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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join Hidden in Him and For His Glory for discussions on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/become-a-vessel-of-honor-part-2.112306/
End Of Days Hysteria: Does It Reflect Well On Our Witness?
- Thread starter Hidden In Him
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- Sep 10, 2021
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Spanish Inquisition - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
1834. That's less than two hundred years ago actually.
Good old Wiki. Thanks, I'm getting lazy I guess.
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Anti-Protestantism - Wikipedia
ezrider
Member
- Jul 21, 2011
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Judgement falls upon each generation, as the sins of the fathers are visited upon the sons unto the third and fourth generations, but we don't like to acknowledge nor seek to understand these judgements that are visited upon us. Instead the fervor is placed upon the final judgement, what you referred to as the Biblical the Day of the Lord.
Those who feel the need to witness the end is nigh do so because it serves as a form of confession that the judgement and condemnation of the law still rests upon them, having the knowledge of the hope for salvation, but not in possession of the gift thereof. They tend to remain standing before the cross rather than following after the risen Christ. They speak what they know, judgement, damnation, shame and everlasting contempt, while looking for the Day of the Lord.
Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
- Aug 14, 2024
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I think that's pretty good insight. We should be walking with the Lord each day, ensuring that we're pleasing Him, as opposed to focusing on future judgment that should concern those who are not saved. Sure, we should warn the unsaved that final judgment awaits them, but we should also be warning them that judgment always faces them each day, since God is always watching what they do.
We can let others know the patience and kindness of the Lord, who does not always suddenly judge people, but sometimes waits for many years those to repent who are not living exemplary lives, ignoring the Lord and His love. We don't need to "frighten" them into accepting the Lord--rather, we should convict them to act according to their conscience.
- Apr 22, 2011
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The Lord's day being the day of the Lord is a day of Gods great wrath being poured out into the world that will have a great impact on those who refuse to repent and accept Jesus as Lord and Savior. It is always pointed out as the day at hand meaning in Gods timing in Rev 1:10. The phrase "the day of the Lord" is used nineteen times in the Old Testament (Isaiah 2:12; 13:6, 9; Ezekiel 13:5, 30:3; Joel 1:15, 2:1,11,31; 3:14; Amos 5:18,20; Obadiah 15; Zephaniah 1:7,14; Zechariah 14:1; Malachi. 4:5) and five times in the New Testament (Acts 2:20; 1 Thessalonians 5:2; 2 Thessalonians 2:2; 2 Peter 3:10; Rev 1:10). It is also alluded to in other passages like Revelation 6:17; 16:14.
The Lord's day only appears once in scripture in Rev 1:10. It gives no reference to what day of the week it was as every day is the Lord's day, but more specific is also referred to the Sabbath day beginning Friday at sunset to Saturday at sunset.
John was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, but yet in his physical body when he received from the angel Jesus sent to him who gave him all these revelations that he wrote down. Throughout scripture the Lord's day is usually referred to as the Sabbath being the seventh day of the week, Genesis 2:1-3 a day of rest.
2 Peter 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
In 2 Peter 3:1-10 Peter is not talking about six days of creation with the seven day as a sabbath. The full context is Peter addressing the mockers about the return of Christ, 2 Peter 3:1-7. Peter is actually quoting Psalms 90:4 For a thousand years in thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch in the night. This also parallels with Psalms 63:6 and Psalms 119:148 that speak of night watches that we read in 2 Peter 3:10 that Jesus will come as a thief in the night and that we just need to be ready as we watch for His return, Matthew 24:43; 1 Thessalonians 5:2.
Vs. 8-10 Peter gives the manifestation of the day of the Lord and if you take notice of the "is" and "as" in vs. 8 they are a figure of speech or a simile as being like a thousand years, but yet God's timing, not our timing. It's also like "a twinkling of an eye" in 1 Corinthians 15:2 as you can not define a twinkling in measurement of time. Man's literal counting of days is not always how God numbers days in hours, minutes or seconds. This is why I do not consider 1000 years as being literal in 2 Peter 3:8 or Rev 20, but symbolic as in Deuteronomy 7:9; 1Chronicles 16:15; Psalms 50:10; 90:4; 105:8 Ecc 6:6; 7:28; Daniel 5:1; 2Peter 3:8.
Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
1Co 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
1Co 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
1Th 4:13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
1Th 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
1Th 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
1Th 4:18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.
The Lord's day only appears once in scripture in Rev 1:10. It gives no reference to what day of the week it was as every day is the Lord's day, but more specific is also referred to the Sabbath day beginning Friday at sunset to Saturday at sunset.
John was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, but yet in his physical body when he received from the angel Jesus sent to him who gave him all these revelations that he wrote down. Throughout scripture the Lord's day is usually referred to as the Sabbath being the seventh day of the week, Genesis 2:1-3 a day of rest.
2 Peter 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
In 2 Peter 3:1-10 Peter is not talking about six days of creation with the seven day as a sabbath. The full context is Peter addressing the mockers about the return of Christ, 2 Peter 3:1-7. Peter is actually quoting Psalms 90:4 For a thousand years in thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch in the night. This also parallels with Psalms 63:6 and Psalms 119:148 that speak of night watches that we read in 2 Peter 3:10 that Jesus will come as a thief in the night and that we just need to be ready as we watch for His return, Matthew 24:43; 1 Thessalonians 5:2.
Vs. 8-10 Peter gives the manifestation of the day of the Lord and if you take notice of the "is" and "as" in vs. 8 they are a figure of speech or a simile as being like a thousand years, but yet God's timing, not our timing. It's also like "a twinkling of an eye" in 1 Corinthians 15:2 as you can not define a twinkling in measurement of time. Man's literal counting of days is not always how God numbers days in hours, minutes or seconds. This is why I do not consider 1000 years as being literal in 2 Peter 3:8 or Rev 20, but symbolic as in Deuteronomy 7:9; 1Chronicles 16:15; Psalms 50:10; 90:4; 105:8 Ecc 6:6; 7:28; Daniel 5:1; 2Peter 3:8.
Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
1Co 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
1Co 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
1Th 4:13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
1Th 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
1Th 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
1Th 4:18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.
Hi Hidden In Him
While I feel compelled to define some terms here, I do agree with you concerning any 'hysteria' that you may have heard. But that isn't meant to include just general discussions on the subject between believers and even between believers and unbelievers.
I think the Scriptures are clear that we're going to see some false prophets running around proclaiming, "There he is over there," or "Here he is over here." Jesus has said pretty clearly that no man knows the day or hour. I take that to mean that anyone who tries to tell me that Jesus is going to return on a given day, or at the stroke of midnight or some other such specific mention of a day or hour that he will return just hasn't read the Scriptures. Otherwise they would know of themselves that they are false prophets because Jesus has told us that they don't know this thing that they proclaim to know.
I think a bright discussion with anyone could be made with this matter as an introduction.
"Man, sometimes I look out there and ask, 'is this the end?'" you mention to a friend standing by the elevators.
"Yeah. Sounds like some pretty crazy stuff going on out there," he replies.
"I wonder, if there is an end to this world, what it would be like?" you ask.
Fortunately the elevator doors open up and there are no other riders. You and your friend step on the elevator. "Have you ever given that any thought? What do you think?" you push on. "All this talk about a nuclear holocaust and so many nations at war or wanting to go to war over various and sundry geo-political issues. I just wonder what the world will be like in another 100-200 years if all this hating and fighting continues to accelerate exponentially?"
Then you ask those probing questions until you get to Jesus. All because your friend stopped you and asked, "Have you read about that crazy nut that says Jesus is going to return on March 5th?"
