God put within each created kind.
answersingenesis.org
Which is like saying that philosophy trumps accounting. Two different ways of knowing. Both valid in their own sphere.
So when the Bible says that the sky is a dome with windows in it for rain to fall, that overrules what science has told us about the Earth, atmosphere, and meteorology?
I don't think so. You're trying to read too much into poetic expressions.
Even many YE creationist organizations admit otherwise:
As creationists, we must frequently remind detractors that we do not deny that species vary, change, and even appear over time...Before the time of Charles Darwin, a false idea had crept into the church—the belief in the “fixity” or “immutability” of species. According to this view, each species was created in precisely the same form that we find it today. The Bible nowhere teaches that species are fixed and unchanging.
Speciation
Speciation, the formation of new species, is not evolution in action. Rather, it demonstrates the incredible variety God put within each created kind.
Which is like saying that philosophy trumps accounting. Two different ways of knowing. Both valid in their own sphere.
So when the Bible says that the sky is a dome with windows in it for rain to fall, that overrules what science has told us about the Earth, atmosphere, and meteorology?
I don't think so. You're trying to read too much into poetic expressions.
First of all the Bible doesn't say that at all.. second of all if one needed to know the ins and outs of creation then Genesis would have a more detailed account. All we need to know is that there used to be a lot more water in our atmosphere but it fell to flood the earth in Noah's time.
Beyond that I have no interest.
Everything trumps philosophy..
All science is based on human observations all of it has the potential to be wrong.
The Bible is God's word absolutely none of it is wrong. If at any point any human or group of humans disagrees with the Bible the humans are wrong.
You may have gathered by now I couldn’t care less what any group Christian or otherwise says. I am only accountable to God..
Ps please forgive typos I'm writing this without my reading glasses.
Barbarian
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Which is like saying that philosophy trumps accounting. Two different ways of knowing. Both valid in their own sphere.
So when the Bible says that the sky is a dome with windows in it for rain to fall, that overrules what science has told us about the Earth, atmosphere, and meteorology?
I don't think so. You're trying to read too much into poetic expressions
Genesis 7;11 In the six hundredth year of Noah’s life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened.
So when the Bible says that the sky is a dome with windows in it for rain to fall, that overrules what science has told us about the Earth, atmosphere, and meteorology?
I don't think so. You're trying to read too much into poetic expressions
Genesis 1:6 God said, “Let there be a dome in the middle of the water; let it divide the water from the water.” 7 ;God made the dome and divided the water under the dome from the water above the dome; that is how it was, and God called the dome Sky. So there was evening, and there was morning, a second day.
Genesis 7;11 In the six hundredth year of Noah’s life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened.
So does human interpretation of Scripture. The deal is, we can test science to see if it works.
But lots of people interpet it wrong. Hence, YE creationism.
Pretty much like the rest of us. And none of us is God. Helps to remember that.
You have made absolutely no argument against YE. all you have done is say that it's wrong.
So by all means prove YE is wrong... using scripture will be much more compelling than a scientific argument as no scientists were there to observe creation nor is there a reliable way to look into the past except what witnesses pased down.
Barbarian
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I've shown you that literal interpretations of Genesis are in error. Clearly the sky is not a dome with windows in it.
If you were right, forensics, geology, and many other sciences would not exist. The argument that we can't know anything if we weren't there to see it, or what someone else wrote down, is just absurd. I'm surprised that anyone would make such a faulty claim.
As you learned, we can easily show that the Earth is much older than YE doctrines have assumed. Let's look at a simple one:
Varves are layers that accumulate in certain lake bottoms. They form two a year, a light-colored layer and a dark-colored layer. Lake Sugetsu in Japan has over 150,000 years of varves, which would not be possible in YE assumptions. The useful aspect of these varves, is that they can be analyzed to calibrate carbon-14 methods. Because the amount of cosmic radiation varies a bit over time, so does the amount of C-14 vary. That very small variation can be detected in the varves, and used to make carbon dating more accurate.
Japanese lake sediment unlocks 150,000 years of history
www.socsci.ox.ac.uk
There are many other ways we know that the Earth is much older than YE belief would have it. Would you like to learn about some more?
If sampling rocks disagrees with the Bible sampling rocks is wrong.. if the fossil record disagrees with the Bible the interpretation of the fossil record is wrong..I've shown you that literal interpretations of Genesis are in error. Clearly the sky is not a dome with windows in it.
If you were right, forensics, geology, and many other sciences would not exist. The argument that we can't know anything if we weren't there to see it, or what someone else wrote down, is just absurd. I'm surprised that anyone would make such a faulty claim.
As you learned, we can easily show that the Earth is much older than YE doctrines have assumed. Let's look at a simple one:
Varves are layers that accumulate in certain lake bottoms. They form two a year, a light-colored layer and a dark-colored layer. Lake Sugetsu in Japan has over 150,000 years of varves, which would not be possible in YE assumptions. The useful aspect of these varves, is that they can be analyzed to calibrate carbon-14 methods. Because the amount of cosmic radiation varies a bit over time, so does the amount of C-14 vary. That very small variation can be detected in the varves, and used to make carbon dating more accurate.
Japanese lake sediment unlocks 150,000 years of history
There are many other ways we know that the Earth is much older than YE belief would have it. Would you like to learn about some more?
The Bible IS the ultimate authority on earth for every issue it speaks about period. You cannot prove it wrong using science.. science is not God.
Barbarian
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But your interpretation of the Bible isn't the Bible. If God's creation contradicts your interpretation, then His creation is right, and you are wrong.
Nor are you, or any of us, for that matter. We should always keep that in mind, before deciding to speak for Him.
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