as a witness against them

[dianegcook]

Shekinahglory

Deuteronomy 32 was before Israel entered the promised land as they had not went over the Jordon yet. The song of Moses is what Moses is speaking to the people of that day he spoke to Israel about God's judgement on those of Israel leaving the Rock of their salvation that brought them out of Egypt going after another rock (false gods/antichrist gods, not the son of perdition that will come in the end of days) and sacrificing unto them. Even when Moses came down from the mount of Sinai after God gave him the commandments the people had already went after strange gods as they returned back to Baal worship even before entering the promised land.

When we read Rev 7:1-8 these servants are the generational 144,000 from the twelve tribes of Israel, except for the tribe of Dan and Ephraim as they fell to idol worship and allowed God to be removed from them, Judges 18:30; 1 Kings12:25-33; Hosea 5:9, 11;Psalms 78:9-17, 65-67. To keep it twelve tribes since Dan and Ephraim are not mentioned in vs. 4-8 the tribe of Joseph appears twice, once under his own name and once under the name of his son Issachar/Manasseh. Judah is mentioned first as Messiah was to come from the lineage of David.

The rock was a type of antichrist as being other gods as there are many antichrist, but nowhere does this chapter speak of the last antichrist being the son of perdition/false Christ or where he comes from, 1 John 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

Not all of Israel are Jews, but Jews and Gentiles that make up the body of Christ. This is hat is meant by "they went out from us, but they were not of us". The last antichrist/false prophet/son of perdition comes from a Gentile nation when you understand the prophecy Daniel gave in Daniel chapter 7.

Israel has always had wars with their enemy. A good example was the Roman invasion in 70AD where over one million Jews were killed and Jerusalem and the Temple was destroyed. During its long history, Jerusalem has been destroyed at least twice, besieged 23 times, attacked 52 times, and captured and recaptured 44 times because they were not obedient to God. Even today they are at war against the Gentile nations as many Jews are being killed in Israel.

Ephraim is the stick of Joseph...
Ezek.37:16-28
19,I will take the stick of Joseph which is in the hand of Ephraim, and the tribes of Israel his fellows, and will put them with him, even with the stick of Judah, and make them one stick.

22, will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel, and ONE KING shall be King over them all, they shall be no more 2 nations...

David My servant shall be their Prince 4 ever....
An everlasting covenant, and will set My sanctuary in the midst of them 4ever.....

I also think that the song of Moses in Deut.32:1-44, is about the end times..
41, Mine hand take hold on judgment, I will render vengeance to Mine enemies, and reward them that hate Me...
43, Rejoice, O ye nations, with His people, for He will avenge the blood of His servants, and will render vengeance to His adversaries.....

 

[dianegcook]

I just thought I would share these verses about Moses, as they are so amazing and beautiful.

The Lord Himself buried Moses.


So Moses the servant of the Lord died there in the land of Moab, according to the word of the Lord. And He buried him in a valley in the land of Moab, opposite Beth Peor; but no one knows his grave to this day. Moses was one hundred and twenty years old when he died. His eyes were not dim nor his natural vigor diminished. And the children of Israel wept for Moses in the plains of Moab thirty days. So the days of weeping and mourning for Moses ended.
Now Joshua the son of Nun was full of the spirit of wisdom, for Moses had laid his hands on him; so the children of Israel heeded him, and did as the Lord had commanded Moses.
But since then there has not arisen in Israel a prophet like Moses, whom the Lord knew face to face, in all the signs and wonders which the Lord sent him to do in the land of Egypt, before Pharaoh, before all his servants, and in all his land, and by all that mighty power and all the great terror which Moses performed in the sight of all Israel. Deuteronomy 34:5-12





JLB

The devil disputed about the body of Moses..Jude 9

 

[daninthelionsden]

I don't believe in Replacement Theology. Never have. Never will.

 

[JLB]

The devil disputed about the body of Moses..Jude 9

Yes.


My focus was on the beautiful image of the Lord Himself burying Moses.

Probably why Michael rebuked the devil so easily.



JLB

 

[for_his_glory]

Ephraim is the stick of Joseph...
Ezek.37:16-28
19,I will take the stick of Joseph which is in the hand of Ephraim, and the tribes of Israel his fellows, and will put them with him, even with the stick of Judah, and make them one stick.

22, will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel, and ONE KING shall be King over them all, they shall be no more 2 nations...

David My servant shall be their Prince 4 ever....
An everlasting covenant, and will set My sanctuary in the midst of them 4ever.....