So, as a believer, I understand that these claims are being made by false prophets. As a believer I also know that there's a place in His testimony that what some mean for evil, God can use for good. So when you hear the tales of those false prophets, we get an easy opportunity to talk about spiritual things while being in complete agreement with them that the account of his time of arrival being made is not true.
Sometimes I pray God direct me to the paths of people that He would have me tell about Jesus. Sometimes, through issues just like this one, that we're trying to dispel a lie with the truth, God can speak to the hearer's heart...IF we are open to those opportunities. So, let your witness be made even stronger over the lies of the enemy and speak the truth to his lies to open the eyes and ears of a lost soul.
While I feel compelled to define some terms here, I do agree with you concerning any 'hysteria' that you may have heard. But that isn't meant to include just general discussions on the subject between believers and even between believers and unbelievers.
I think the Scriptures are clear that we're going to see some false prophets running around proclaiming, "There he is over there," or "Here he is over here." Jesus has said pretty clearly that no man knows the day or hour. I take that to mean that anyone who tries to tell me that Jesus is going to return on a given day, or at the stroke of midnight or some other such specific mention of a day or hour that he will return just hasn't read the Scriptures. Otherwise they would know of themselves that they are false prophets because Jesus has told us that they don't know this thing that they proclaim to know.
I think a bright discussion with anyone could be made with this matter as an introduction.
"Man, sometimes I look out there and ask, 'is this the end?'" you mention to a friend standing by the elevators.
"Yeah. Sounds like some pretty crazy stuff going on out there," he replies.
"I wonder, if there is an end to this world, what it would be like?" you ask.
Fortunately the elevator doors open up and there are no other riders. You and your friend step on the elevator. "Have you ever given that any thought? What do you think?" you push on. "All this talk about a nuclear holocaust and so many nations at war or wanting to go to war over various and sundry geo-political issues. I just wonder what the world will be like in another 100-200 years if all this hating and fighting continues to accelerate exponentially?"
Then you ask those probing questions until you get to Jesus. All because your friend stopped you and asked, "Have you read about that crazy nut that says Jesus is going to return on March 5th?"
So, as a believer, I understand that these claims are being made by false prophets. As a believer I also know that there's a place in His testimony that what some mean for evil, God can use for good. So when you hear the tales of those false prophets, we get an easy opportunity to talk about spiritual things while being in complete agreement with them that the account of his time of arrival being made is not true.
Sometimes I pray God direct me to the paths of people that He would have me tell about Jesus. Sometimes, through issues just like this one, that we're trying to dispel a lie with the truth, God can speak to the hearer's heart...IF we are open to those opportunities. So, let your witness be made even stronger over the lies of the enemy and speak the truth to his lies to open the eyes and ears of a lost soul.
But honestly, we all have to know and understand that all these things that the Lord warned us of are going to come about. There is coming a day when Jesus will look upon the whole of the earth and wonder if there is any faith left among men on the earth? When he returns, he asks, will he find faith upon the earth? So, there are a myriad of ways in which those who cling to the name of Christ, or at least portray to the world that they do so, tarnish the good and pure witness of the love and mercy that God has/is showing us through the loving gift of His Son's testimony and life.
Jim Jones. A man who started out acting on fire for Jesus and holding himself up as an evangelical practitioner of the faith. What do you think his bringing about the suicide death of hundreds of people in search of some place that was going to be the place where people would see how 'christians' live. A tragedy for sure through a man who obviously had always been selling himself and not Jesus. What kind of witness is that?
David Koresh. The founder and leader of the Branch Davidian sect of 'christianity'. What kind of witness testimony did he leave?
Then you have the haters that go out into the byways and highways and hold up signs proclaiming to all who will listen that are not like them that God hates them. I don't recall any of the first disciples using such a technique as a witnessing tool. Yes, Paul did write that those apart from Jesus are enmity with God. But he was writing a letter to believers. We do know that God hates sin and those who practice it and support it. Because we know that then we also know that, if the word to describe God's feelings about sinners is 'hate', then He hates us, too. We're all sinners!!! But God has made a way that our sin is cleansed and paid for. That's all He asks us to do is to go out and tell others that truth.
