The Jehovah’s Witnesses Teach Jesus is Mighty God

[Free]

not going to question that there is but one true God .
that would be a silly thing to do. there are how ever many false god's

1 Corinthians 8:5​

5 For even if there are so-called gods, whether in heaven or on earth (as indeed there are many “gods” and many “lords”),

No, there aren't. You need to read more closely.

1Co 8:4 Therefore, as to the eating of food offered to idols, we know that “an idol has no real existence,” and that “there is no God but one.”
1Co 8:5 For although there may be so-called gods in heaven or on earth—as indeed there are many “gods” and many “lords”—
1Co 8:6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist.

First, notice that Paul says "so-called gods," because they aren't actually gods. Second, Paul clearly states that "for us there is one God." That precludes Jesus from being "a god." There is only one God for Christians.

Lastly, you are going against God's own words, which I previously provided:

Isa 43:10 "You are my witnesses," declares the LORD, "and my servant whom I have chosen, that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor shall there be any after me.

Isa 44:6 Thus says the LORD, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the LORD of hosts: “I am the first and I am the last; besides me there is no god.

Both those verses are saying the same thing--there never was nor will be another god other than the one true God. But, you are saying that God is wrong, because there was at least one god formed after these verses were written.

Are there other gods in the Bible? Of course, but they are so-called gods, including Satan, because men worship them and they have no power other than what men ascribe to them.

(All ESV.)

 

[locust]

what of the god Baal that was a god ,be it a false god non the less a god

 

[locust]

No, there aren't. You need to read more closely.

1Co 8:4 Therefore, as to the eating of food offered to idols, we know that “an idol has no real existence,” and that “there is no God but one.”
1Co 8:5 For although there may be so-called gods in heaven or on earth—as indeed there are many “gods” and many “lords”—
1Co 8:6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist.

First, notice that Paul says "so-called gods," because they aren't actually gods. Second, Paul clearly states that "for us there is one God." That precludes Jesus from being "a god." There is only one God for Christians.

Lastly, you are going against God's own words, which I previously provided:

Isa 43:10 "You are my witnesses," declares the LORD, "and my servant whom I have chosen, that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor shall there be any after me.

Isa 44:6 Thus says the LORD, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the LORD of hosts: “I am the first and I am the last; besides me there is no god.

Both those verses are saying the same thing--there never was nor will be another god other than the one true God. But, you are saying that God is wrong, because there was at least one god formed after these verses were written.

Are there other gods in the Bible? Of course, but they are so-called gods, including Satan, because men worship them and they have no power other than what men ascribe to them.

(All ESV.)

I do hope you are not that Jesus is the almighty God . That that would be a fupa

 

[Free]

what of the god Baal that was a god ,be it a false god non the less a god

That's already addressed by my post.

I do hope you are not that Jesus is the almighty God .

You hope that I am "not [saying] that Jesus is the almighty God"? Of course I am saying that. There is no other option, as I have pointed out with many Scriptures and you fail to actually address. Jesus says he is timeless, which can only mean that he is God. So, many of the NT writers of the NT draw on what Jesus said, and did, to show that he is both truly God and truly man, but that he is distinct from the Father and the Holy Spirit. It is literally throughout the NT.

If God himself says there will never be even another god, then there will never be another god. This means Jesus absolutely cannot be a god. There is only the one true God, with whom Jesus claims to share his nature.

That that would be a fupa

What is a "fupa"?

 

[locust]

fupa

Sorry wrong word

 

[locust]

There is no other option,

in deed there is and its whole hart-idly agrees with all scripture .

 

[locust]

I do have to wonder why it is there is so much hatred of the JW's . I do know Jesus was hated .it stands to reason anyone believing in Jesus and doing the things Jesus said to do would also be hated.

 

[for_his_glory]

Jehovah’s Witnesses are controlled by a "Governing Body" which they claim is the "faithful and discreet slave" spoken of at Mathew 24:45. This group consists of 10 to 15 mature men that, Jehovah’s Witnesses are told, have direct guidance from God. The Governing Body in turn instructs followers with this guidance through the pages of the Watchtower and other publications. Jehovah’s Witnesses are told by this "Governing Body" that Scripture alone is insufficient to understand the things of God. One needs the Watchtower Society and the literature it publishes to properly understand the Bible. ("Jehovah God has also provided his visible organization, his "faithful and discreet slave," made up of spirit-anointed ones... Unless we are in touch with this channel of communication that God is using, we will not progress along the road to life, no matter how much Bible reading we do. Watchtower, December 1, 1981 p.27) they are the instruments God is using to teach the world the deeper things of the scriptures. People are not to think for themselves but instead submit to the Watchtower Society teachings. (" But a spirit of independent thinking does not prevail in God’s organization, and we have sound reasons for confidence in the men taking the lead among us. Watchtower September 15, 1989 p. 23) Jehovah's Witnesses believe they are the only people on earth that are serving God and the only ones that will be saved. They dare not question the teachings of the Watchtower Society; one who questions the Watchtower Society is considered to be weak in faith and could be disfellowshiped.