I also think that the song of Moses in Deut.32:1-44, is about the end times..
41, Mine hand take hold on judgment, I will render vengeance to Mine enemies, and reward them that hate Me...
43, Rejoice, O ye nations, with His people, for He will avenge the blood of His servants, and will render vengeance to His adversaries.....

The two sticks, one being Judah and the other Joseph, will God bring together in the end of days as He unites Judah and Israel making them one nation. The stick of Joseph was taken from the hand of Ephraim, as like Dan, they never repented of their sin of going after idols making them their god and for this God cut them off. This is why in Rev 7:4-8 Dan and Ephraim are not mentioned within the numbering of each tribe.

 

[dianegcook]

The two sticks, one being Judah and the other Joseph, will God bring together in the end of days as He unites Judah and Israel making them one nation. The stick of Joseph was taken from the hand of Ephraim, as like Dan, they never repented of their sin of going after idols making them their god and for this God cut them off. This is why in Rev 7:4-8 Dan and Ephraim are not mentioned within the numbering of each tribe.

Joseph represents Ephraim...
Num.1:32

 

[for_his_glory]

Joseph represents Ephraim...
Num.1:32

To keep it twelve tribes since Dan and Ephraim are not mentioned in Rev 7: 4-8 the tribe of Joseph appears twice, once under his own name and once under the name of his son Issachar/Manasseh.

 

[Randy]

I don't believe in Replacement Theology. Never have. Never will.

This I know.
It is through Jesus, not any nation, that Gods promises are fulfilled to Abraham and David. Promises that were to be in place "forever".

I think if the descendants of the first believers remained in the faith they would be called Christians in this day and age as Jesus is called Christ. The new covenant was introduced to them FIRST.

Jesus is LORD of "all" and is the seed of Abraham in regard to His incarnation.

The covenant God made with Abraham was based on a promise. The law introduced does not set aside that promise.
For if the inheritance depends on the law, then it no longer depends on the promise; but God in his grace gave it to Abraham through a promise.

A person is not a Jew who is one only outwardly, nor is circumcision merely outward and physical. No, a person is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a person’s praise is not from other people, but from God.

children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband's will, but born of God.

The gospel will be preached in Jerusalem until the end -Rev 11 1260 days as I read.

 

[Shekinahglory]

Our indifference is that I don't believe antichrist/false prophet/ son of perdition will come out of Israel being a Jew, but through that of the last of the four empires. I do know he will take his seat in Jerusalem as he deceived the nations.

https://www.templeinstitute.org/beged/priestly_garments-10.htm i DON'T KNOW HOW TO PUT A LINK ON SORRY.

…24Therefore, this is what the Lord GOD says: ‘Because you have drawn attention to your guilt, exposing your transgressions, so that your sins are revealed in all your deeds—because you have come to remembrance, you shall be taken in hand. 25And you, O profane and wicked prince of Israel, the day has come for your final punishment.’ 26This is what the Lord GOD says: ‘Remove the turban, and take off the crown. Things will not remain as they are: Exalt the lowly and bring low the exalted.…

We are shown the one I believe will be anti-Christ dressed in the role of the High Priest. I believe anti-Christ not only opposes Christ but he counterfeits the Christ to the extent it could almost fool the elect. It is a Jewish man that anti-Christ will appear as just as Christ was born Jewish in the flesh. We are shown that anti-Christ has the High Priests turban and crown and he is imitating the Lord as our Great High Priest. The view of Ez. 28 with the breastplate of gold and 9 stones fitted in it is a picture of Christ again but Christ has 12 stones and anti-Christ only nine stones. What can account for that anti-Christ will only have nine tribes because three of them get destroyed Zec. 11 whereas the Lord has all 12 tribes in His Breastplate.

 

[for_his_glory]

I have read through that site a few years ago as it was part of my research, but I don't think there will ever be a third Temple built as God is not going to honor anything built by hands anymore, Acts 7:48-50. Plus it would be an abomination to Christ if they even try to bring back the sacrifices. The Muslims will never give the Dome of the Rock over to the Jews.

We can agree the son of perdition being the last antichrist, 1 John 2:18-29, does oppose Christ and will counterfeit Him as many will be deceived in taking his mark. But, yet we will have to disagree on him being a Jew from Jerusalem as per what I sent you.

Actually there is only two tribes not mentioned in Rev 7:1-8 being that of Dan and Ephraim as even their generations have never repented for going after other God's and are in the stronghold Satan has over them.

