Appeal of Calvinism....

[Rick W]

Jay T.
Your mixing spirit and physical. The body still dies. The spirit lives unto eternal life.
By your opinion Paul wasn't saved for he too sinned during his ministry.
Yes, I'm a sinner. Sown corruptable, raised incorruptable. Sown in the flesh, raised in the spirit. For the body dies, ashes to ashes, dust to dust. But the spirit lives by the grace of God and the gift of His Son Jesus Christ.



Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
Rom 7:15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
Rom 7:16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
Rom 7:17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
Rom 7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
Rom 7:20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
Rom 7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
Rom 7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
Rom 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

 

[Jay T]

Jay T.
Your mixing spirit and physical. The body still dies. The spirit lives unto eternal life.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Is eternal life promised to those who DO NOT believe in Jesus Christ ?

By your opinion Paul wasn't saved for he too sinned during his ministry.

Acts 24:16 And herein do I exercise myself, to have always a conscience void of offence toward God, and [toward] men.
How could Paul have said this if he had sinned ?

Yes, I'm a sinner. Sown corruptable, raised incorruptable. Sown in the flesh, raised in the spirit. For the body dies, ashes to ashes, dust to dust. But the spirit lives by the grace of God and the gift of His Son Jesus Christ.



Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
Rom 7:15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
Rom 7:16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
Rom 7:17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
Rom 7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
Rom 7:20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
Rom 7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
Rom 7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
Rom 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

YES....verse 24....those who are saved, would not have said this.

As the saved person already has been delivered from sin, which results in eternal death.

Now read Romans, chapter 8.....as this is a 'saved' person.

 

[Rick W]

So you're saying you haven't sinned since you were saved or that it is impossible for you to sin?

 

[Fnerb]

YES....verse 24....those who are saved, would not have said this.

As the saved person already has been delivered from sin, which results in eternal death.

Now read Romans, chapter 8.....as this is a 'saved' person.

So you are saying from when he wrote those words, from then on he never comited another sin the rest of his time on earth?

 

[stranger]

PotLuck quoted:

Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
Rom 7:15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
Rom 7:16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
Rom 7:17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
Rom 7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
Rom 7:20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
Rom 7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
Rom 7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
Rom 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin

Hi PotLuck,

Is this the 'norm' for the Christian life - Rom 7 ?

 

[Jay T]

So you're saying you haven't sinned since you were saved or that it is impossible for you to sin?

I'm saying that when a person believes in Jesus Christ, they CAN live a life without further sinning......
1 John 3:1 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.
3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
3:3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.
3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
3:5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
3:6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Now, the question is.....is this Bible Scripture, valid truth, or is it a lie ?

 

[Rick W]

Yes, pretty much stranger. I've yet to know any believer that says they are pleased with their part of their walk with Christ. When someone loves Christ with a genuine passion to do so there's always a desire to be more like Him, to please the one they worship as their Lord and Savior no matter what one is already doing or not doing.
"Are you as close to Him as you want to be?"
"Are you doing as much as you can in your desire to please Christ?"
The majority answer these questions with, "No".
It is our hope, our faith that He will return. It's our hope and faith to be with Him in heaven, to go home.

Philemon 1:21 For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.
Philemon 1:22 But if I live in the flesh, this is the fruit of my labor: yet what I shall choose I wot not.
Philemon 1:23 For I am in a strait between two, having a desire to depart, and to be with Christ; which is far better:
Philemon 1:24 Nevertheless to abide in the flesh is more needful for you.

.

 

[Rick W]

Jay T,
I'm not concerned about someone else or what they can or cannot do.
I'm asking if you are saying you haven't sinned since you were saved or that it is impossible for you to sin?
In your own words Jay T. have you sinned since you were saved?

 

[Rick W]

Stranger,
Every believer I've known struggles with something. The spirit is constantly at odds with the flesh. Where once the flesh and spirit were one now after salvation they become separate. The flesh cannot please God. The flesh is condemned to die but the spirit will live unto everlasting life Through the blood of the cross, Jesus Christ.


Galatians 5:17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.



Romans 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

Matthew 26:41 Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.

John 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

Romans 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

 

[stranger]

Stranger,
Every believer I've known struggles with something. The spirit is constantly at odds with the flesh. Where once the flesh and spirit were one now after salvation they become separate. The flesh cannot please God. The flesh is condemned to die but the spirit will live unto everlasting life Through the blood of the cross, Jesus Christ.


Galatians 5:17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

Romans 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

Matthew 26:41 Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.