They do not believe in the Trinity. Instead, they follow a strict monotheism, in which: Jehovah is the Supreme Being. Jesus is the Son of God, a created being. Christ is believed to have originally existed in a pre-human state as the Archangel Michael. He later took human form as a man like any other person, except that he was sinless at birth and remained so throughout his earthly life. Jehovah’s Witnesses do not believe in the bodily resurrection of Christ. They believe that after the crucifixion, Christ died and was resurrected as an invisible, non-material, glorious, spirit creature. They believe that Jesus appeared on earth after his resurrection in a special body that Jehovah created for him.

The Holy Spirit they believe, is not a separate entity, but is simply a force: the method by which God interacts with the world.

 

[locust]

Isa 46:9 remember the former things of old; for I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me,

likely said because the nations around them did have triune gods. Israel's God was/is singular

 

[Free]

in deed there is and its whole hart-idly agrees with all scripture .

It's worth pointing out here that you haven't actually addressed or even attempt to refute any of the passages and arguments I have posted. Why is that? You have either simply dismissed what I have said or poste other passages of Scripture, pitting Scripture against itself without actually trying to make sense of all of it.

I do have to wonder why it is there is so much hatred of the JW's . I do know Jesus was hated .it stands to reason anyone believing in Jesus and doing the things Jesus said to do would also be hated.

Mormons are "hated" as well and they believe in Jesus. But their Jesus is a literal son of God, by procreation, and brother of Satan. He is now just one of many gods. Does that mean that what they believe is true? People who spread falsehoods about God and about Jesus, especially in the name of Jesus, are not followers of the biblical Jesus. They do not have Jesus, which means they do not have the Father either.

Truth really, really matters, especially the truth about who Jesus is. He is the central figure of all of Scripture, in whose name alone we have salvation. It stands to reason that we cannot simply believe whatever we want about Jesus and be saved.

Joh 1:12 But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God, (ESV)

Joh 3:18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God. (ESV)

To believe in the name of Jesus is to believe in who he is--all that the name represents. It is absolutely crucial to believe that Jesus is who he says he is. Jesus tells us who he is, as do the rest of the NT writers, and it is clear that he is both truly God and truly man. There is simply no other conclusion when all the evidence is taken as a whole.

JWs get Jesus very wrong. They believe he was the archangel Michael, rose spiritually, and returned to being Michael. That is taught nowhere in the Bible. The Watchtower even changed a portion of the NWT just to make it agree with their theology, because they understood the implications. The interesting thing is, you quoted that very passage in the other discussion on the deity of Jesus. Here it is, Col. 1:15-17, from the 2013 version of the NWT:

15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation; 16 because by means of him all other things were created in the heavens and on the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All other things have been created through him and for him. 17 Also, he is before all other things, and by means of him all other things were made to exist,

Notice that "other" has been added four times, despite it not appearing at all in the Greek text. That completely changes the meaning, because they, unlike you, recognized the implications of it not being there. The text tells us that everything that was created came into being by means of the Son. That precludes the Son from ever having been created or coming into being.

And, it is done deceitfully, and they know it. Here is how that passage appears in the 1984 version:

15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation; 16 because by means of him all [other] things were created in the heavens and upon the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, no matter whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All [other] things have been created through him and for him. 17 Also, he is before all [other] things+ and by means of him all [other] things were made to exist,

Notice that "other" appears in square brackets ("[ ]"), which means that the word does not appear in the Greek texts, but has been added in the translation. But, they took those brackets out in the latest edition to make it appear as though "other" is in Greek text. Very, very deceptive.

More than that, this can be confirmed simply by looking at the passage in their very own The Kingdom Interlinear Translation of the Greek Scriptures. Their own interlinear translation proves that "other" doesn't exist in the Greek text.

Of course, they only did it there and not anywhere else, such as in John 1:3 and 1 Cor. 8:6, making it contradict itself.

 

[Free]

likely said because the nations around them did have triune gods. Israel's God was/is singular

You're erroneously conflating monotheism with the nature of God (whether he is one person or three persons). Those are two distinct ideas. There is only one true God, which Trinitarianism affirms.