Ezekiel 28 is about the fall of the prince of Tyre that I have already posted before as God likens him to that of Satan when he was in the garden of Eden before he became prideful and iniquity was found in him.

 

[Shekinahglory]

We can agree the son of perdition being the last antichrist, 1 John 2:18-29, does oppose Christ and will counterfeit Him as many will be deceived in taking his mark. But, yet we will have to disagree on him being a Jew from Jerusalem as per what I sent you.

what do you think of the possibility that Judas was the incarnate son of perdition? The Lord said that Judas was "The" Son of Perdition. There are some other verses that speak towards this same teaching but we can start with the Lord applying to Judas a title that is only applied to Satan/anti-Christ.

How are you?

 

[for_his_glory]

what do you think of the possibility that Judas was the incarnate son of perdition? The Lord said that Judas was "The" Son of Perdition. There are some other verses that speak towards this same teaching but we can start with the Lord applying to Judas a title that is only applied to Satan/anti-Christ.

How are you?

I'm trying to get over a cold, but doing good and hope you are the same

God is not going to bring back the spirit of Judas and incarnate him in the flesh. This is only a suggestion made by D. A. Carson of his interpretation of John 17:12 that has been caught on by many.

If you notice in Matthew 27:3 Judas repented of what he did, but the guilt of betraying Jesus was to great for him to bear so he hung himself. We have no idea if Judas will be with the Lord or not as it's possible God forgave him after he repented as he was part of God's plan in the beginning. Judas either repented meaning he was sorry for what he had done or that it could have been possible he repented to God, but the grief was to much to bear. I don't think anyone could possibly know for sure.

In John 17:12 it never names Judas as being the son of perdition. Judas never once exalted himself being above God as being God or will come claiming he is Christ in the end of days. Son of perdition means the one doomed to destruction as this is what happens to the son of perdition/last antichrist when he literally comes to Jerusalem and takes his seat on the very Temple mount of God, but not a temple built by Jewish hands.

 

[Shekinahglory]

I'm trying to get over a cold, but doing good and hope you are the same

sorry to hear of your cold I am doing well thanks. Praying for your swift recovery. How would you feel if I sent you to like general delivery to your post office the book by Arthur W. Pink called The Anti-Christ. I think he has done the most exhaustive study on anti-Christ and I think he pre-dates Carson. I would like to hear your thoughts. His studies about 40 commentaries are all available online if you would care to do it that way.

 

[for_his_glory]

sorry to hear of your cold I am doing well thanks. Praying for your swift recovery. How would you feel if I sent you to like general delivery to your post office the book by Arthur W. Pink called The Anti-Christ. I think he has done the most exhaustive study on anti-Christ and I think he pre-dates Carson. I would like to hear your thoughts. His studies about 40 commentaries are all available online if you would care to do it that way.

I'm feeling much better today, thank you for praying.

I have listened to that video before within my 40 years of researching end time events, but yet he only speaks of a suggestive teaching without the full context of scripture and the history of Biblical eras. His is like so many other commentators as they borrow from each other and write their books for profit. This is the same as the false pretrib rapture theory that stemmed from man's theories, but, yet not found in the scriptures.

If you study the history of the persecutions, even to death, against the people of Judah, Israel, Jerusalem and the antichrist priest/kings that have ruled over them it has never been an antichrist Jew that has fought against Jerusalem destroying the city, killing million of Jews and destroying the Temple twice with the last time being in 70AD. It has always been an antichrist ruling power from the conquest of each of the four ruling Empires with the last one whose wound was healed in 1929 by Mussolini. They all have rejected God and His Son Christ Jesus as Satan works through them as they come against God's people, but in the end of days will include every nation here on earth as Satan will work through the son of perdition who will be the last antichrist who will deceive the nations into taking its mark causing their own damnation as they knew not the truths of God.

Daniel 2, 7, 9 history begins with Nimrod and the tower of babel as he moved on and established the Babylonian Empire. From that time forth there have been three other conquering Empires that succeeded out of the Babylonian Empire and have ruled over Judah and Israel destroying many times that of Jerusalem, the Temple and killing millions of Jews throughout history. The last Empire that ruled over Jerusalem was the Roman Empire of which Christ was crucified under by Roman law of crucifixion. Again in 70AD the Roman Empire destroyed Jerusalem and the Temple killing a large number of Jews. All are of Israel, but not all are a part of Israel, meaning both Jew and Gentile live there.

