ADAM and EVE

[josefnospam]

Adam took of the fruit of his own free will. Eve was fooled by the serpent.

And the woman said.........."The serpent beguiled me and I did eat. " Gen. 3:13
She was fooled


......she took of the fruit thereof and did eat and gave also unto her husband with her and he did eat. ..........Gen. 3:6

Eve was fooled. Adam took of the fruit of his own will. What think ye?

 

[Guest]

..and the woman continues to have babies even though the birth pains is like pushing out a ford focus, continuing in the madness, subjecting their kids to heaven and hell, by giving them life in a fallen world.

 

[JLB]

Adam took of the fruit of his own free will. Eve was fooled by the serpent.

And the woman said.........."The serpent beguiled me and I did eat. " Gen. 3:13
She was fooled


......she took of the fruit thereof and did eat and gave also unto her husband with her and he did eat. ..........Gen. 3:6

Eve was fooled. Adam took of the fruit of his own will. What think ye?

I think Enoch chose of his own free will to walk with God; and he was not, for God took him.


JLB

 

[Deborah13]

Adam was tempted and he didn't run to God and tell Him the serpent was in the Garden, and let God deal with it.

Which is what we should when we are tempted. RUN, to the Word, run to prayer, and Jesus in us, will deal with it.

 

[WIP]

Adam was tempted and he didn't run to God and tell Him the serpent was in the Garden, and let God deal with it.

Which is what we should when we are tempted. RUN, to the Word, run to prayer, and Jesus in us, will deal with it.

It's amazing how sometimes it can be just the little bits that seem to hit home the hardest. This speaks to me for some reason. I must give this some more thought.
Thank you for this excellent reminder!

 

[Rob G]

They hid from God because they discovered they were naked. I believe what cover them was God’s Indwelling Grace and lost it due to sin. When we are cover with God’s Indwelling Grace through the Holy spirit there is an inner peace with in us.

It interesting that when they wanted to cover themselves with leaves, God covered them with skins.

Blood was shed to collect these skins, the first sacrifice.

 

[mondar]

Adam took of the fruit of his own free will. Eve was fooled by the serpent.

And the woman said.........."The serpent beguiled me and I did eat. " Gen. 3:13
She was fooled


......she took of the fruit thereof and did eat and gave also unto her husband with her and he did eat. ..........Gen. 3:6

Eve was fooled. Adam took of the fruit of his own will. What think ye?

Scripturally, the only meaning concerning Eve is in this verse.
1Ti 2:14 and Adam was not beguiled, but the woman being beguiled hath fallen into transgression:
The passage is about Women teaching. Paul quotes Eve in Genesis as a reason for Women not to be teaching men in a congregation.

The thing that has far far greater significance is Adams sin.
Rom 5:12 Therefore, as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin; and so death passed unto all men, for that all sinned: -
In Genesis, Adam did not sin first. Eve sinned before Adam. Why then did death come into the world through Adam, the 2nd sinner? Why did death not come through Eve, the first sinner?

The answer is in the concept of Federal Headship. We all suffer death in because of Adams sin.
Rom 5:15 But not as the trespass, so also is the free gift. For if by the trespass of the one the many died, much more did the grace of God, and the gift by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ, abound unto the many. Now do not misunderstand the nature of this death. It is physical, yes, but more than that, it is also spiritual. The spiritual death spoken of in Ephesians 2:1 is a part of what we all suffer due to Adams Federal headship.
Eph 2:1 And you did he make alive, when ye were dead through your trespasses and sins,
We are dead because of Adam, and we are dead in our own trespasses and sins.
It was because of this death that David said.
Psa 51:5 Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity; And in sin did my mother conceive me.
When did David become a sinner? David was iniquitous when he was conceived. He was a sinner when he was born. From the moment of conception, we are guilty of being sinners. Why? How can we be sinners before we even can make choices of sin? Because of Adams Federal headship. Because we have a sin nature from conception and are guilty in Adam, we are guilty and deserving of the wrath of God from the moment of conception.

Why is it that no one seeks God?
Rom 3:11 There is none that understandeth, There is none that seeketh after God;
No one seeks God because we are sinners in Adam.
Why does Christ say, no one can come (except by Gods effort of drawing?)?
Joh 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father that sent me draw him: and I will raise him up in the last day.
Because we are rebel sinners from conception and can do nothing but rebel without the intervention of God.

We are conceived "in Adam." Adam is our federal head. So we are guilty of personal sins, but even if we do not have personal sins, we are still guilty because in Adam we are guilty of being sinners. There is no hope, except Christ.

 

[Rob G]

Why was Adam and Eve’s disobedience passed on to all descending children?
Why are we responsible for their sin?

Unless there is more to this sin then we think? What happened in the garden?
Why was God so angry that He had to shed blood of innocent animals for this sin?

 

[handy]

[MENTION=96791]Rob G[/MENTION]
It's pretty clear what happened in the Garden, Adam willfully chose to disobey God, and sin really doesn't get any worse than that. It's our own human nature that is so mired in sin that causes us to think Adam's sin wasn't that big of a deal, not worthy of God's anger or wrath. This is mainly because we all disobey God. We don't all murder, or torture or rape or kill puppies, so we elevate those sins as somehow being far more worse than outright disobedience to God.

The fact that death passed to all of us isn't really a matter of us being "responsible" for Adam's sin... rather that this is the nature of sin, it's like terminal cancer, it spreads. We are not being held responsible for Adam's sin, but our own, because again, we all disobey God.

You had mentioned earlier that the animals whose skins made the covering for Adam and Eve represents the first sacrifice and this is correct.

 

[Webers_Home]

.

Eve was fooled. Adam took of the fruit of his own will.

I think most husbands would sympathize with Adam. I mean: here's your wife beside you happily munching away on a fruit that you were led to believe is toxic and she's exhibiting no apparent ill side effects. How are you supposed to argue with that?

There's a useful lesson to be learned from it. In other words: Faith believes what's revealed to it rather than only what makes sense to it. Eve's apparent immunity to the fruit's toxins wasn't really reason enough to assume that God's instructions were unreliable. But even had they been unreliable; it was still wrong of Adam to brush them aside and do as he pleased. He was told not to eat the fruit. Whether it was actually toxic or not is unimportant. This episode was primarily about the quality of Adam's obedience rather than about the quality of his health.

Buen Camino
/

 

[TOG]

I think most husbands would sympathize with Adam. I mean: here's your wife beside you happily munching away on a fruit that you were led to believe is toxic and she's exhibiting no apparent ill side effects. How are you supposed to argue with that?

I once heard of an old Jewish legend about why Adam ate the fruit. According to this legend, Eve was Adam's second wife. His first wife, Lilith, had also eaten of the fruit, but Adam obeyed God and didn't eat of it. Lilith was thrown out of Eden, but Adam remained. When Eve ate of the fruit, Adam chose to leave the garden with her rather than to be heartbroken again.

 

[mondar]

[MENTION=96791]Rob G[/MENTION]
It's pretty clear what happened in the Garden, Adam willfully chose to disobey God, and sin really doesn't get any worse than that. It's our own human nature that is so mired in sin that causes us to think Adam's sin wasn't that big of a deal, not worthy of God's anger or wrath. This is mainly because we all disobey God. We don't all murder, or torture or rape or kill puppies, so we elevate those sins as somehow being far more worse than outright disobedience to God.

The fact that death passed to all of us isn't really a matter of us being "responsible" for Adam's sin... rather that this is the nature of sin, it's like terminal cancer, it spreads. We are not being held responsible for Adam's sin, but our own, because again, we all disobey God.

You had mentioned earlier that the animals whose skins made the covering for Adam and Eve represents the first sacrifice and this is correct.

I assume this was written in response to my post in this thread. Thank you for reading the post and responding, even if you disagree. Of course in my post, I did not actually defend the statement that we are guilty in Adam, but merely stated it. Allow me to add a defense of that statement. I had quoted Romans 5:12 and 15, but not verse 18.

Romans 5:18 So then as through one trespass the judgment came unto all men to condemnation;
In this verse it was not by our own personal sin that judgment came to all men unto condemnation, it was by the sin of Adam.

An important concept is that of Federal Headship. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_headship)

If we are not guilty and being judged by God, the natural question that would be asked, is, why do babies die? It could even be asked why do unborn infants die? If there is no judgment, then babies should not die physically until they first sin.

 

[handy]

[MENTION=96791]Rob G[/MENTION]
It's pretty clear what happened in the Garden, Adam willfully chose to disobey God, and sin really doesn't get any worse than that. It's our own human nature that is so mired in sin that causes us to think Adam's sin wasn't that big of a deal, not worthy of God's anger or wrath. This is mainly because we all disobey God. We don't all murder, or torture or rape or kill puppies, so we elevate those sins as somehow being far more worse than outright disobedience to God.

The fact that death passed to all of us isn't really a matter of us being "responsible" for Adam's sin... rather that this is the nature of sin, it's like terminal cancer, it spreads. We are not being held responsible for Adam's sin, but our own, because again, we all disobey God.

You had mentioned earlier that the animals whose skins made the covering for Adam and Eve represents the first sacrifice and this is correct.

I assume this was written in response to my post in this thread. Thank you for reading the post and responding, even if you disagree. Of course in my post, I did not actually defend the statement that we are guilty in Adam, but merely stated it. Allow me to add a defense of that statement. I had quoted Romans 5:12 and 15, but not verse 18.

Romans 5:18 So then as through one trespass the judgment came unto all men to condemnation;
In this verse it was not by our own personal sin that judgment came to all men unto condemnation, it was by the sin of Adam.

An important concept is that of Federal Headship. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_headship)

If we are not guilty and being judged by God, the natural question that would be asked, is, why do babies die? It could even be asked why do unborn infants die? If there is no judgment, then babies should not die physically until they first sin.

Hi Mondar... actually, I was responding to Rob G's post rather than yours.