 

[Bruce.Leiter]

does it really surprise you that there was a start ? there had to be a start .not speaking of God having a start but of his creative works .
God is perfect in every way ,so perfect that it stands to reason every thing created would also be perfect ,but that does not seem to be the case . nothing is his equal . as great as heaven is it pales when compared to him. what could God do but create a helper that could do the things God wanted done.
Proverbs 8:22 “ The LORD God himself produced me as the beginning of his way, the earliest of his achievements of long ago.
23 From time indefinite I was installed, from the start, from times earlier than the earth.''
30 Then I was beside him as a master worker. I was the one he was especially fond of day by day;I rejoiced before him all the time;

locust, you haven't responded to my comment about Proverbs 8 yet. The earlier verses make it clear that wisdom is being compared as a metaphor to a woman calling to us to live by the principles of the God's law, not the Person of God who later becomes Jesus. What do you say about the context, which clarifies the meaning?

Why do you resist the biblical truth that God is three Persons in one God, which is presented clearly in the Gospel of John? In the Bible, the three Persons are equal in status as fully God but have different functions--the Father as the Originator or Source, Jesus as the Agent, and the Holy Spirit as the immediate Cause of our creation and salvation.

 

[Bruce.Leiter]

what of the god Baal that was a god ,be it a false god non the less a god

The gods of this world have always been front-gods for the demons like the serpent was for Satan in the Garden of Eden, locust.

 

[locust]

Why do you resist the biblical truth that God is three Persons in one God, which is presented clearly in the Gospel of John? In the Bible, the three Persons are equal in status as fully God but have different functions--the Father as the Originator or Source, Jesus as the Agent, and the Holy Spirit as the immediate Cause of our creation and salvation.

for God not to openly declare that he is in fact is some sort of three face entity would indicate description . the only spirit being in the bible will to lie is Satan.
Satan is the master deceiver even going so far as to promote things that are done to deceive even those that dare call them selves Christian.

 

[for_his_glory]

for God not to openly declare that he is in fact is some sort of three face entity would indicate description . the only spirit being in the bible will to lie is Satan.
Satan is the master deceiver even going so far as to promote things that are done to deceive even those that dare call them selves Christian.

1. God is Spirit, John 4:24, not flesh and blood and in the OT either spoke directly to the prophets or by angels and also various objects like a burning bush or an Ass for example. Between the OT and NT God was silent towards Israel as when they returned to Israel from the Babylonian captivity they came back as merchants and not shepherds as they were disobedient to God going after other gods, Book of Malachi.

2. Jesus being the very Spirit of God before the foundation of the world as He and the Father are one was prophesied by the Prophets in the OT and spoken of by John the Baptist in the NT as John being the forerunner of Christ calling all to repent. As foretold Christ did come as the word of God made flesh (skin, bone, blood) to be that light that shines in darkness. He came as redeemer Savior through Gods grace as Christ is our faith that all can repent of their sins and have eternal life with the Father to all who will believe in Him as Lord and Savior. John 1:1-4; 1 Peter 1:13-21

3. After the sacrifice of Christ God raised Him from the grave and as He had to ascend back up to heaven the promise was that He would never leave us or forsake us as when He ascended He sent down the Holy Spirit (Spirit of God) to indwell all who will believe in Christ and His finished works on the cross. In the OT Gods Spirit fell on them for a time and purpose under heaven. Now we are indwelled with that power and authority through Gods grace that the Holy Spirit now works in us and through us teaching all things God wants us to learn. All three are Spiritual and Spiritual awaking's in us to know the will of God and walk in His statures. John 16:7-15

Ephesians 4: 5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism, 6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

1 John 5:6 This is he that came by water (word) and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth. 7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word (Jesus), and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. 8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water (word), and the blood: and these three agree in one.

God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Spirit as all three coequal Gods Spirit.

Jesus being the right arm of God. Isaiah 53:1 Who hath believed our report? and to whom is the arm of the LORD revealed? 2 For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him. 3 He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.

Jesus is the word of God. John 12:49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. 50 And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.

Jesus is word, light and life that is God come in the flesh. John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

Gods Holy Spirit has come to indwell us and teach us. John 14: 26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.


