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Bible Study Are We Making Disciples or Just Big Crowds?

ezra

ezra

Member
dont post alot of stuff like this here do to the politics in nature here . but this i agree %100 with.. might i add this not about how bad church is or one can't find a church they like

churchleaders.com

Are We Making Disciples or Just Big Crowds?

Jared Wilson is concerned the evangelical church's drive for numeric growth has had an unintended casualty: discipleship and spiritual growth.
churchleaders.com churchleaders.com
 
ezra said:
gee i give up you tell me
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Those who don't build the Temple through Grace by Faith (Christ and Him Crucified) clearly shows they haven't totally surrendered their life over to Christ. Why? Because everything you do and everything you have will be that hinderance to you (Galatians 5:7 NKJV).

13 “Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. 14 But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it. Matthew 7:13-14 NIV
 
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iLOVE said:
Those who don't build the Temple through Grace by Faith (Christ and Him Crucified) clearly shows they haven't totally surrendered their life over to Christ. Why? Because everything you do and everything you have will be that hinderance to you (Galatians 5:7 NKJV).

13 “Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. 14 But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it. Matthew 7:13-14 NIV
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that is rather obvious its called quantity not quality ..there is a possibility some are saved but never got off the milk ..lots of this falls under the leadership ..one of the objections have to the new way of service in church... they have a hour of worship 30 min max preaching . lots of that is enfamil preaching
 
might i add a story a man told working on a sheep farm.. one of the sheep was not drinking or eating... the worker tried to help the sheep eat and drink..the farmer come along said let it be it has the will to die.. today you can have a good pastor but the sheep fail to eat and drink from the table spread before them.
 
ezra said:
might i add a story a man told working on a sheep farm.. one of the sheep was not drinking or eating... the worker tried to help the sheep eat and drink..the farmer come along said let it be it has the will to die.. today you can have a good pastor but the sheep fail to eat and drink from the table spread before them.
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If the Pastor is not preaching Christ and Him Crucified it is poison in the pot. The sheep is being feed the law of sin and death. 2 Kings 4:40
 
The Cross is the Power of God for the Believer. The sin debt was paid and the controlling power of sin was broken by the Cross. The Believer who receives that and believes that in term will receive the benefits of that.

“Nailing it to His Cross . . . triumphing over them in it” means that Jesus’ great victory was won on the Cross, and on the Cross exclusively (Col. 2:14-15).

If it is any message other than the Cross, then it’s false doctrine. The Apostle Paul said so (Gal. 1:8-9).”

“18 For the preaching (Message) of the Cross is to them who perish foolishness (Spiritual things cannot be discerned by unredeemed people, but that doesn’t matter; the Cross must be preached just the same, even as we shall see); but unto us who are Saved it is the Power of God. (The Cross is the Power of God simply because it was there that the total sin debt was paid, giving the Holy Spirit, in Whom the Power resides, latitude to work mightily within our lives.) 1 Cor. 1:18

If we preach Jesus alone and ignore the Cross, that is another Jesus (2 Corinthians 11:4). This is sin, a insult to God!

JSM
 
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iLOVE said:
The Cross is the Power of God for the Believer. The sin debt was paid and the controlling power of sin was broken by the Cross. The Believer who receives that and believes that in term will receive the benefits of that.

“Nailing it to His Cross . . . triumphing over them in it” means that Jesus’ great victory was won on the Cross, and on the Cross exclusively (Col. 2:14-15).

If it is any message other than the Cross, then it’s false doctrine. The Apostle Paul said so (Gal. 1:8-9).”

“18 For the preaching (Message) of the Cross is to them who perish foolishness (Spiritual things cannot be discerned by unredeemed people, but that doesn’t matter; the Cross must be preached just the same, even as we shall see); but unto us who are Saved it is the Power of God. (The Cross is the Power of God simply because it was there that the total sin debt was paid, giving the Holy Spirit, in Whom the Power resides, latitude to work mightily within our lives.) 1 Cor. 1:18

If we preach Jesus alone and ignore the Cross, that is another Jesus (2 Corinthians 11:4). This is sin, a insult to God!

JSM
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look i respect bro jimmy very knowledgeable but him nor i nor you hold the answers . so if you want to reply with something ..do it with something other than jsm jimmy is a famous and rich man well known .the two combined lead to other things..
 
if we are not seeking God daily with all our heart we will be rather unattractive to others - and anything we say about God will consequently also be unattractive
 
i dont know. i dont think its a new problem. remember the billy graham crusades? they did what they could for follow up, but very few of those who 'made a decision for Christ' ended up genuinely saved and set free. and...

in reading about the 2 Great Awakenings in the US, it becomes clear that in the 1st one, in the 1700s, ministers kept at an eye on converts for signs of "genuine conversion." In the 2nd one, Finney and others developed evangelism techniques that are still in use today...

and the general time period that saw the 2nd Great Awakening also saw the development of Mormonism and a number of communes, such as the Oneida Community. I don't know....I lean Calvinist (not 110% committed, just the way I lean), so I'm not surprised that focusing on "making a decision for Christ" and such might only result in a hanful of genuinely transformed souls+lives. and then...