John 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

Romans 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

Hi,

I very much agree with the distinctions between flesh and Spirit - but my question concerned what is the 'norm' that is to be held up for the Christian life. There are two candidates for this norm:

If it is Rom 7 then we are in trouble until we breathe our last for we will have lived as slaves to sin. In Rom 7 Paul refers to this as the body of death and asks who will deliver us from it? Then he gives thanks and another norm is offered. . .

The other norm is based on eg Rom 6:1-4 where we are crucified with Christ, buried with Christ and raised with Christ to walk in newness of life.
In this life there is joy, peace and blessedness. . .
So the question I ask is this:

Can the flesh survive crucifixion, burial and resurrection with Christ our Lord?


Thus the two norms are summarized:

If you live according to the flesh you will die, if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body you will live.

I know of the struggle you speak - and what it is to be carnal, but I have also known periods of peace where this struggle did not exist in His rest. I refer back to Adam - he had no compulsion or desire to sin prior to the fall. Yet it was possible that he could sin but not because he had to.

 

[Rick W]

The body is buried never to be resurrected as such.
If so then the thought of cremation would be absolute terror for a christian.

I am saved, now, at this very moment.
With that said this thread could easily turn into a debate of "once saved always saved" of which I don't care to debate anyway.
However, I admit my guilt of sin even so. I can sin even in my heart without doing the act.

Matthew 5:27 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
Matthew 5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

And there's pride. It's here on this forum all the time. Not many care to lose an "argument" or debate. In fact, some will still uphold their egos, uphold their views, even in the face of overwhelming evidence. Of which I too am guilty. I'm not immune to pride anymore than anyone else. Yet, the spirit cries out against pride for the spirit knows the evils of the flesh.
I rejoice in the fact I will not get what I deserve. And that peace can be found only in Christ.

Some say this is an "easy believism" but it's not. For my spirit desires to please the Son, for I love Him. We do strive to please even those we love while here in this world and if/when we falter we don't feel comfortable about it. I sin, yes, and my spirit cries out against it.

Before I was saved my spirit knew not the things I held as ok as being sin. I used to feel it was OK for one-night stands between two consenting adults. And adultery was bad only if you got caught. It was ok to take revenge since it seemed to be upheld in society especially through the entertainment industry. Some even get applauded for it. Getting drunk or stoned was ok too as long as I didn't hurt anybody. After all, many actually brag about how drunk they got over the weekend. In short, my spirit upheld the deeds of the flesh.

But my mind was changed concerning these things. Repentance. Yet, my body wars against the renewed spirit and will continue to do so as long as it lives. We can strive to be accountable by fellowship seeking help even from those who themselves struggle against something else or possibly the same thing. Herein lies the strength of fellowship. Most of all herein lies acknowledgment, the recognition of sin and the desire not to do it. That can only come from the regenerated spirit through our Lord and savior Jesus Christ. And herein lies our freedom, our peace from the corruption of the flesh.

I know of the struggle you speak - and what it is to be carnal, but I have also known periods of peace where this struggle did not exist in His rest.

Absolutely!

:smt023

 

[Jay T]

Jay T,
I'm not concerned about someone else or what they can or cannot do.
I'm asking if you are saying you haven't sinned since you were saved or that it is impossible for you to sin?
In your own words Jay T. have you sinned since you were saved?

Yes, I can quarantee that I have sinned....UNKNOWINGLY.

It is the Known sins, that God is concerned with.

Breaking any one of the 10 commandments (Exodus 20:3-17) is known sin, and will be punished with eternal death....IF....not repentent of, and forsaken forever.

It is knowingly, going against God's commandments....that is the issue in the Great Controversy Between Satan and Christ.

Satan says that No man can keep the commandments of God.
God as Christ says...YES, man can keep the commandments.

It is the Christian, who decides who is right and who is wrong !

 

[Fnerb]

IF....not repentent of, and forsaken forever.

I think this is the key. All of us have sinned and fallen short. I think the danger lies when a sin doesn't bother the believer anymore. Guilt over sin is sign of spiritual life.

 

[Rick W]

Yes, I can quarantee that I have sinned....UNKNOWINGLY.

It is the Known sins, that God is concerned with.

Breaking any one of the 10 commandments (Exodus 20:3-17) is known sin, and will be punished with eternal death....IF....not repentent of, and forsaken forever.

It is knowingly, going against God's commandments....that is the issue in the Great Controversy Between Satan and Christ.

Satan says that No man can keep the commandments of God.
God as Christ says...YES, man can keep the commandments.

It is the Christian, who decides who is right and who is wrong !

Again, you can't mask or hide the deeds of the heart.

"It is the Christian, who decides who is right and who is wrong"

Be very careful with that one. Pride can be a very deceptive attribute of man, of the heart. Somehow I can't bring myself to agree with that statement.

Well Jay T. You have a lot of trust and faith in yourself. And I think you're rather proud of that stance. But, as alluring as that opinion may be I just can't buy into it.
:smt102

 

[stranger]

PotLuck wrote: The body is buried never to be resurrected as such.
If so then the thought of cremation would be absolute terror for a christian.

My concern was not with the body which will one day put on the imperishable but the flesh that the flesh might stay dead in the tomb with Christ in that once off event, hence the baptism into His death and burial. For how can we who have died to sin still live in it? Or shall we sin the grace might abound, by no means? So half the bottom line is consider yourself dead to sin. . . no other consideration concerning the flesh is worthy of our calling.

I am saved, now, at this very moment.
With that said this thread could easily turn into a debate of "once saved always saved" of which I don't care to debate anyway.
However, I admit my guilt of sin even so. I can sin even in my heart without doing the act.

Matthew 5:27 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
Matthew 5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

The litmus test as I call it, of Matt 5:27,28 is, I believe, given to us so that we might know if Christ or sin reigns in our heart. Talk is cheap and if these verses are true of my condition then I am living in the flesh and not the spirit. While this spells bad news for me - and all other men who claim to be walking in the spirit. But as I have said it is possible to be delivered from this and all other sin (and the fear of death) which not only so easily entangles, but so mysteriously enters in.

And there's pride. It's here on this forum all the time. Not many care to lose an "argument" or debate. In fact, some will still uphold their egos, uphold their views, even in the face of overwhelming evidence. Of which I too am guilty. I'm not immune to pride anymore than anyone else. Yet, the spirit cries out against pride for the spirit knows the evils of the flesh. I rejoice in the fact I will not get what I deserve. And that peace can be found only in Christ.

My concern is freedom from sin appropriated so that His peace, love and fellowship are our moment by moment experience.

Some say this is an "easy believism" but it's not. For my spirit desires to please the Son, for I love Him. We do strive to please even those we love while here in this world and if/when we falter we don't feel comfortable about it. I sin, yes, and my spirit cries out against it.

Before I was saved my spirit knew not the things I held as ok as being sin. I used to feel it was OK for one-night stands between two consenting adults. And adultery was bad only if you got caught. It was ok to take revenge since it seemed to be upheld in society especially through the entertainment industry. Some even get applauded for it. Getting drunk or stoned was ok too as long as I didn't hurt anybody. After all, many actually brag about how drunk they got over the weekend. In short, my spirit upheld the deeds of the flesh.

But my mind was changed concerning these things. Repentance. Yet, my body wars against the renewed spirit and will continue to do so as long as it lives. We can strive to be accountable by fellowship seeking help even from those who themselves struggle against something else or possibly the same thing. Herein lies the strength of fellowship. Most of all herein lies acknowledgment, the recognition of sin and the desire not to do it. That can only come from the regenerated spirit through our Lord and savior Jesus Christ. And herein lies our freedom, our peace from the corruption of the flesh.

Have you ever wondered about the event in the OT when an Israelite took a Midianite woman into the tabernacle in full view of Moses (?) and the elders? Pinehas took his spear and killed them both preventing yet another plague spreading among the Israelites and claiming more victims. In this shadow of the OT two gospels were preached, but only one was the Gospel of Christ.

 

[Jay T]

Again, you can't mask or hide the deeds of the heart.

"It is the Christian, who decides who is right and who is wrong"

Be very careful with that one. Pride can be a very deceptive attribute of man, of the heart. Somehow I can't bring myself to agree with that statement.

Well Jay T. You have a lot of trust and faith in yourself. And I think you're rather proud of that stance. But, as alluring as that opinion may be I just can't buy into it.
:smt102

Apparently you didn't read all I wrote.

I said .......
Satan says, man CANNOT keep the commandments of God.
God says, man CAN....keep the commandments.

It is up to the Christian, to determine who is right.

Romans 6:16 "Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness ? "

 

[Rick W]

Breaking any one of the 10 commandments (Exodus 20:3-17) is known sin, and will be punished with eternal death....IF....not repentent of, and forsaken forever.

John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

John 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

There's more than just the 10 commandments.

Matthew 22:36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
Matthew 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Matthew 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Matthew 22:39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.
Matthew 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.


What is love?


1 Corinthians 13:2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
1 Corinthians 13:3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
1 Corinthians 13:4 Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
1 Corinthians 13:5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
1Corinthians 13:6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
1Corinthians 13:7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.

1 Corinthians 13:13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.


John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.
Matthew 22:39 ...Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.


Love suffereth long.
Love is kind.
Love envieth not.
Love vaunteth not itself.
Love is not puffed up.
Love doth not behave itself unseemly.
Love seeketh not her own.
Love is not easily provoked.
Love thinketh no evil.
Love rejoiceth not in iniquity.
Love rejoiceth in the truth.
Love beareth all things.
Love believeth all things.
Love hopeth all things.
Love endureth all things.