Scriptures that reference Jesus being referred to as God:
John 1:1-14; John 10:30; Romans 9:5; Colossians 2:9; Hebrews 1:8, 9; 1 John 5:7, 8, 20; 1 Corinthians 8:6; 2 Corinthians 3:17; 13:14; Isaiah 9:6; 44:6; Luke 1:35; Matthew 1:23; 28:19; John 14:16, 17; Genesis 1:1, 2 (cross reference John 1:1-14); 1 Corinthians 12:4-6; Ephesians 4:4-6; Colossians 1:15-17; John 14:9-11; Philippians 2:5-8; Rev 1:8

Scriptures that refer the Holy Spirit as being God:
Psalms 139:7, 8; John 14:17; 16:13; Isaiah 40:13; 1 Corinthians 2:10, 11; Zechariah 4:6; Luke 1:35; Ephesians 4:4-6; Romans 5:5; 1 Corinthians 6:19; Ephesians 1:13; 1 Thessalonians 1:5; Titus 3:5; 2 Peter 1:21; Jude 1:20

 

[locust]

1. God is Spirit, John 4:24, not flesh and blood and in the OT either spoke directly to the prophets or by angels and also various objects like a burning bush or an Ass for example. Between the OT and NT God was silent towards Israel as when they returned to Israel from the Babylonian captivity they came back as merchants and not shepherds as they were disobedient to God going after other gods, Book of Malachi.

2. Jesus being the very Spirit of God before the foundation of the world as He and the Father are one was prophesied by the Prophets in the OT and spoken of by John the Baptist in the NT as John being the forerunner of Christ calling all to repent. As foretold Christ did come as the word of God made flesh (skin, bone, blood) to be that light that shines in darkness. He came as redeemer Savior through Gods grace as Christ is our faith that all can repent of their sins and have eternal life with the Father to all who will believe in Him as Lord and Savior. John 1:1-4; 1 Peter 1:13-21

3. After the sacrifice of Christ God raised Him from the grave and as He had to ascend back up to heaven the promise was that He would never leave us or forsake us as when He ascended He sent down the Holy Spirit (Spirit of God) to indwell all who will believe in Christ and His finished works on the cross. In the OT Gods Spirit fell on them for a time and purpose under heaven. Now we are indwelled with that power and authority through Gods grace that the Holy Spirit now works in us and through us teaching all things God wants us to learn. All three are Spiritual and Spiritual awaking's in us to know the will of God and walk in His statures. John 16:7-15

Ephesians 4: 5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism, 6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

1 John 5:6 This is he that came by water (word) and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth. 7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word (Jesus), and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. 8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water (word), and the blood: and these three agree in one.

God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Spirit as all three coequal Gods Spirit.

Jesus being the right arm of God. Isaiah 53:1 Who hath believed our report? and to whom is the arm of the LORD revealed? 2 For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him. 3 He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.

Jesus is the word of God. John 12:49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. 50 And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.

Jesus is word, light and life that is God come in the flesh. John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

Gods Holy Spirit has come to indwell us and teach us. John 14: 26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.


Scriptures that reference Jesus being referred to as God:
John 1:1-14; John 10:30; Romans 9:5; Colossians 2:9; Hebrews 1:8, 9; 1 John 5:7, 8, 20; 1 Corinthians 8:6; 2 Corinthians 3:17; 13:14; Isaiah 9:6; 44:6; Luke 1:35; Matthew 1:23; 28:19; John 14:16, 17; Genesis 1:1, 2 (cross reference John 1:1-14); 1 Corinthians 12:4-6; Ephesians 4:4-6; Colossians 1:15-17; John 14:9-11; Philippians 2:5-8; Rev 1:8

Scriptures that refer the Holy Spirit as being God:
Psalms 139:7, 8; John 14:17; 16:13; Isaiah 40:13; 1 Corinthians 2:10, 11; Zechariah 4:6; Luke 1:35; Ephesians 4:4-6; Romans 5:5; 1 Corinthians 6:19; Ephesians 1:13; 1 Thessalonians 1:5; Titus 3:5; 2 Peter 1:21; Jude 1:20

should I assume you have an argument

 

[for_his_glory]

should I assume you have an argument

I never argue the word of God, but give that of what has already been written in the scriptures.

 

[locust]

I never argue the word of God, but give that of what has already been written in the scriptures.

ok , does not help if the scriptures are used incorrectly

 

[locust]

I never argue the word of God, but give that of what has already been written in the scriptures.

Do you mean to say you never argue against the word of God

 

[Bruce.Leiter]

for God not to openly declare that he is in fact is some sort of three face entity would indicate description . the only spirit being in the bible will to lie is Satan.
Satan is the master deceiver even going so far as to promote things that are done to deceive even those that dare call them selves Christian.

locust, what do you mean when you say, "for God not to openly declare that he is in fact is some sort of three face entity would indicate description"? Your words are not clear in stating your ideas; they are confusing to me. Please explain your thoughts. Thanks.

Of course, God doesn't lie, but he reveals himself in the Gospel of John as one God in three Persons, a mystery to human logic and reasoning but a great God who is beyond human thought, as Isaiah quotes him in 55:8-9,

Isa 55:8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, declares the LORD.
Isa 55:9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts.