And so it commences....

[handy]

Well, it's coming upon a month now, since Viola violated our trust with her inappropriate texting....

So far, her attendance has been impeccable, no tardies, no unexplained absences. She's been able to entertain a few of her friends at the house in town, but with either Steve or I there.

Last Saturday a situation came up.... One of her friends was coming over later to have supper with us and watch a movie we have that was on an assignment list of his at school. We were in the house in town. I had started to develop a headache at work on Friday, so took off early to take some Ibuprofin and a nap... which meant I had to go back Saturday and get everything done for the Sunday Service. Steve and Thomas were heading up to the ranch to get some much needed chores done in the beautiful weather.

Viola had one of those mechanical babies for a class she's taking... A computerized baby that not only cries, but cries to either be fed or changed or just be cuddled and can register when fed, changed or cuddled... It was "fussy" throughout the night, so she hadn't had that great of a night's sleep. And, since her two best friends spent the night (one was the baby's "daddy") the place was kind of a mess.

What would have been really nice would have been to leave Viola at the Emmett house to rest up and tidy things up, me go on to work, Steve and Thomas head up to the ranch.

...but, could we trust her? How could we possibly know that... as soon as we were gone and she knew she'd have the house to herself for as much as five hours... how would we know for sure that she wouldn't call someone over?

Viola asked us a very valid question: "How can I rebuild trust, if you won't trust me enough to leave me alone?"

A good question and I gave her a rock solid honest answer... "I don't know."

I really don't. How do we go about regaining the trust we once had in her?

Have any of you had kids that violated your trust? Or been kids that violated your parent's trust? Any insights on what to do?

Viola went to work with me, then when I was done we went back to the house, got busy and tidied things up and had things more or less in order when Adam got there.

But, I really don't know what to do. I don't want to frustrate her efforts to remain on the straight and narrow by refusing to allow her some slack on the leash... but as of now, I'm still sort of shell-shocked that she texted what she did to that kid.

Once again, and wholly unbeknownst to him, Joe came to her rescue... He made a point to come over to talk to us as I was picking up some groceries for supper Sunday night (we wound up staying in town until Tuesday... long story). As we were leaving he said, "By the way Viola, I want to talk with you when we get a chance. I'm working on a project with a friend and we'd like your help."

Well, that turned a young girls heart to love. I had to remind her to breathe, it was pretty cute. This is the first time to my knowledge that Joe made a special request of her. His friend is taking a cinematography class and Joe has written, choreographed and will direct some scenes for her to film... he'd like Viola to be one of the actors...

Which is all fine with us... I trust her more with Joe than I do when she's at home with us.... Working on this project will give her something productive to do, allow her some social time after school, and it will be under the watchful eye of Joe... all good.

But, it still leaves us with how to we begin to trust her to be on her own... While this will keep her busy, it really won't be a test of trustworthiness on her part. More time will go by, but there will still be a need to one day be able to believe that she'll toe the line, even if we (or Joe) aren't around.

 

[reba]

Sure is neat when we see God jumping in! I wondered where you have been. It is easier with boys, it just is, there is light... it really is not forever...:yes

One of these days you will just have to let it go.. You have been a great Mom. My mom had her hands full with me. Classic PK 2 for the early 60s... boys ,cutting school, boys, smoking, boys, lying , boys..... In most areas where she gave me a bit of freedom i respected the trust the tighter she held the more i rebelled. The way you let her go with Joe I see as one of those freedom things.

Mom prayed and prayed for me.. dropping lit matches in a gas can that didn't explode yup prayer works. You well know how prayer works....God has blessed your kids with a very good mom!

 

[Sparkey]

When dealing with trust issues with boys (I didn't have daughters) the way that I explained it was in terms of Dunn and Bradstreet ratings. I told my son that companies depended on solid "A" or "A+" ratings but that they had to earn them with solid performance. When he understood the analogy to his performance I dropped the bombshell,

"No company could possibly expect any change of rating without at least 6 months of solid performance. How long do you think we should expect you to do well?"

It was one of those "tough" questions because he wanted me to believe that he was 100% committed so a long period of doing right shouldn't be objectionable. We never agreed on a specific timeframe but the understanding of exactly why lying damages credibility came though.

The thing that is difficult to get over when your daughter speaks about earning your trust is that this was the exact circumstance that precipitated the prior violation. The first post described the circumstance, "Last Saturday night, after all our talking about trust, honesty, the need to remain open about what she is doing and who she is with..."

Today I hear, "One month later, after talking about trust..."

Pardon my being skeptical but this is either a repeat or not but it is too early to tell.

My thought is that mistakes will be made during the time that children are becoming adults and the best we can hope for is to mitigate the damages so that the things that happen to them while they are under our care won't have life-long effect. 3 months might seem a long time (especially approaching summer), might even seem a lifetime, but when your daughter says, "You know, Mom --I get it. I lied and talked to you as if I was doing well and all the while I was planning on betraying our trust. It must be very difficult for you..." In other words, when she is able to truly consider your point-of-view and answer as if ...

I like the idea of the "fussy baby" a lot. It amuses and hopefully will help her transition her thinking toward the "wholeness" of attitude that parents continually look for in their children. I'd also second Reba's vote of confidence while marveling at how God matches us, prepares us, strengthens us (throughout our lifetimes) for the task of raising and training the child He loves. You two seem well matched to me and you're doing the very rightest thing, loving your daughter is the burden of the Lord that is fitted and fits. The signal that the tide is turning will be seen by you first and the best advice that I can give is to trust your own heart in the matter. Even my best intentioned advice cannot replace that (as you already know).