Yes, among the body upon the earth that is seen as 'christian', there are some false prophets. We surely should denounce such things that are not of God and His Spirit. And of course, as we know, there are quite a few 'prophets' who have settled on dates that just didn't turn out. What does God's word say to do about such prophets?
Jim Jones. A man who started out acting on fire for Jesus and holding himself up as an evangelical practitioner of the faith. What do you think his bringing about the suicide death of hundreds of people in search of some place that was going to be the place where people would see how 'christians' live. A tragedy for sure through a man who obviously had always been selling himself and not Jesus. What kind of witness is that?
David Koresh. The founder and leader of the Branch Davidian sect of 'christianity'. What kind of witness testimony did he leave?
Then you have the haters that go out into the byways and highways and hold up signs proclaiming to all who will listen that are not like them that God hates them. I don't recall any of the first disciples using such a technique as a witnessing tool. Yes, Paul did write that those apart from Jesus are enmity with God. But he was writing a letter to believers. We do know that God hates sin and those who practice it and support it. Because we know that then we also know that, if the word to describe God's feelings about sinners is 'hate', then He hates us, too. We're all sinners!!! But God has made a way that our sin is cleansed and paid for. That's all He asks us to do is to go out and tell others that truth.
Yes, among the body upon the earth that is seen as 'christian', there are some false prophets. We surely should denounce such things that are not of God and His Spirit. And of course, as we know, there are quite a few 'prophets' who have settled on dates that just didn't turn out. What does God's word say to do about such prophets?
- Aug 14, 2024
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I can in part agree with you, but only in part. Yes, the Day of the Lord can span thousands of years. We commonly refer to the entire NT Period as "the Last Days."
That's because once Jesus provided a final atonement for our sins nothing prevents us from obtaining Eternal Life *now.* These are the days when we can obtain Eternal Salvation, since Eternal Judgment follows right after this era. That's what makes the current era be viewed as the "Last Days."
But readiness for Christ's Coming has nothing, I think, with anticipating a particular day, or even a metaphorical "Day." You seem to be referring to a metaphorical "Day," or era, whereas I prefer to focus on the literal day that ends the present age.
Since a metaphorical "Day of the Lord" for you could conceivably have begun when Christ ascended into heaven, we are already in the "Last Days." We therefore get ready *today,* well before Judgment Day arrives. We could die tomorrow--we can't wait until a calendar day so that we get ready the day before it!
On John's use of "the Lord's Day" I happen to think he was referring to the Lord's Day as in Zechariah...
Zech 14.5 Then the Lord my God will come, and all the holy ones with him.
6 On that day there will be neither sunlight nor cold, frosty darkness. 7 It will be a unique day—a day known only to the Lord—with no distinction between day and night. When evening comes, there will be light.
This use of the "Lord's Day" has to do with visions, and is not to be associated with a particular day, time, or condition. ...Just my opinion.
There are a number of different applications for "the Lord's Day"--it depends on the context. But there does seem to be a technical application of "the Day of the Lord" as applied in the eschatological sense of Israel's final victory over pagans, and the Lord's Coming to establish His Kingdom on earth permanently.
I see this "Day of the Lord" as a single day in which Christ returns to judge the Antichrist and to save Israel, as well as to glorify His Church. It will take place on a single day and within a single hour.
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- Sep 10, 2021
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Thanks to everyone who posted the responses, and blessings. I will get back to you all as soon as possible.
Ok Blain, the second one is this. There will need to be false Christ's manifesting in the earth and performing satanic signs and wonders so great that they can potentially deceive even the very elect.