 

[stovebolts]

I just thought I would share these verses about Moses, as they are so amazing and beautiful.

The Lord Himself buried Moses.


So Moses the servant of the Lord died there in the land of Moab, according to the word of the Lord. And He buried him in a valley in the land of Moab, opposite Beth Peor; but no one knows his grave to this day. Moses was one hundred and twenty years old when he died. His eyes were not dim nor his natural vigor diminished. And the children of Israel wept for Moses in the plains of Moab thirty days. So the days of weeping and mourning for Moses ended.
Now Joshua the son of Nun was full of the spirit of wisdom, for Moses had laid his hands on him; so the children of Israel heeded him, and did as the Lord had commanded Moses.
But since then there has not arisen in Israel a prophet like Moses, whom the Lord knew face to face, in all the signs and wonders which the Lord sent him to do in the land of Egypt, before Pharaoh, before all his servants, and in all his land, and by all that mighty power and all the great terror which Moses performed in the sight of all Israel. Deuteronomy 34:5-12





JLB

On a slightly similar note,
Jude 1:9 NKJV

Yet Michael the archangel, in contending with the devil, when he disputed about the body of Moses, dared not bring against him a reviling accusation, but said, “The Lord rebuke you!”

Ever wonder where the writer of Jude knew this from? I can't seem to find the claim within the Bible.

 

[Shekinahglory]

Jeff, in some sections of the church people are taught to do the very opposite of what Michael did? Harmless practice or dangerous. I personally feel there is much danger in Christians doing so. Contending with the Devil seems to me to be a one way street. We say things he doesn’t believe all the while speaking his lies that do effect men.Christ always between Satan and me and I must be weak for the Lord to be strong.

 

[JLB]

On a slightly similar note,
Jude 1:9 NKJV

Yet Michael the archangel, in contending with the devil, when he disputed about the body of Moses, dared not bring against him a reviling accusation, but said, “The Lord rebuke you!”

Ever wonder where the writer of Jude knew this from? I can't seem to find the claim within the Bible.

I don’t know.

It may be in The book of Jasher or Enoch.




JLB

 

[daninthelionsden]

Jeff, in some sections of the church people are taught to do the very opposite of what Michael did? Harmless practice or dangerous. I personally feel there is much danger in Christians doing so. Contending with the Devil seems to me to be a one way street. We say things he doesn’t believe all the while speaking his lies that do effect men.Christ always between Satan and me and I must be weak for the Lord to be strong.

I had a dream when I was in my late teens that it was very late at night and I was coming home and entered through the front door of a house we lived in at that time. The internal floor plan differed in the dream from reality in that the door across the living room opened to the hallway, but in the dream it opened to a kitchen. In the dream the door to the kitchen was open. Still standing in the living room I could see the back wall of the kitchen and on that wall was a board with two pegs. On those pegs were two hand towels. First one towel began shaking then the other. I was afraid at first but then became angry. I yelled at the rags to "Stop it!" But they just shook harder. I grew enraged and advanced toward the kitchen to stop those rags myself. As soon as I reached the door, it slammed in my face. It was locked hard. I heard what sounded like dinosaurs fighting on the other side of the door. I stepped back and saw light and shadows coming from under the door as two powerful entities fought it out. Then the noise stopped and no more activity. The door then opened and on the floor under the pegs were bits and pieces of torn rags. I awoke. I have always felt the Lord told me not to directly fight the Liar of all liars, but said "Stay back! I got this son."

 

[Shekinahglory]

Dan, I believe you are right. Maybe the locked Door was the Lord. The Lord told Peter not to follow him that night but he did and got in the door and a young girl terrorized him by saying you belong to Him. First of three denials. We just don’t know all the time and can only try to honor and glorify our God. Sure sounds like you do in the posts I read I enjoy and pick things up. Thanks BTW that was a dream I would have woke both my husband and me. Wow!

 

[for_his_glory]

On a slightly similar note,
Jude 1:9 NKJV

Yet Michael the archangel, in contending with the devil, when he disputed about the body of Moses, dared not bring against him a reviling accusation, but said, “The Lord rebuke you!”

Ever wonder where the writer of Jude knew this from? I can't seem to find the claim within the Bible.

Jude did quote things from the Book of Enoch as this could have been reference from that, or possibly from The Assumption of Moses. Some also say it's a cross reference to Deuteronomy 34:5 or Zechariah 3:1, 2.