 

[Sparkey]

I mentioned "wholeness" because somewhere along the line I heard that in Hebrew the root word for holiness is wholeness. It's more than being seperate but it includes being seperated, but the concept (I was told) means being complete and well fitted, with every part that is needed and functioning well.

We are striving for wholeness in our children. Let them be equipped to meet every challenge of adulthood with all the tools they need working in good order. Holiness can appear like we expect our children to go around with lemon juice in their mouth, all puckered up, but if while reading the bible we substitute "Wholeness" every time we hear "holiness" (while keeping the "be seperate" admonition in mind too) we will better understand what the Spirit of the Lord is saying. One concept considers a price (expecially to teens, "we might lose friends?") whereas the other considers benefit and long-term. It leads into the concept of perfection (being complete and mature) but that's another thought....

 

[handy]

Thanks so much for the vote of confidence, Reba, Spar...

I do appreciate the insights... And thanks Sparrowhawke for the Dunn and Bradstreet analogy... I guess we are tying to trust a bit too soon.

Other than a clear attendance record, we really don't have any "solid performance" from her that she has become more trustworthy... And the attendance record isn't all that great of a litmus test, because she knows that I can access her attendance on a daily basis.

We'll keep her on the leash a while longer. She can do this project with Joe, she'll be happy doing it, and we won't need to worry about her as long as he's with her... but other than that, she'll have to have one of us around.

 

[Nikki]

IMO, teens can't be trusted. The peer pressure is so great. All we can really do is PRAY that they make the right choices. I pray a lot for God to protect my girls from harm and help them make the right choices. I used to think my oldest would give me the most problems...which she does attitude-wise...but she's got a good head on her shoulders when it comes to peer pressure. She could care less about fitting in. She's an individual and is ok with that right now.

My youngest, on the other hand, is about to finish up her first year of middle school. You know middle school is where girls REALLY change. I can see her trying to fit in. I can tell she wants to be popular and she's also boy crazy. She has a boyfriend all the time but I never let her do anything with them outside of school. I just think she's too young at 12 (she'll be 13 this summer). She's ok with that right now and doesn't put up too much of a fuss. I really worry about her though.

Girls are so hard to raise!!!

 

[CalledToServe]

Dora, are there any movies or books "out there" that have a sweet love story. about not giving into sex?

There is a wonderful movie that deals directly with the subject of parenting and I believe you all would really enjoy it with your families. It's called Courageous.

It's based from a dad's perspective, but it will help anyone with children. The summary is that a father of a young daughter has his daughter die in a car accident. He scours the Bible for how to be a Biblical parent and creates a covenant with his family to be a better father to his wife and his remaining son.

He gets his co-workers at the sheriff's department to join in with him as they create their own covenants with their own kids. One of his co-workers has a teenage daughter and has to deal with the subject that I see a few moms here have to deal with. His daughter wants to date a boy and the boy isn't a Christian. The father makes his daughter understand that the boy doesn't respect her and only wants to use her to his own satisfaction. This dad makes a covenant with his daughter by taking her out to dinner and gives her a promise ring. The promise is that she would abide by her dad's decisions and will only take the ring off the day she is walked down the aisle.

Might I suggest that the parents in this thread make a covenant with their kids and to guide their children as God wants them to guided? If you do, I would recommend having your pastor officiate the ceremony and make really nice certificates to display in your house as a constant reminder of the role that God has placed us in.

Link to the movie: Click Here!

 

[reba]

Do the math

Our Daughter was on restriction until, med January, the semester break, because of grades first grandson was born October.
It did not matter to his mom what they did at her home... my lesson learned too late..

 

[GojuBrian]

I feel your pain handy! My14yr old dtep daughter is going something very similar.

I think at that age they just can't be trusted no matter what. I think they are going to say and whatever they can to get out of trouble, get their stuff back, just so they can go on doing just what they told you they were not going to do.

Sheesh! It's just a hard row to hoe....... My

 

[handy]

Oh, Goju... that business of just saying what they think we want to hear...:mad

Viola used to be so open and honest... it was always Thomas that was the sneaky one...

But lately, sheesh... she'll just roll her eyes and parrot whatever she thinks we need to hear to get her way.

Gahhh... If we can only survive the next few years..

 

[Nikki]

I LOVE this forum! It's like a support group for parents of teens! Maybe we can all help each other through the next few years.

 

[Sparkey]

My two used to plan their narratives so that if they wanted parents to believe they went to the mall (instead of what they really did) they would script out their conversation in advance:

Son #1: "Yeah, thanks for the Orange Julias you bought me; that was nice."
Son #2: "I didn't buy you an Orange Julias. We went to the Burger King and I got you a Dr. Pepper!"
Son #1: "Oh, yeah. You're right, now that I think about it. I must have been confused."

So they scripted an argument into their conversation in order to make it more convincing. Kids learn to lie and decieve and some have a real talent for it. When they got older they showed me some of the things they learned from --there's a song that describes bold-faced lying and denial. They played it for me. The girfriend catches the boyfriend taking a shower with another woman. The song says "deny it," --> It didn't happen. Even with their hand caught in the cookie jar they are taught to deny, deny, deny. The song is called, "It wasn't me."

Part of the lycrics:

Whenever you should see her make the giggolo flex
As funny as it be by you, it not that complex
Seeing is believing so you better change your specs
You know she not gonna be worrying bout things from the past
Hardly recollecting and then she’ll go to noontime mass
​

The decieved isn't interested in the past and can be expected to shrug the issue off by going to mass (and taking comfort in religious beliefs).