23 At that time if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Messiah!’ or, ‘There he is!’ do not believe it. 24 For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you ahead of time. 26 “So if anyone tells you, ‘There he is, out in the wilderness,’ do not go out; or, ‘Here he is, in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it. 27 For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. 28 Wherever there is a carcass, there the vultures will gather. (Matthew 24:23-28)
Revelations suggests one such sign may be making fire come down out of heaven in the sight of men. We don't see that kind of sorcery being successfully practiced publicly in the earth yet. It speaks to a different time; one that is coming but not here yet.
Ok Blain, the second one is this. There will need to be false Christ's manifesting in the earth and performing satanic signs and wonders so great that they can potentially deceive even the very elect.
23 At that time if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Messiah!’ or, ‘There he is!’ do not believe it. 24 For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you ahead of time. 26 “So if anyone tells you, ‘There he is, out in the wilderness,’ do not go out; or, ‘Here he is, in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it. 27 For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. 28 Wherever there is a carcass, there the vultures will gather. (Matthew 24:23-28)
Revelations suggests one such sign may be making fire come down out of heaven in the sight of men. We don't see that kind of sorcery being successfully practiced publicly in the earth yet. It speaks to a different time; one that is coming but not here yet.
- Apr 22, 2011
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I don't believe there is anything metaphorical about the day that Christ returns as it is made very clear in Matthew 24:29-31; 36-39 that it will be a literal day, but yet no one knows the day or the hour of His return.
In all reality we have been in the last days from the time we were born from our mothers womb as all our days are numbered by God, Psalms 139. The important thing is to be Spiritually prepared to be caught up to Christ when He returns, 1Thessalonians Corinthians 15:50-58; 1Thessalonians 4:13-18.
- Jul 11, 2025
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Yes and believe it or not there are some who are already doing this though not with signs and wonders but they do claim to be Christ I saw a video of a man who is doing this and another who cvlaimed to be better than Christ. though of course not to the degree that your talking about
- Sep 10, 2021
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Yes. I'm aware of them too. But I don't think they're anywhere near on the same level as the ones who are coming. The power needed to deceive even the very elect of God is immense IMO, so we still have a long ways to go before we get there.
I have a few others. The next one is my Go To, and why I absolutely think there is no way He can be returning right away. But it has to do with the type of kingdom that was described in Daniel and in Revelations. Let me cite a passage first.
19 “Then I wanted to know the meaning of the fourth beast, which was different from all the others and most terrifying, with its iron teeth and bronze claws—the beast that crushed and devoured its victims and trampled underfoot whatever was left. 20 I also wanted to know about the ten horns on its head and about the other horn that came up, before which three of them fell—the horn that looked more imposing than the others and that had eyes and a mouth that spoke boastfully. 21 As I watched, this horn was waging war against the holy people and defeating them (Daniel 7:19-21)
Ok, again I am a Futurist, and that means this passage has not yet been fulfilled, but in order FOR it to be fulfilled there will have to be a kingdom in the earth that is more violent and more destructive than any kingdom in human history. Daniel described it as "most terrifying," and this in comparison to the ancient kingdoms of Babylon, Greece and Persia. Some would say this last beast was Rome, but while that's what everyone believed at the time, Rome did not fulfill the prophecy. But a kingdom is coming eventually that will, and it will be a kingdom that especially conquers and devours Christians and Jews. Based on numerous things mentioned in scripture which would be too much to go into here, I believe the Antichrist will be Muslim and the fourth beast will be the Islamic Caliphate that arises to champion militant Islam throughout the world; a collection of ten nations, the leadership of three of which will be usurped when they realize the "little horn" from one of them is their long awaited Mahdi.
For anyone wanting to watch a video on the scriptural evidences for this, I will post it, but this is the main reason why I think there is no way the return can be tomorrow. Kingdoms do not take shape overnight. They build up over time. We saw the Muslim nations come together recently over Israel's aggression against Palestine, but they are a long ways from coalescing into a full-blown kingdom that arises to conquer and/ or hold sway over much of the planet.
- Sep 10, 2021
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Actually, I already have posted a few, so I will just provide the links.
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