Luke 8:4-15.
 
James 1:27 Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

This verse above is the evangelizing of the Church as in the whole of what is to be the body of Christ in making disciples. I remember back in the 70's how many Churches were on fire for the Lord and the moving of the Holy Spirit would hit you smack in the face when you walked through the doors. The preaching brought one to the knowledge of Christ as we were schooled on the word of God. I miss those days.

More so now in many churches it has become emotionalism, vs the true indwelling and movement of the Holy Spirit. You have 45 minutes of worship and praise and maybe 15 minutes of reading some scriptures than out the door you go feeling good, but yet empty of knowledge. It's like what can we do to please the people to get them excited enough to walk through the doors, but neglect the preaching of the Gospels.

How do we fix this is by allowing the order of the seven spirits that are written in Isaiah 11:1, 2 back into the preaching of the Gospel as the congregation is taught from the pulpit by those who have God's calling on them. Just like the seven churches in Asia, Rev 2-3, we can read what God told them that needed fixing and this needs to be the direction of God's Church today. We need to be the Church of Philadelphia that is pleasing to the Father and brings glory to His name.
 
Chopper said:
Good thought Ezra. Making disciples is sadly lacking.
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People qualified to make disciples is sadly lacking.


First a person must have been discipled himself before he can make disciples.


One of the first principles for us to understand about this process is to examine how Jesus made disciples.


One of the first things I see, is He took care of their basic needs from the money bag that Judas carried.


IOW they didn’t tithe to Him.



JLB
 
Making Disciples isn't hard work...it isn't even difficult. But it does require a personal investment and a solid friendship relationship. Discipling others is not about me telling them what to do or what they should think...but gently encouraging them to discover the real truth for themselves. To set a goal that they want for themselves...not what I want for them. (I can't live vicariously through them) That's what being a good mentor is all about. Yes, occasionally they will flounder about like a fish out of water...and you can come in later and let them dig themselves out of their own hole with some guidance. (They gotta stand on their own two feet...and you "saving" them or bailing them out of a jam is not mentoring)

But this whole discipling thing takes years and a lot of good friendship time. No one will care what you know if they don't know that you care. And the only way they will know that you care is by you doing the time and actions that show it.
 
Truthfrees said:
the argentinian believer really missed the intensity of a revival and was very unhappy with north american christianity/religion - he eventually returned to argentina for this reason
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Yes, for good reason.


We desperately need revival in this nation.




JLB
 
iLOVE said:
Those who don't build the Temple through Grace by Faith (Christ and Him Crucified) clearly shows they haven't totally surrendered their life over to Christ. Why?
Click to expand...


Those who don't built the Temple?? It was given to the Son of David to build the Temple. Jesus said I go and prepare a place for you. What temple are you to build?


Know ye not that my Father’s house is a tent; curtains bound together to make one tabernacle? A tent made of flesh, as curtains, bound together by the Spirit of Christ to form one body.


Jeremiah 10:19-20
Woe is me for my hurt! my wound is grievous:
but I said, Truly this is a grief, and I must bear it.
My tabernacle is spoiled, and all my cords are broken:
my children are gone forth of me, and they are not:
there is none to stretch forth my tent any more,
and to set up my curtains.


Isaiah 40:21-22
Have ye not known? have ye not heard?
hath it not been told you from the beginning?
have ye not understood from the foundations of the earth?
It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth,
and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers;
that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain,
and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:


The Son of David said In My Father’s house there are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. John 14:2 He provideth a veil of flesh that he might prepare your heart; to take away your stoney heart and to give you an heart of flesh. For it was said unto David the Lord’s servant that he should not build Him a house of stone, for He goeth from tent to tent, and from one tabernacle to another.


1 Chronicles 17:3-6
And it came to pass the same night, that the word of God came to Nathan, saying, Go and tell David my servant, Thus saith the Lord, Thou shalt not build me an house to dwell in: For I have not dwelt in an house since the day that I brought up Israel unto this day; but have gone from tent to tent, and from one tabernacle to another.
 
How ironic is it that those in places like third world countries who are so severely persecuted by other religions for the sake of Christ know Him better than many Christians here in America. The church needs to get away from being politically correct and being led by a socially acceptable word and get back to the business of being the disciples of Christ no matter what opposition they will face.

John 15:18 If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you. 19 If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you. 20 Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also. 21 But all these things will they do unto you for my name's sake, because they know not him that sent me.
 
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