Yes, I can quarantee that I have sinned....UNKNOWINGLY.

1John 3:23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.
1John 3:24 And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.

Does this discribe you Jay T.?

Jay T. suffereth long.
Jay T. is kind.
Jay T. envieth not.
Jay T. vaunteth not himself.
Jay T. is not puffed up.
Jay T. doth not behave himself unseemly.
Jay T. seeketh not his own.
Jay T. is not easily provoked.
Jay T. thinketh no evil.
Jay T. rejoiceth not in iniquity.
Jay T. rejoiceth in the truth.
Jay T. beareth all things.
Jay T. believeth all things.
Jay T. hopeth all things.
Jay T. endureth all things.

Unknowingly? I seriously doubt that claim.

Believers can knowingly become angered, resentful, jealous, envious... any number of sins against the commandent to love one another. The difference is what we do about it. We can admit the error, we can ask forgiveness not only from Christ buit also those we sinned against. We can say we're sorry and really mean it. We can lower our self-esteem to at least attempt to set things right.
We can humble ourselves.

1 John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

... if Christ or sin reigns in our heart.

:smt023



Characterized by a life of sin or a life not characterized by sin?
Yes, I was the former and reborn into the latter. Do I love my neighbor as commanded? Not always. And I don't know anyone who can say they do. Yet, our spirit comes through to those around us. Are we characteristically grumpy, callous, rude, vulgar, self-centered or selfish? No, not if we have given our lives to Christ. Will we err? Absolutely. But our lives will not reflect the person we were before we accepted Christ, surrendered to Him. Before I was saved all I thought about was "saving face" or protecting my ego. We have the option to make ammends or not, to humble oneself even if it means eating crow or pulling one's foot out of one's mouth. I've known believers to do so even when they knew they were right about non-essential issues. But to keep the peace they humbled themselves without regard to "looking good". Is this what we do or do we continue to protect our pride?

I said .......
Satan says, man CANNOT keep the commandments of God.
God says, man CAN....keep the commandments.

Though I indeed see your point You give Satan far too much credit.

John 2:24 But Jesus did not commit himself unto them, because he knew all men,
John 2:25 And needed not that any should testify of man: for he knew what was in man.

 

[Solo]

Lying is sin.
Deception is sin.
False teaching is sin.
False Witness is sin.
Rejecting the Holy Spirit is sin.

 

[Jay T]

Lying is sin.

Lying, is the same as taking the Lord's name in vain.....pretending to be a Christian, when their actions prove, that they are NOT.

Deception is sin.

YES.....when a person refuses to 'DO' what the Bible says, they are deceived......
James 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.

1:22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

False teaching is sin.

The Bible provides the TEST as to who has the truth of God.......
Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, [it is] because [there is] no light in them.

False Witness is sin.

Accusers of the brethren are not few, and they are always active when God is at work and His servants are rendering Him true homage.

They will put a false coloring upon the words and acts of those who love and obey the truth.

They will represent the most earnest, zealous, self-denying servants of Christ as deceived or deceivers.

It is their work to misrepresent the motives of every true and noble deed, to circulate insinuations, and arouse suspicion in the minds of the inexperienced.

In every conceivable manner they will seek to cause that which is pure and righteous to be regarded as foul and deceptive.

The Bible says that Satan, accuses the brethern (Rev. 12:10). Matthew 5:10 Blessed [are] they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.

Rejecting the Holy Spirit is sin.

I agree !
When the Holy Spirit tries to convince a person of their wrong course of action, and they refuse to be corrected....they drive the Holy Spirirt away from themselves.
(Isaiah 59:2)

AND.....Since my job description is (Revelation 18:4,5)......
33:8 When I say unto the wicked, O wicked [man], thou shalt surely die; if thou dost not speak to warn the wicked from his way, that wicked [man] shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand. 33:9 Nevertheless, if thou warn the wicked of his way to turn from it; if he do not turn from his way, he shall die in his iniquity; but thou hast delivered thy soul.

 

[Rick W]

Jay T,
I'm not concerned about someone else or what they can or cannot do.
I'm asking if you are saying you haven't sinned since you were saved or that it is impossible for you to sin?
In your own words Jay T. have you sinned since you were saved?

Yes, I can quarantee that I have sinned....UNKNOWINGLY.

I'll pray that the congregation be just like you. And I'll pray for the pastor too since he's admitted on occasion to doing that which you have not. You are a true example of the utmost character to all of christianity. You need to start a ministry to teach the world to be so blameless. Might do them some good right?