I don't think you and I are disagreeing all that much. The question Rob G brought forth was "Why are we responsible for their sin?"... and I agree with the idea of Federal Headship as you've explained it in your post, which is why I don't think we are "held responsible" for Adam's sin... far more so, Adam bears the responsibility for our sin, just as he did Eve's. Why do babies die, even unborn infants? Because they are bearing the consequence of Adam's sin. There is a difference between responsibility and consequence. However, all who will stand before God in judgment will answer for their own deeds, rather than Adam's. Revelation 20:12-14 makes it clear that all are judged "according to their deeds".

 

[josefnospam]

Thanks all for the good reponses.............This is an intresting subject and has some implications Im not sure I understand.

Unless there is more to this sin then we think?

Yes I believe that there is a Lot more to sin then most people think.

 

[josefnospam]

Romans 5:18 does say "Therefore as by the offense of one judgement came upon all men to condemnation: even so by rightousness of one to the free gift to come upon all men unto justification of life." And Death reigned from Adam to Moses. Verse 14.

Moses gave us the Law to live by. Christ gives us grace to live by, because we are no longer under the law after Christ died and paid or our sins.
We no longer are under the Law, and when we fail to keep it perfectly, (and ALL men are sinners) we are forgiven. Thank God we don't and can't be held accoutable when we fail. Keeping the law by and in the flesh, to please God leads to failure. Christ was held accountable for our sins, ALL of them ,past, present and future. Should we try to keep All the laws? Yes we should. Can we keep all the laws perfectly in the flesh? No we can't. " O wretched man that I am! Who can deliever me from this body of death. I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord".................Romans 7:24 and 25. Thank God for his amazing Mercy and Grace.

Romans 5:12 says 'wherefore as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned."

Death passed upon ALL men for what Adam did. That I believe is how bad sin is.

 

[Rob G]

Romans 5:18 does say "Therefore as by the offense of one judgement came upon all men to condemnation: even so by rightousness of one to the free gift to come upon all men unto justification of life." And Death reigned from Adam to Moses. Verse 14.

Moses gave us the Law to live by. Christ gives us grace to live by, because we are no longer under the law after Christ died and paid or our sins.
We no longer are under the Law, and when we fail to keep it perfectly, (and ALL men are sinners) we are forgiven. Thank God we don't and can't be held accoutable when we fail. Keeping the law by and in the flesh, to please God leads to failure. Christ was held accountable for our sins, ALL of them ,past, present and future. Should we try to keep All the laws? Yes we should. Can we keep all the laws perfectly in the flesh? No we can't. " O wretched man that I am! Who can deliever me from this body of death. I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord".................Romans 7:24 and 25. Thank God for his amazing Mercy and Grace.

Romans 5:12 says 'wherefore as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned."

Death passed upon ALL men for what Adam did. That I believe is how bad sin is.

1 Timothy 2:14 And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner. ( NIV

Psalm 51:5 Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me. (KJV

 

[handy]

1 Timothy 2:14 And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner.

But Romans makes it abundantly clear that it was Adam's sin, not Eve's that brought sin into the world. Eve transgressed, yes, through being deceived.

But Adam was not deceived. His sin was willful disobedience.

 

[josefnospam]

So which is worse...to be decieved and sin or to sin willfully of your own freewill? Adam was not fooled or decieved, but willfully commited sin.
And in so doing plunged all mankind into sin. The result of sin is death. And we are all deserving of death. Sin is REALLY,REALLY bad and we are all sinners. What to do? O wretched man that I am! Who can deliver me from the body of this death. I thank God thru Jesus Christ our Lord.......Romans 7:22

 

[Webers_Home]

.
†. Rom 5:12a . . Sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin

That statement is tricky. It isn't saying that death per se came into the world through one man; but rather "death through sin". In other words; prior to the forbidden fruit incident, death wasn't a consequence for doing something bad; but now it is.

†. Rom 5:12b . . in this way death came to all men, because all sinned.

The word "sinned" is in the past tense. In order for the past tense to apply to all men, it would have to include people who haven't even been born yet. It appears to me then, that innocent babies aren't accounted sinners for something they've done; but simply for being human. In other words: it's a death offense to be a related to Adam.

BTW: the words "all men" have to include Christ otherwise Rom 5:12 would have to be worded "almost all men".

Buen Camino
/

 

[Elijah674]

1 Timothy 2:14 And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner.

But Romans makes it abundantly clear that it was Adam's sin, not Eve's that brought sin into the world. Eve transgressed, yes, through being deceived.

But Adam was not deceived. His sin was willful disobedience.

True that there is a sin not unto death. (unknown... neither were created with full maturity)

And Adams sin was presumptuous knowing that God meant what He said!
And this is the most serious of sins.

See Psalms 19:13 (check out 1 John 5:16.. sin not unto death, one sin that is not premeditated) But David wanted no part of the Great Transgression,
to what he came very near committing?? His confession is documented in Psalms 51.

I find no forgiveness for this sin recorded in the Lords Book! Yet we know that He will forgive up to the time that one can still be reached!

How did that sound?;)

--Elijah